Posted on 03/23/2017 10:22:36 AM PDT by SteveH
hi, wondering what the most economical way to go is for buying bulk contemporary usa silver dollars.
i got quoted a price of $20/silverdollar at a local jewelry store, quantity 100, immediate inventory. apparently a common unit of purchase is a 100 silver dollar bag. i would request the dollars be placed in plastic containers. very important: the plastic containers must not interact with the copper in the coins to produce a green patina. the reason for storage in rolls is to permit easy placement into flat style safety deposit boxes.
should i go with 1, 2, 3, or more bags?
i plan to make separate purchases for gold dollars.
is there still a requirement to notify the IRS for these types of purchases? especially larger gold purchases.
in california, apparently there is a minimum $1500 purchase price to avoid state sales tax.
i bought gold coins in the early 1990s, gradually spending them by the end of that decade. i surprised myself by making out quite well on gold investing (only about 20-30 $20 piece sized krugerrands, but still a confidence builder)
also would it make more sense to place in a safe deposit box? or a home safe? or in an attic? or some combination (eg, all 3)?
Just don't forget to pay the person when they show up with your exercised contract ;)
You can also go to AMPEX and buy 1000 oz silver bars for a few hundred bucks over spot. Expensive vs the above strategy, but hey, you wanted an opinion. Click here.
If not, get peace dollars and junk silver for fun.
Yes buy the recently minted one ounce silver dollars. Pay the premium. The premium is insurance that they are not counterfeit.
To SteveH:
I believe US Mint now distributes silver eagles in 20 coin plastic sleeves. This is how I’ve been spot purchasing these sleeves from internet sellers like AMPEX, govmint, etc. I try to pay about 3-3.5% over spot price including shipping for quantities of 20, one sleeve. The US Mint is always sold out, so I go through distributors. Be picky on price, there are many sellers and watch spot market price. Also, pre-silver eagles, US Dollars are NOT one oz silver. They are ~83% of an oz and 10% copper. That’s why the sometime green patina on older silver coins. From 1986, Silver Eagle Bullion Coins are 99.9 Silver and 1 oz.
I have a pawn shop that I have an agreement with. I buy all gold coins. I sort through what I want and sell the others. I pay 90% of spot +5% for all US gold and spot plus 5% for Krugerrands. I also buy designer purses for wife at 25% max and I bought her a 1 carat GIA VS2 E diamond for $2500. He made some on the diamond, but; my wife was thrilled. I figure I saved 50% or so. She loved the purple print Versace purse I bought her there.
The issue with a COMEX bar is that you shut yourself off from the pricing mechanism of dollar cost averaging. There is also nobody on the planet who would accept a COMEX bar you hold in your hands without an assay which is maybe $150. It is true that you *probably* get the lowest price-over-spot w/a COMEX bar....but that would get eaten on the turn-in assay; and, by exalting the “price over spot” as your highest priority, you lose the dca or buying at multiple price points, over time.
Maybe with a COMEX bar you get Ag for a nickel or a dime per oz less than you’d get 100 oz bars. Buying 100 oz bars 50 cents down (or up) would beat that. The COMEX bars are just not that liquid UNLESS you have delivery receipts into/out of Brinks storage and then you have the storage fees.
The most important principle in metals is: All you have to do is TOUCH them, and you incur immutable, inescapable frictions both at the buy and the sell end of the deal. You can tell me anything you want about SLV, GLD etfs and whatever is allegedly behind them or what they mean. You will NEVER, however, beat the penny spreads and internet-broker commissions trading them electronically. Not even close.
Ex:
Buy 1000 SLV 16.64 + $10 commish (16,650)
Change your mind
Sell 1000 SLV 16.41 + $10 commish +16,431.
Lose $219.
Buy 10 qty 10 oz Ag RCM 100 oz bar (18,200)
Change your mind
Sell 10 qty 10 oz Ag RCM bar (after a mere 1% Ag price drop) +17,000
Lose $1200.
The buy/sell spread of 50 or so cents PER OUNCE (!) is very punitive punitive on a “corpus” of $17.50 or so when you ahve 1000 of those ounces! 3% on generic physical vs .06% on SLV.
So you cannot trade physical economically. Thus, if you buy it, you are buying it “forever”. If you are buying it forever it doesn’t matter that you buy some today, tomorrow, next month. You’re also saying “it won’t get cheaper than today’s price”. The number of times people think that and it turns out wrong is...large.
You really have to watch it, both buying and selling. It's important to know what your silver is worth when you sell it. Otherwise, you'll be ripped off. Coinflation is a real good website to find the value of 40% and 90% silver coins.
Most of my good information about precious metals, I've gotten from Freepers. Almost everyone trying to "sell" you is bad news. If anyone tries to sell you "pirate gold" or "coins that can only increase way beyond their metallic value" is ripping you off. If the deal were so great, why would they let you have them at an "unbelievable price" rather than keeping them or selling them to friends and loved ones?
Someone on this thread gave you the advice of having old silver coins that are 90% silver. That's real good advice. Having a roll or two of forty 90% silver quarters can't hurt. It's what I concluded after investigating this subject. As that poster said, they're easily identifiable, and if you know their value ahead of time, they should always be a good way to get cash or something bartered for them.
Hope that helps. I'm not an expert. This is what I've picked up over the past three years, trying to develop an understanding of coins, money, and precious metals.
Easier to buy a electric scrap melter and make your own molds, especially if you plan on doing this longterm. Or build a jet furnace and buy a crucible.
You do that and you immediately lose “recognizability” which means that a sale implies an assay, which is north of $100 per “blob”. Any of the popular gold coins can be tested using a “Fisch device” which is a simple and inexpensive device that virtually any frequent buyer ought to have.
There is ZERO advantage and plenty of disadvantage to “melting down” recognizable forms of any metal characterized as “bullion”. Melted down, the metal is likely to absorb contaminants and just ends up being less fungible.
I say again, there is no format nor manner in which you can TOUCH metals and not get stuck with at least one and usually TWO “frictions” unless you are a dealer and buying (from a consumer who needs the money) and can charge a buy spread on the sale. It is immutable, inescapable.
“Frictions” can be:
incoming freight or insurance
pay ask vs bid
getting defrauded on (at least) one out of a dozen deals; either getting bogus goods or never getting your goods in the first place.
Need for an assay that you have to pay for
storage fees
transport to/from storage.
There is no transaction possible for the retail bullion buyer where you do not get hit with at least one of these and it easy to get hit with three.
bttt
If you just watch Fox Business, they have a running list for Gold and Silver .. the price goes up and down hourly. Better to find someone you know who can recommend a good broker .. because if you want to get rid of some coins, you will have to go through a broker to get the cash.
Not everybody knows how to deal with gold and silver. Choose someone close to where you live, who has a good track record. Be careful.
‘1921 Morgans are almost considered a joke.’
Can you prove your statement? Give me some sources.
The “California buy $1500. in bullion coins = no sales tax” part is correct. I haven’t been to my local dealer (http://fresnocoin.com/coins-currency-metals/) to check “price-over-spot” lately.
Sure. Go to a cheesy advertisement for “Rare, newly discovered hoard of silver dollars, never before released, get them before they become 100 years old” in a Readers Digest or other mainstream popular magazine.
Google “National Collector’s Mint” and you will find multiple commercials OOOOOOOOOOh we can only release 3441 of these extremely rare SDs at this time.
Every time, you will see a picture of a 1886, 1888, 1890, 1921 Morgan dollar. Those were coined will in excess of 20 MM examples.
Here is the perfect example of the type of ad that makes people buying the most ordinary SDs think they are buying something special.
https://www.ispot.tv/ad/75tv/national-collectors-mint-morgan-silver-dollar.
Oh boy oh boy, those 1886 and 1888 and 1921 Morgans are the hot stuff.
Google “Morgan dollar mintage”
Morgan Dollars
1878-1921 Morgan Silver Dollars
Morgan Dollar Mintage
Although mintages are usually used as an indicator of rarity, for the Morgan Dollar series, mintage figures can sometimes be misleading. The number of surviving Morgan Dollars for certain issues have been impacted by melting, which can make higher mintage dates more scarce, and the dispersal of hoards, which can make low mintage dates more common.
The key date for the series is the 1893-S Morgan Dollar, which had a mintage of 100,000 coins. This represents the lowest mintage for a circulation strike coin and no significant hoards ever surfaced for this issue. As a result it enjoys a significant premium at all grade levels. A secondary key date is the 1889-CC Morgan Dollar, which had a mintage of 350,000. Unlike other low mintage Carson City issues, virtually none of this date was dispersed in the GSA sales.
The highest mintage Morgan Dollars came in 1921, when coins were produced in large quantities at the Philadelphia, Denver, and San Francisco Mints. The highest total occurred at the Philadelphia Mint with 44,690,000 coins produced. >>Across all three facilities there were 86,730,000 Morgan Silver Dollars produced.<<
http://morgandollars.net/morgan-dollar-mintage/
The table below presents the mintage figures for each date and mint mark combination for the Morgan Dollar series. Only circulation strike coins are included.
1878 8TF 749,500
1878 7TF 9,759,300
1878-CC 2,212,000
1878-S 9,774,000
1879 14,806,000
1879-CC 756,000
1879-O 2,887,000
1879-S 9,110,000
1880 12,600,000
1880-CC 591,000
1880-O 5,305,000
1880-S 8,900,000
1881 9,163,000
1881-CC 296,000
1881-O 5,708,000
1881-S 12,760,000
1882 11,100,000
1882-CC 1,133,000
1882-O 6,090,000
1882-S 9,250,000
1883 12,290,000
1883-CC 1,204,000
1883-O 8,725,000
1883-S 6,250,000
1884 14,070,000
1884-CC 1,136,000
1884-O 9,730,000
1884-S 3,200,000
1885 17,787,000
1885-CC 238,000
1885-O 9,185,000
1885-S 1,497,000
1886 19,963,000
1886-O 10,710,000
1886-S 750,000
1887 20,290,000
1887-O 11,550,000
1887-S 1,771,000
1888 19,183,000
1888-O 12,150,000
1888-S 657,000
1889 21,726,000
1889-CC 350,000
1889-O 11,875,000
1889-S 700,000
1890 16,802,000
1890-CC 2,309,041
1890-O 10,701,000
1890-S 8,230,373
1891 8,693,556
1891-CC 1,618,000
1891-O 7,954,529
1891-S 5,296,000
1892 1,036,000
1892-CC 1,352,000
1892-O 2,744,000
1892-S 1,200,000
1893 378,000
1893-CC 677,000
1893-O 300,000
1893-S 100,000
1894 110,000
1894-O 1,723,000
1894-S 1,260,000
1895-O 450,000
1895-S 400,000
1896 9,976,000
1896-O 4,900,000
1896-S 5,000,000
1897 2,822,000
1897-O 4,004,000
1897-S 5,825,000
1898 5,884,000
1898-O 4,440,000
1898-S 4,102,000
1899 330,000
1899-O 12,290,000
1899-S 2,562,000
1900 8,830,000
1900-O 12,590,000
1900-S 3,540,000
1901 6,962,000
1901-O 13,320,000
1901-S 2,284,000
1902 7,994,000
1902-O 8,636,000
1902-S 1,530,000
1903 4,652,000
1903-O 4,450,000
1903-S 1,241,000
1904 2,788,000
1904-O 3,720,000
1904-S 2,304,000
1921 44,690,000
1921-D 20,345,000
1921-S 21,695,000
Those mid 188x-P and especially the 1921 were made in huge numbers.
Go to a coin show. The sheer numbers of silver dollars for sale are.....jaw dropping.
And by the way, most “O” mint marks are NOT rare even though they may seem like it. And all *O* mint marks tend to be in poor condition because the coining machines were all seriously used, taken out of other mints. They are known for being poorly struck and in any event are not rare.
That's why I stay away from the private label bullion coins and bars.
Agree.
I am looking at induction heater coils to melt. Saw graphite crucibles on Banggood for $3 and free shipping.
The premium will always follow the coin on the bulk silver US eagles. So don’t sweat the premium. Now do not pay the premium for “rare coin” because that premium is too hard to determine.
Otherwise pre 65 dimes, quarters and halves.
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