Evidence of a lost Ancient Civilization at the Serapeum of Saqqara [ch 5, Conclusion]

YouTube ^ | April 16, 2019 | UnchartedX

[SunkenCiv]

In this, the final Chapter of my Serapeum Series, we investigate the evidence for a lost ancient civilization at the Serapeum, take a look at the evidence for renovation and inheritance on the site, and discuss what it all means in the broader context for the story of history and human civilization. In previous episodes, I've been promising conclusions and that I would tell you what I really think about the history of this site - and so I do, and it extends to much of ancient Egypt. Transcript is available on my website.

[Red Badger]

I doubt if they were ‘lost’.

They probably knew exactly where they were...........

[Red Badger]

I have always suspected that the earliest civilization arose on Crete. No real proof but some hints.I have always suspected that the earliest civilization arose on Crete. No real proof but some hints.

So, your suspicions aren't con-Crete?................

[yarddog]

One hint to me is that Crete had been fairly dormant for a long time before Minoan Crete. Yet they still were known as an ancient power. It must have been a really long time ago.

[Red Badger]

IIRC, after the Thera or Santorini eruption, the remnant of the Cretans eventually migrated to what is today southern Israel and became the Philistines, who eventually were absorbed into the Jewish people....................

[SunkenCiv]

I don't know how anyone comes to the conclusion that dynastic Egyptians couldn't do it, since they left behind paintings showing it being done, and obviously have a history of doing it.

[SunkenCiv]

There was no supereruption of Thera.

[SunkenCiv]

?

[yarddog]

I wish someone would eventually decipher linear A and find enough of it to know who the original inhabitants of Crete were.

[SunkenCiv]

Sidebar:

Linguistically, the god's name is a fusion of Osiris and the bull Apis, which by the Greek period might be said to have represented the essence of Egyptian religion. In fact, a cult of this combination god, named Osirapis (or Userhapi, Asar-Hapi), had existed in Egypt prior to the rule of the Ptolemies. Osirapis was basically the ssacred bull of Memphis after its death. According to the hieroglyphic texts which were found on stelae and other objects in the Serapeum at Sakkara, established long before the Greek Period, Apis is called "the life of Osiris, the lord of heaven, Tem {with his horns {in his head." and he is said to "give life, strength, health, to thy nostrils for ever."

Elsewhere from the 18th Dynasty, Osirapis is described as, "the great god, Khent, Amentet, the lord of life forever," Apis and Osiris were joined together by the priests of Memphis, where the attributes of Apis had been made to assume a funeral character and hence recognized as a god of the Underworld. On a monument of the 19th Dynasty, Apis is said to be "the renewed life of Ptah," and in an inscription of the 25th Dynasty he is called the "second Ptah." In the same text we have a mention of the "temple of Asar-Hapi (Osirapis)," and here it is clear that his identity had been merged with that of Osiris. The identification of Apis with Osiris was easy enough, because one of the most common names of Osiris was "Bull of the West". Apis was, in fact, believed to be animated by the soul of Osiris, and to be Osiris incarnate. The appearance of a new Apis was regarded as a new manifestation of Osiris upon earth.

However, the Greeks added to this Egyptian Core a number of Hellenistic deities, including Zeus, Helios, Dionysus, Hades and Asklepius to form Serapis. Eventually, these Hellenistic deities would predominate the god's final form. He then emerged as a supreme god of divine majesty and the sun (Zeus and Helios), fertility (Dionysos) the underworld and afterlife, as well as healing (Hades and Asklepius). However, his attributes regarding the afterlife and fertility were always primary to his nature.

Serapis (Sarapis), the Composite God by Jimmy Dunn writing as Jefferson Monet

[Windflier]

I don't know how anyone comes to the conclusion that dynastic Egyptians couldn't do it, since they left behind paintings showing it being done, and obviously have a history of doing it.

I've never seen any depictions of dynastic Egyptians building megalithic structures. There are also no inscriptions showing them quarrying the megalithic blocks which comprise so many of their monuments.

Same goes for the transport of those blocks. I don't know of a single panel that shows them transporting a fifty ton block of solid granite, do you?

Speaking of granite, tell me what tools the dynastic Egyptians used to cut shape and smooth those multi-ton granite blocks to within a couple thousandths of a degree of perfect flatness? And then polish them to near mirror smoothness? With what tools?

[wildbill]

When you begin to see the videos on Ancient Aliens on some of the commonalities between the technology used in the Sarapheum and other sites such as Puma Punku you may stop being such a skeptic about ancient civilizations. The intaglios simply can’t be done using ancient copper tools by hand, much less the smooth surfaces of granite left there.

Pyramids cover the earth. Why? How? Time to start questioning the common explanation of 3433 Egyptians pulling on ropes to move 2,000,000 huge stones into place every couple of minutes. The math just doesn’t work.

I don’t know the answers but the current explanations don’t work rationally or scientifically for me. Let’s question the stupid “explanations” of experts and give some credit to those who go against the experts and pose new theories for discussion and proving.

I still luv ya, Man.

[SunkenCiv]

Herodotus was closer in time to the problem, and grew up in Halicarnassus, a former Carian area which by his time was largely Greek and under Persian rule. He probably knew some Carian, and I think he records the account of a Carian who visited the Oracle of Delphi (the Pythoness spoke Carian on the occasion, baffling the Greeks present, but the Carian wrote down the words). According to Herodotus, the Carians were a maritime people who served under Minos of Crete, also as colonists and mercenaries for at least one of the Pharaohs of Egypt.

The Histories
by Herodotus
Book I -- Clio
tr by George Rawlinson

Now, of the above nations the Carians are a race who came into the mainland from the islands. In ancient times they were subjects of king Minos, and went by the name of Leleges, dwelling among the isles, and, so far as I have been able to push my inquiries, never liable to give tribute to any man. They served on board the ships of king Minos whenever he required; and thus, as he was a great conqueror and prospered in his wars, the Carians were in his day the most famous by far of all the nations of the earth. They likewise were the inventors of three things, the use of which was borrowed from them by the Greeks; they were the first to fasten crests on helmets and to put devices on shields, and they also invented handles for shields. In the earlier times shields were without handles, and their wearers managed them by the aid of a leathern thong, by which they were slung round the neck and left shoulder. Long after the time of Minos, the Carians were driven from the islands by the Ionians and Dorians, and so settled upon the mainland. The above is the account which the Cretans give of the Carians: the Carians themselves say very differently. They maintain that they are the aboriginal inhabitants of the part of the mainland where they now dwell, and never had any other name than that which they still bear; and in proof of this they show an ancient temple of Carian Jove in the country of the Mylasians, in which the Mysians and Lydians have the right of worshipping, as brother races to the Carians: for Lydus and Mysus, they say, were brothers of Car. These nations, therefore, have the aforesaid right; but such as are of a different race, even though they have come to use the Carian tongue, are excluded from this temple.

The Caunians, in my judgment, are aboriginals; but by their own account they came from Crete. In their language, either they have approximated to the Carians, or the Carians to them -- on this point I cannot speak with certainty. In their customs, however, they differ greatly from the Carians, and not only so, but from all other men. They think it a most honourable practice for friends or persons of the same age, whether they be men, women, or children, to meet together in large companies, for the purpose of drinking wine. Again, on one occasion they determined that they would no longer make use of the foreign temples which had been long established among them, but would worship their own old ancestral gods alone. Then their whole youth took arms, and striking the air with their spears, marched to the Calyndic frontier, declaring that they were driving out the foreign gods.

[yarddog]

Thanks, I have read that before somewhere.

[SunkenCiv]

They didn't spend all their time staring at their phones, typing with their thumbs, for one thing. They had a lot of time, and had a lot of time away from the fields because of their method of agriculture, once a year flood, and large food surplus.

There's a relief from the tomb of Djehutihotep that shows Egyptian laborers pulling a large statue.

One of the Ramses (II I think, his 83 ton statue was restored by Nasser, then moved about ten years ago from outdoor Cairo to the museum) learned of the death of one or more of the many people moving a huge statue of the pharaoh and declared his regret about the death(s).

The alternative is to claim, with no evidence whatsoever, that it must have all been done by someone else even longer ago, and none of their methods or technology has survived or been recorded anywhere. And that gets shaved into bits by Occam's Razor.

[SunkenCiv]

[snip] Diorite is an extremely hard rock, making it difficult to carve and work with. Its hardness, however, also allows it to be worked finely and take a high polish, and to provide a durable finished work.

One comparatively frequent use of diorite was for inscription, as it is easier to carve in relief than in three-dimensional statuary. Perhaps the most famous diorite work extant is the Code of Hammurabi, inscribed upon a 2.23 m (7 ft 4 in) pillar of black diorite. The original can be seen today in Paris' Musee du Louvre. The use of diorite in art was most important among very early Middle Eastern civilizations such as Ancient Egypt, Babylonia, Assyria, and Sumer. It was so valued in early times that the first great Mesopotamian empire -- the Empire of Sargon of Akkad -- listed the taking of diorite as a purpose of military expeditions. [/snip]

Diorite [Wikipedia]

[wildbill]

Well, I’m sorry. I must have misread your recent post on the Serapheum as allowing some doubt about the site being a middle kingdom tomb for Apis bulls because the technology and tools of that era didn’t seem possible to make those smooth surfaces and interior squared spaces in hard granite.

I suppose they could put a lot of workers outside and inside those boxes and use an infinite amount of time between lots of ‘box lunches.”

[Windflier]

The alternative is to claim, with no evidence whatsoever, that it must have all been done by someone else even longer ago, and none of their methods or technology has survived or been recorded anywhere. And that gets shaved into bits by Occam's Razor.

No evidence? I've been saying all along that there's NO evidence that even suggests the dynastic Egyptians built the megalithic structures in that country.

They documented every part of their lives in great detail, but there's nothing about building pyramids, or erecting colossal statues and obelisks. One small graphic of some men pulling a statue of some sort, is about the weakest sauce you could offer.

I asked before, what tools did the dynastic Egyptians use to cut, shape, and smooth the 70 ton granite blocks in the King's Chamber? How did they haul them? How did they lift them into place?

And how did they get a 13 acre building, composed of over six million multi-ton blocks, less than three sixtieths of a degree off true north? We can't do that today.

[SunkenCiv]

Probably here, heh, I've got that snip in a file deep in the hard drive somewhere.

[SunkenCiv]

No evidence? I've been saying all along that there's NO evidence that even suggests the dynastic Egyptians built the megalithic structures in that country.

IOW, you have no evidence for your claim, but you make up for it rejecting evidence for the contrary.

The architect of the Great Pyramid is known, his image is preserved in a statue, and it was excavated from his tomb near the pyramid. By contrast, you have zero evidence that anyone else built any of this stuff.

[SunkenCiv]

The Serapeum is New Kingdom in date, rather than middle kdm. It would still be remarkable if the big boxes had been installed via the pit and sand method used for various tombs -- a pit was excavated, filled with sand, then the sarcophagus pushed out onto the sand, and the sand removed by hand (labor, ropes, ladders) allowing the sarco to settle to the bottom. At that point the sarcophagus was moved into the burial chamber, awaiting the guy or girl to die. If the Serapeum boxes had been dropped in from above in that manner, and then the chambers built over them, it would still be impressive, but it's much more impressive this way.

What Graham Hancock Really Thinks About the Advanced Civilizations of Prehistory | ZEG TV Hidden from the Public | Published on October 5, 2018

Graham Hancock goes around the world explaining his theory of a lost civilization. Looking at Baalbeck's huge stone blocks, Egypt's Giza Pyramids Turkey's Goblekli Tepe, Japans Yonaguni underwater structures and a whole host of other historical sites. After viewing and researching these sites along with other geological evidence he has come to the conclusion the a comet struck Earth 12000 years ago and caused a global reset of an advanced civilization. Was this civilization the famous Atlanteans?