Who Owns Alexander the Great? It’s a Diplomatic Minefield.North Macedonia has claimed historical figures as part of a drive to build a national identity. That has ruffled the feathers of the Balkan nation’s neighbors.

The New York Times ^ | 19th June 2024 | Andrew higgins

[Cronos]

She said she was particularly eager to get rid of a big rendering of Czar Samuil, a 10th-century Bulgarian king. The statue, which faces Alexander, is not only ugly and obstructs the view, she said, but also “really annoys Bulgarians.”

She is not a big fan of Alexander the Great either. “I don’t feel connected to him at all. Not linguistically, not culturally, not emotionally.”

[Jonty30]

Where was he born, relative to modern day Macedonia?

That’s who owns his history.

[Cronos]

[Leaning Right]

This doesn’t make any sense. Why are they fussing over a candy?

Oh, it’s Great, not Grape, in the article. Never mind.

[imabadboy99]

So is this like when white liberals and blacks claim that white historical figures - like Hannibal or Cleopatra - were black?

[Cronos]

Alex was born in Pella which is in Greece

However he was ethnically Greek - his family was from Greece proper and they ruled over a mixed-"race" empire of Greeks and Dacians/Thracians

He was not Slavic like the majority of people in North Macedonia - the Slavs came in the 6th century with the collapse of the Avar Khaganate (Avars were Mongol-ic people) and the Graeco-Romans moved south, depopulating the lands

It would be like the English claiming King Arthur (a Briton ruler who fought against the Anglo-Saxons) as their own

[Cronos]

like Hannibal or Cleopatra - were black?

Yup and it's even more egregious for the case of Hannibal - he wasn't black OR white - but of Canaanite origin, so brown Lebanese!

Cleo was a pure Macedonian Greek with perhaps at best some Persian genes from her great-great-great-grandmother, a daughter of Seleucus the Great and a Persian noble woman

Though the way that family had full-brothers marrying full-sisters means that their gene pool was VERY concentrated

[Jonty30]

Thank you for that.
If he’s Greek, that’s who should be celebrating his history.
I agree with you in principle, that if a person doesn’t have anything to do with your history than you shouldn’t be building statues in their honour.

[Cronos]

Hannibal wasn't white either

He probably looked like one of these Lebanese lads

[Cronos]

"Blacks" in the USA have enough American heroes of their own

And if they want to go back in history, why not hold REAL sub-Saharan black skinned heroes?

Like

Pharaoh Shabaka of the 25th dynasty - the Nubians who conquered Egypt and restored much of its cultural heritage after the Assyrian conquest

King Mansa Musa of the Mali empire

Or the great Ethiopian rulers like Yekuno Amlak

or the way that Christianity was preserved in Nubia and sudan until the 12th century when it was snuffed out by the Mohammedans --> I strongly recommend The Faras gallery at the National museum in Warsaw, Poland

[Cronos]

Actually I’m not saying “ if a person doesn’t have anything to do with your history than you shouldn’t be building statues in their honour.”

Alex ruled over a kingdom that once held part of what is now Northern Macedonia and he’s kind of well-known, so it makes sense to celebrate him.

however Northern Macedonia is looking for a past, kind of like Slovakia — FYROM is actually Bulgarian in ethnicity and language and was cut off by the creation of Yugoslavia.

It has no self-identity yet.

kind of like Moldova which is part of Bessarabia.

Slovakia is similar, though not the same - they were dominated by Magyars, Czechs and Poles for centuries culturally and in the case of Magyars politically that they have not had a chance to develop their own high culture and they have no past to harken back to.

The Ukrainians aren’t in the same boat as they can point back to Kyivan Rus and to the Hetmanate

[DesertRhino]

Tell me your nation hasn’t done anything relevant in the last 5t00 years without telling me. lol

[katana]

His father, Philip II of Macedon’s tomb was discovered undisturbed near Verginia, Greece, north of Thessaloniki, and is the site of a small excavation museum, built within the tomb mound itself. The best exhibit of an historic site I’ve ever seen. They recovered hundreds of artifacts, including the full armor he was buried in, shorter grieves on one side for his game leg. All beautifully displayed.

[Seruzawa]

Oh great. Something else for the Balkans people to fight over. Awesome.

[Joe 6-pack]

In an everchanging world, it’s good to know the people of the Balkans are still willing to go to war with each other over disputes dating back three centuries before Christ.

[Seruzawa]

All slavers.

[Dr. Sivana]

The problem, though, is that most of the history on display is claimed by other countries. Present-day North Macedonia, has no real connection to Alexander the Great, who lived 2,000 years ago down the road in what is now Greece

Kinda like the Cleveland Browns.

[Salman]

Alexander was born in what is now their territory. But he wasn't descended from Bulgarian settlers like the current inhabitants (who have lived there over a thousand years).

Not original Greeks, see?

So the Christianized Turks who inhabit modern Greece are pissed off at them for even claiming to be Macedonian.

[Dr. Sivana]

In an everchanging world, it’s good to know the people of the Balkans are still willing to go to war with each other over disputes dating back three centuries before Christ.

PG Wodehouse rarely made his writing poltically topical. When he had Bertie Wooster request that Jeeves summarize the news, Jeeves

“How's the weather, Jeeves?” “Exceptionally clement, sir.” “Anything in the papers?” “Some slight friction threatening in the Balkans, sir. Otherwise, nothing.

Wodehouse knew that the description would always be current and would signify nothing.

[thesligoduffyflynns]

The Kalash peoples of Kalash Valleys Chitral Pakistan are unique to Pakistan and their genetic heritage. Its always been rumored Alexander the Great & his army( s) had ventured into asfar as this area. A group of very peaceful with their ownculture and customs far removed from Islam.

Over the years they have suffered as the result of many campaigns to convert them to Islam. Some did turn and many are unhappy about it.The use of broadcasting the daily call to prayer and propaganda has had a mental impact on this small population of almost 4,000 people &