Posted on 03/09/2012 12:54:15 PM PST by unspun
Update:
This update is made simply to point out the problem with Rick Santorum's speech, excerpted below, as many are apparently having difficulty seeing it. I apologize for not making it clearer, earlier.
The problem lays in two sentences:
“And of course we look at the shape of mainline Protestantism in this country and it is a shambles. It is gone from the world of Christianity as I see it.
It was almost an excellent and critically important speech, but then...
(Excerpt) Read more at gulagbound.com ...
Perhaps you don’t know what “Mainline Protestantism” means.
It means organizations such as the Episcopal Church, which has deliberately done such things as anoint a divorced gay minister as Bishop of New Hampshire, and put a liberal woman bishop in charge of the whole outfit.
I was an Episcopalian myself, before I converted to Catholicism many years ago. I take no pleasure in seeing what has been happening to the church I grew up in, which gave me much that I will always be grateful for.
“Mainline” does not include the more vital Protestant churches, such as those usually called Evangelical. Just the ones that were fashionable among the rich social set, which for the most part have incurred the most decay.
“A school of thought may be called “gone from the world of Christianity,” but a school of people with Christians in it, may not be.”
I’m not sure what you are getting at. Certainly there are still some believing Christians who attend Episcopal churches. That makes the believers Christian. Not the Episcopal church. But then, “the Church” is the believers. So while formal organizations may come and go from Christianity, the Church will last until the end.
I grew up Episcopalian. My parents were saved as Episcopalians during the charismatic revival in Colorado in the 70’s. But today, I see no reason to honor the formal organization with the title “Christian”, when it has done it’s utmost to leave the world of Christianity—in my opinion, successfully.
On matters not subject to disputation, Jesus and the Apostles drew pretty clear lines. The Episcopalians stepped over a pretty clear line. OTOH, I’m not going to get into it with Presbyterians over predestination. But then, the Bible does not expressly forbid belief in predestination.
You're right. I left the Presbyterian Church USA 12 years ago because it seemed like the democrat party had taken over the denomination at the highest levels.
“Did that really happen? I knew the UMC folks were way out there, but usually I would not have expected them to be so blatant.”
I went to a PCUSA service where the subject of the sermon was: “Jesus came to the world to bring gay marriage to the world.” Not subtle at all.
Would those deceased mainline Protestants have had to ask that question? Times have changed...
Touché!
Exactly! mainline/mainstream=liberal
He believes it. He said it. At least we know where he stands.
BO made derisive remarks about bitter clingers to guns and religion. He believes it. He said it. At least we know where he stands.
W/r/t Santorum’s comments, Richard John Neuhaus used to make nearly identical comments about the mainline churches. He also wrote disparagingly about the Jesuit order, and Lefty-overrun institutions wherever he found them.
Santorum’s opinion can be best viewed as a conservative’s about liberals, rather than a Catholic’s about protestants.
IMHO Liberal Christianity follows the NYT’s editors more devotedly than it does Jesus Christ. While it may be impolitic to point it out—even in a closed, insular audience—it’s his right.
I don’t think protestants, or anyone, have anything to fear from a Santorum presidency. He’ll have to make that case for himself, however. And, I hope he can. We can all help by demanding that BO explain what he means about the bitter clingers, the teabaggers, etc.
We all have a great deal to fear from another four years of an Obama presidency. So, I hope we’re all prepared to give Santorum the benefit of the doubt.
Go Branson it is the heart of the city and draws crowds of tourists from all over the nation. Most are protestant Maybe Santorum is jealous because the protestants have better gospel music than the Catholics:)
Individual congregations, maybe; but not the national mainline organizations that siphon off the local donations to support heresies and liberation-theological events.
Well fortunately, the Big Christian Himself, Jesus Christ, is quite likely to forgive Catholics (and those who support the Church built on Peter) for this interpretation of faith, just in case it turns out to be wrong ..
Which one? I don't know of any mainline Protestant denomination that is pro-life. I tried to find one 12 years ago when I left the Presbyterian Church USA. The PCUSA not only is pro-choice, but they gives abortion coverage to pastors and their families.
Arrgh...
I know that the UMC, PC-USA, and many of the Anglican and Episcopalian (who can ever forget "Bishop" Spong) are apostate ... but throwing the Bible on the ground and scoffing at it, or stating that "Jesus came to the world to bring gay marriage to the world" - that is 'Jesus came into the world not to save sinners but to celebrate sin'... is enough to make a skunk vomit.
I know we were warned, but there seems to be a plague of wolves dressed in sheep clothing in this land...
I agree with you. Santorum was surely referring to the liberal pro-abortion marriage-destroying mainline Protestants. He was not talking about conservative evangelicals who strong support him and his conservative pro-life views,
Unfortunately, Catholics don't support Santorum, he has lost them in every primary, and for reelection in 2006, he only won 39% of the Catholic vote.
I think you meant to reply to a different post. You didn’t quote me.
What you quoted from my post was what I was quoting from silverleaf in post 70.
—Well fortunately, the Big Christian Himself, Jesus Christ,—
Not to pick nits, but Jesus is not a Christian. He is the “object” of Christianity.
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