Astronomers shocked to 'discover the impossible' from James Webb Space Telescope images: 'I nearly spit out my coffee'

The Blaze ^ | February 23, 2023 | Carlos Garcia

[BradyLS]

I guess it really makes no difference whether they do or don’t. Just that “13 billion light years” leaves a lot of room for error in what you’re seeing at such distances (whatever distance it really is), IMHO.

[Captain Compassion]

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded. Terry Pratchett

[Twotone]

My sweetie, who passed away last year, loved Terry Pratchett. I’ve been reading the books by Terry he collected. Very funny.

[chiller]

one light year is 5.8 trillion miles. 13 billion light years is far too distant to glean any accurate info, inmyveryhumble opinion, no matter the capabilities of the Webb telescope.

These scales are impossible to fathom. For example:
A billion seconds ago it was 1992.
A billion minutes ago people who once knew Jesus were alive .

Now let’s talk 5.8 trillion miles X 13 billion( light years.) Damn, Webb must be pretty good.

[Jim Noble]

Actual climatology used to be a science, and a seriously interesting one (ice ages and all that).

Ruined, like a lot of science, by Federal money.

[norwaypinesavage]

To me, there’s a lot wrong with the current beliefs about the Big Bang Theory.

The “end” just happens to be at the point where our telescopes can see no farther.

The “end” looks similar no matter which direction we look, but we “couldn’t possibly be in the exact middle.

The theory requires a period of ‘Inflation’ at the beginning where the laws of physics and gravity are violated (mass disburses faster than the speed of light).

Everything before the Big Bang is unknown, but there is no God. A simple: “Let there be light.” certainly would simplify the theory.

[Telepathic Intruder]

This has nothing to do with the Big Bang theory. The universe is expanding; we have direct observational evidence of that. All this means is that the early period of the universe, which we are just seeing now, might not match our theories.

[cgbg]

The Big Bang theory and the early history of the universe are tied together at the hip.

The universe expansion could have many other explanations—up to now scientists have chosen to reject them—now they will be forced to take a second look at other possibilities.

If I had to take a wild guess it would be that the universe it itself in a closed loop—and there was no “beginning”—and the expansion is just the current phase of the loop.

This would obviously be difficult to see unless you look far enough back in time and found out there was no “beginning” when you saw some past point where was a contraction before the expansion.

[Telepathic Intruder]

A cyclical universe has always been a possibility: one that expands and contracts again infinite times. But it must contract to a point where baryonic matter is crushed out of existence and reformed again with the next expansion, or all the hydrogen that powers stars would be used up in a few trillion years. And there would be no cosmic microwave background.

To me, the standard model of cosmology, that it's a one-shot event, seems too simplistic. So does a single cyclical one. Maybe the observable universe is only one small part of a much larger one where some parts are still condensed, and others are expanding like ours. And other parts are doing wildly different things. We can't really know without looking.

[cgbg]

I think at the end of the “puzzle” we will find out the universe violates all physical “laws” and is therefore “impossible”.

Then “science” is going to get really interesting.

It is a homo sapiens thing to try to fit everything into neat little boxes—the universe may not play by our rules....

[SunkenCiv]

[snip] "We just discovered the impossible. Impossibly early, impossibly massive galaxies." [/snip]

---

---

· List topics · post a topic · subscribe · Google ·

---

[SunkenCiv]

The rest of the Halton Arp keyword, sorted:

• Scientists Discover Unprecedented 'Runaway' Black Hole [02/23/2023]
• 'Runaway' black hole the size of 20 million suns found speeding through space with a trail of newborn stars behind it [02/22/2023]
• "Runaway'" black hole the size of 20 million suns found speeding through space with a trail of newborn stars behind it [02/22/2023]
• A Monster Black Hole Just Just Flipped Its Entire Magnetic Field [02/10/2023]
• Astrophysicists make observations consistent with the predictions of an alternative theory of gravity [10/28/2022]
• IXPE (Imaging X-ray Polarimetry Explorer) Measures Exploded Star Remains [10/21/2022]
• SCIENTISTS PUZZLED BECAUSE JAMES WEBB IS SEEING STUFF THAT SHOULDN'T BE THERE. "THE MODELS JUST DON'T PREDICT THIS..." [08/30/2022]
• The Big Bang didn't happen [08/17/2022]
• 'Schrodinger's Galaxy Candidate' Is JWST's Latest Deep Space Puzzle to Solve...It could break our current understanding of the early universe, but there's a catch. [08/08/2022]
• Physics Mystery Solved: Findings Could "Revolutionize" Our Understanding of Distance [07/27/2022]
• The most distant rotating galaxy hails from 13.3 billion years ago. The galaxy started spinning just 500 million years after the Big Bang [07/14/2022]
• Next Week, Webb Will Make History. The Teaser Image Is Already Breaking Our Brains [07/08/2022]
• New discovery about distant galaxies: Stars are heavier than we thought [05/26/2022]
• Astronomy Picture of the Day - The Einstein Cross Gravitational Lens [10/17/2021]
• Two simpatico galaxies hold hands in this gorgeous view of space from Hubble [10/10/2021]
• Largest Rotating Structures in the Universe Discovered -- Fantastic Cosmic Filaments Where Galaxies Are Relatively Just Specs of Dust [06/18/2021]
• A Ginormous Arc of Galaxies Was Just Detected in The Distant Universe [06/18/2021]
• Black Holes Could Get So Humongous, Astronomers Came Up With a New Size Category [01/25/2021]
• Most distant supermassive black hole known to science is detected by astronomers more than 13 BILLION light years from Earth [01/12/2021]
• Are primordial black holes really giant gravitinos? [01/06/2021]
• Astronomy Picture of the Day - Dark Matter in a Simulated Universe [10/25/2020]
• Astronomy Picture of the Day - Arp 78: Peculiar Galaxy in Aries [09/18/2020]
• Hubble Discovery Hints at a Serious Problem With Our Understanding of Dark Matter [09/11/2020]
• Astronomy Picture of the Day - SS 433: Binary Star Micro-Quasar [08/31/2020]
• Andromeda's sphere of influence is much larger than anyone thought [08/29/2020]
• The Most Powerful Gamma Ray Burst Just Corroborated General Relativity Once Again [07/10/2020]
• 4 mysterious objects spotted in deep space are unlike anything ever seen [07/08/2020]
• Breathtaking new map of the X-ray Universe [06/20/2020]
• The Porpoise Galaxy from Hubble [05/10/2020]
• Distant 'quasar tsunamis' are ripping their own galaxies apart [03/25/2020]
• Space-time is swirling around a dead star, proving Einstein right again [01/31/2020]
• UCF researchers discover mechanisms for the cause of the Big Bang [11/02/2019]
• Scientists detect a black hole swallowing a neutron star [08/19/2019]
• Our Galaxy's Supermassive Black Hole Has Emitted a Mysteriously Bright Flare [08/12/2019]
• New Hubble constant measurement adds to mystery of universe's expansion rate [07/16/2019]
• Mysterious 'Bridge' of Radio Waves Between Galaxies Seems to Be Smashing the Laws of Physics... [06/07/2019]
• "The Phantom Universe" -- There's a New 'Unknown' Messing with the Cosmos [03/10/2019]
• Gravitational waves will settle cosmic conundrum [02/17/2019]
• Something Is Not Quite Right In the Universe, Ultraprecise New Measurement Reveals [02/09/2019]
• Birth of Massive Black Holes in the Early Universe Revealed [02/01/2019]
• Astronomers use split images of quasars to produce a new estimate of the Hubble constant [01/22/2019]
• Astronomers find far-flung wind from a black hole in the universe's first light [12/05/2018]
• The stuff falling into this black hole is moving at almost 56,000 miles a second! [09/28/2018]
• Jet from Neutron-Star Merger GW170817 Appeared to Move Four Times Faster than Light [09/13/2018]
• The Universe Is Disappearing, And There's Nothing We Can Do To Stop It [08/18/2018]
• Sprawling galaxy cluster found hiding in plain sight [08/18/2018]
• Supermassive black hole found in tiny galaxy, wowing researchers [08/14/2018]
• The universe is expanding. but astrophysicists aren't sure how fast [08/08/2018]
• Universe's Expansion Rate Is Different Depending on Where You Look [07/17/2018]
• Big Bang, Big Claim: Why This Bold Idea Is Right [04/24/2018]
• Einstein made his share of errors. Here are three of the biggest [03/15/2018]
• Quasars: Brightest Objects in the Universe [02/24/2018]
• For The First Time Ever, Astronomers Have Detected Planets Outside Our Galaxy [02/04/2018]
• Distant Galaxies Challenge Our Understanding of Star Formation [01/22/2018]
• Trio of dead stars upholds a key part of Einstein's theory of gravity [01/13/2018]
• 'Alien Megastructure' Ruled Out for Some of Star's Weird Dimming [10/04/2017]
• 'Alien Megastructure' Star Keeps Getting Stranger [10/05/2016]
• How Can We Save The Sun? [09/25/2016]
• Researchers just found a second 'Dyson Sphere' star - But still no aliens [09/02/2016]
• Tabby's Star: More weirdness [08/11/2016]
• Astronomy Picture of the Day -- Arp 286: Trio in Virgo [07/06/2016]
• 'Alien Megastructure' Star Only Gets More Mysterious [05/22/2016]
• New study supports natural causes, not alien activity, explain mystery star's behavior [05/09/2016]
• Clocking the Extreme Spin of a Monster Black Hole [03/17/2016]
• Astronomy Picture of the Day -- Elliptical M60, Spiral NGC 4647 [01/28/2016]
• Dimming star remains mystery, but it's likely not caused by comets [01/16/2016]
• Astronomy Picture of the Day -- High Energy Andromeda [01/07/2016]
• Astronomy Picture of the Day -- Arp 87: Merging Galaxies from Hubble [12/10/2015]
• Galactic Monster Mystery Revealed in Ancient Universe [Galaxies that shouldn't exist!] [11/19/2015]
• Astronomy Picture of the Day -- Centaurus A [11/19/2015]
• 'Alien Megastructure' Mystery May Soon Be Solved [10/28/2015]
• SETI Institute undertakes search for alien signal from Kepler Star KIC 8462852 [10/24/2015]
• Did Astronomers Find Evidence of an Alien Civilization? Probably Not. But Still Cool. [10/15/2015]
• The strange star that has serious scientists talking about an alien megastructure [10/15/2015]
• Astronomy Picture of the Day -- Arp 159 and NGC 4725 [09/03/2015]
• Astronomy Picture of the Day -- Supernova 1994D and the Unexpected Universe [05/31/2015]
• Two giant black holes might crash into each other in 21 years [05/28/2015]
• NASA's Hubble Finds Giant Halo Around the Andromeda Galaxy [05/09/2015]
• Accelerating universe? Not so fast [04/12/2015]
• Astronomy Picture of the Day -- Voorwerpjes in Space [04/04/2015]
• Astronomy Picture of the Day -- Pillars and Jets in the Pelican Nebula [03/04/2015]
• Black hole 12bn times more massive than sun is discovered [02/28/2015]
• Monster Black Hole Is the Largest and Brightest Ever Found [02/26/2015]
• The Paradoxes That Threaten To Tear Modern Cosmology Apart [01/20/2015]
• Spooky Alignment of Quasars Across Billions of Light-years -- Science Release -- ESO1438 [11/25/2014]
• Not So Far [11/12/2014]
• Astronomy Picture of the Day -- Arp 188 and the Tadpole's Tail [08/24/2014]
• Astronomy Picture of the Day -- No X-rays from SN 2014J [08/16/2014]
• Astronomy Picture of the Day -- A Blue Bridge of Stars between Cluster Galaxies [07/15/2014]
• Astronomy Picture of the Day -- M51: X-Rays from the Whirlpool [07/10/2014]
• Missing Light Crisis: 'Something is Amiss in the Universe' [07/10/2014]
• Astronomy: Planets in chaos. Standard ideas of Planet formation are being demolished [07/08/2014]
• Was Einstein wrong all along? Controversial theory suggests the speed of light is SLOWER... [06/28/2014]
• Astronomy Picture of the Day -- Arp 81: 100 Million Years Later [04/23/2014]
• Astronomy Picture of the Day -- Polar Ring Galaxy NGC 2685 [03/14/2014]
• Closing the 'free will' loophole: Using distant quasars to test Bell's theorem [02/26/2014]
• The Mystery of the North Star: Astronomers baffled to find Polaris is getting BRIGHTER [02/06/2014]
• Big Pic: An Ultramassive Black Hole [01/26/2014]
• Big-bang-defying giant of astronomy passes away (article) [01/02/2014]
• Scientists witness massive gamma-ray burst, don't understand it [11/22/2013]
• Astronomy Picture of the Day -- Arp 94 [10/10/2013]
• Astronomy Picture of the Day -- All the Colors of the Sun [10/02/2013]
• Hubble Finds Source of Magellanic Stream [09/21/2013]
• Astronomy Picture of the Day -- The Colliding Spiral Galaxies of Arp 271 [08/25/2013]
• Astronomy Picture of the Day -- The Magellanic Stream [08/16/2013]
• Astronomy Picture of the Day -- The Porpoise Galaxy from Hubble [06/24/2013]
• Astronomy Picture of the Day -- Grand Spiral Galaxy M81 and Arp's Loop [04/16/2013]
• New Research Shows the Speed of Light is Variable in Real Space [03/25/2013]
• Thirteen little galaxies all in a row: Configuration deviates from the expected... [01/06/2013]
• Astronomy Picture of the Day -- The Einstein Cross Gravitational Lens [01/02/2013]
• Astronomy Picture of the Day -- Plasma Jets from Radio Galaxy Hercules A [12/05/2012]
• MONSTER QUASAR BLAST blows stunned astro boffins' WIGS OFF [11/28/2012]
• Astronomy Picture of the Day -- Arp 188 and the Tadpole's Tail [11/10/2012]
• Astronomy Picture of the Day -- Merging NGC 2623 [10/19/2012]
• Astronomy Picture of the Day -- Elliptical M60, Spiral NGC 4647 [09/15/2012]
• How Big is the Entire Universe? [07/21/2012]
• Hubble spots spiral galaxy that shouldn't exist [07/18/2012]
• Revealed at last: Universe's intergalactic dark matter skeleton [07/07/2012]
• Astronomy Picture of the Day -- The Tidal Tail of NGC 3628 [07/06/2012]
• Sun Is Moving Slower Than Thought [05/14/2012]
• Astronomy Picture of the Day -- Arp 272 [09/22/2011]
• Astronomy Picture of the Day -- A Jet from Galaxy M87 [08/28/2011]
• Astronomers Find Largest, Oldest Mass of Water in Universe [07/22/2011]
• Possibly the most distant object known [07/18/2011]
• Astronomy Picture of the Day -- Arp 78: Peculiar Galaxy in Aries [07/07/2011]
• Integral challenges physics beyond Einstein [06/30/2011]
• Astronomy Picture of the Day -- The Universe Nearby [06/14/2011]
• "Vampire" Stars Found in Heart of Our Galaxy -- A First [06/11/2011]
• 'Blue Stragglers' in the Galactic Bulge (a sign of ETI, as in SETI?) [05/30/2011]
• Astronomy Picture of the Day -- The Mileage of Light [05/28/2011]
• New candidate for most distant object in universe [05/25/2011]
• Hubble Views the Star That Changed the Universe [05/23/2011]
• Doppler effect found even at molecular level -- 169 years after its discovery [05/10/2011]
• Star-Eating Black Hole May Be Producing Universe's Biggest Blast [04/10/2011]
• Astronomers Discover Oldest Ever Galaxy [01/26/2011]
• Hyperfast Star Was Booted from Milky Way [01/19/2011]
• 'Superscope' yields first glimpse of Double Quasar [12/11/2010]
• Have we found the universe that existed before the Big Bang? [11/20/2010]
• Allan Sandage, Astronomer, Dies at 84; Charted Cosmos's Age and Expansion [11/17/2010]
• Scientists witness the apparent birth of a black hole [11/16/2010]
• New *Supernova* Lights Up Leo... [11/07/2010]
• Spectacular spiral galaxies more than 60million light years away [10/30/2010]
• Cool gas answers riddle of galaxy growth (possibly solving the mystery of galactic proportions) [10/13/2010]
• Fate of Universe revealed by galactic lens [08/19/2010]
• Cosmic accelerators discovered in our galaxy by UCLA physicists, Japanese colleague [08/17/2010]
• Spiral galaxies and homopolar motors [07/13/2010]
• Astronomers find cause of "dicky tickers" [06/28/2010]
• Dark energy may not exist in space, scientists claim [06/22/2010]
• Mysterious New Object Discovered in Space [04/19/2010]
• Mysterious radio waves emitted from nearby galaxy [04/14/2010]
• Discovery that quasars don't show time dilation mystifies astronomers [04/12/2010]
• Yearlong Star Eclipse May Help Solve Space Mystery... [01/06/2010]
• Astronomers detect earliest galaxies [01/05/2010]
• Youthful Appearance of Stars Known as Blue Stragglers Explained [12/23/2009]
• Space Explosion Is Farthest Thing Ever Seen (gamma-ray burst about 13 billion light-years away) [04/28/2009]
• A Brief History of Intolerance in Modern Cosmology [01/23/2009]
• Cosmic-ray hot spots puzzle researchers - Proton discovery may cast doubt on dark-matter... [11/29/2008]
• Unknown "Structures" Tugging at Universe, Study Says [ Dark Flow ] [11/07/2008]
• Mysterious Dark Matter Might Actually Glow [11/07/2008]
• No Naked Singularity After Black Hole Collision [10/13/2008]
• High-Speed Crash Makes Hot, 'Sterile' Galaxies [10/12/2008]
• New findings reveal that the shape of the Universe is a Dodecahedron based on Phi [09/28/2008]
• Hubble Finds a Mystery Object (something that astronomers cannot make any sense of) [09/15/2008]
• Amateur astronomer spies gassy "cosmic ghost" ("Hanny's Voorwerp") [08/05/2008]
• Galaxy Zoo's blue mystery (part I) [06/20/2008]
• Predictions, Falsifiability and the Standard Model of Stellar Evolution [05/26/2008]
• is Hoag's Object a Dense Plasma Focus? [05/23/2008]
• Colossal Flare Erupts from EV Lacertae [05/23/2008]
• Mira: The Tale of a Giant Star... with a tail [03/16/2008]
• Rapidly Whirling Black Holes Revealed [01/10/2008]
• Biggest black hole in the cosmos discovered (18 billion suns) [01/10/2008]
• Milky Way could hold hundreds of rogue black holes: study [01/09/2008]
• Caught on tape: Death star galaxy [12/17/2007]
• Have we sealed the universe's fate by looking at it? [11/21/2007]
• Hoard of supermassive black holes found [11/06/2007]
• Orion Gets a Bit Closer [10/22/2007]
• Hubble uncovers truth about distant galaxy [I Zwicky 18] [10/19/2007]
• No Stars Shine in This Dark Galaxy [06/14/2007]
• NASA funds Florida Tech associate professor for extragalactic research [06/12/2007]
• Ancient Star Nearly as Old as the Universe [05/11/2007]
• Biggest stellar explosion detected (bigger than a supernova) [05/08/2007]
• Most Massive Planet [ extrasolar discovery ] [05/06/2007]
• Black Holes Exhale Enormous Gas Cloud [04/20/2007]
• Expanding Uncertainty about the Hubble Constant [02/11/2007]
• The First Triple Quasar [01/15/2007]
• Hubble telescope makes new discovery [11/16/2006]
• General relativity survives gruelling pulsar test -- Einstein at least 99.95 percent right [09/15/2006]
• Astronomers find distant, fluffy planet - dubbed HAT-P-1 [09/14/2006]
• Dark matter 'proof' called into doubt [09/06/2006]
• Big Bang Afterglow Fails An Intergalactic Shadow Test [09/05/2006]
• Big Bang's afterglow fails intergalactic 'shadow' test [09/01/2006]
• Gamma-Ray Burst Leads Scientists to See Supernova in Action [08/31/2006]
• NASA Finds Direct Proof of Dark Matter [08/21/2006]
• ET type IV civilization moves a pulsar from our Galaxy to another [08/21/2006]
• Universe Might be Bigger and Older than Expected [08/07/2006]
• Questioning the Big Bang [08/01/2006]
• Mysterious quasar casts doubt on black holes [07/28/2006]
• What if Black Holes Didn't Exist? [07/23/2006]
• Scientists Question Nature's Fundamental Laws [07/11/2006]
• Enigmatic object baffles supernova team [06/19/2006]
• Crisis In The Cosmos? [10/13/2005]
• New cosmic look may cast doubts on big bang theory [Who Woulda Thunk It] [08/03/2005]
• Astronomical surprise: Massive old galaxies starve to death in the infant universe [03/21/2005]
• Misconceptions about the Big Bang [02/24/2005]
• Can A 'Distant' Quasar Lie Within A Nearby Galaxy? [01/10/2005]
• Most Powerful Eruption in the Universe Discovered [01/06/2005]
• How the Early Universe Got Dusty Remains a Mystery [12/08/2004]
• Brightest supernova in a decade captured by Hubble Space Telescope [09/07/2004]
• Is strange space signal a sign that ET's mother has called back? [09/01/2004]
• Mysterious signals from 1000 light years away [09/01/2004]
• A Stroll Through the Lyman-Alpha Forest! [02/19/2004]
• Chandra Discovers "Rivers Of Gravity" That Define Cosmic Landscape [08/02/2002]
• Is the Universe older than expected? [07/11/2002]

[Nateman]

The early Universe is going to get magnified in our viewing. We see a sphere 13 billion light years in radius that was much smaller at the time it formed. Therefore the image is magnified. Galaxies will look bigger but dimmer than we expected.

[Skwor]

You comment does not explain the arrogance of “scientist” using the word impossible in regards to data the contradicts their own theories.

I could understand such a statement for a natural law but cosmology is hardly a natural law subject!

As as for creation and the Bible, yes it is not detailed (I disagree with your accuracy accusation, it is indeed accurate), the Bible is our Lord’s word to help man live and grow close to Him, to know his will. It is not an instruction manual on how He creates. It gives hints and the Bible has been used to discover the nature of our physical realm scientifically.

Look up Maury Fontaine, his faith in the word of the bible lead him to discover ocean currents we know and use today!

[wita]

I am in agreement with your first unending sentence.

[GingisK]

My comment was not intended to explain that. People who use the Bible do tend to invent what it covers, just like you did with my comment.

[Skwor]

I may have read a bit into your comment. I would hardly consider your comment detailed either though.

As for your accuracy comment, nothing was read into that. You clearly stated the Bible as inaccurate to which I strongly disagree. In terms of literary works the Bible ranks as easily one of the most accurate if not the most accurate for it’s content compared to other writings of antiquity.

The in-accuracy of the bible is a constant lie propagated both willfully and in ignorance

[GingisK]

The Bible IS NOT detailed. Where does it describe molecules, atoms, lightning, index of refraction? Where does it indicate that the sun is a fusion reaction? Does it describe how birds fly? How about the oxygen cycle of blood?

NO! None of it!

The Bible's description of the Creation process is at best allegory. How does one explain the Process to shepherds a few thousand years ago? You can't.

The historical aspect of the Bible is probably pretty accurate with respect to the Jews. It does not, however, include that of anyone else.

[Skwor]

Wow you accuse me of misreading then wildly go off on a tangent about detailed.

I never said it was detailed about science. I said the Bible was accurate with the implication it is on the things it speaks of and it was NOT detailed about those things outside of man’s salvation(implied I was not specific here).

Detailed is not the same thing as accurate! So why is it now you effectively create a strawman and tear it down instead of actually discussing the comment itself?

You brought in the whole point about detailed and accurate, accuse me of misreading your comment and then demonstrate an egregious amount of what you have accused me of.

[GingisK]

You’re the one who brought the Bible into the astronomy lesson.