Posted on 09/07/2003 6:36:06 PM PDT by nobdysfool
The Christ of Arminianism
The Bible warns us that in the last days in which we live there will be many false Christs-those who claim to be Christ but who are imposters. Jesus said, "Take heed that no man deceive you. For many shall come in my name, saying I am Christ; and shall deceive many." (Matt. 24:4-5). We who profess to be Christians must take heed. We must be very careful that we are not deceived. Our calling is to trust, love, and follow the true Christ and Him only. We may have nothing to do with the false Christs who are so numerous in our day.
We know about the Christ of the cults and other religions. He is a good man, a prophet, the first creation of God, a great spirit, a divine idea, or even a god himself. But he is not true and eternal God. He receives his existence from another who is greater than he. He is not the Christ of the Bible. We are not deceived by this Christ. He is a false Christ.
We know about the Christ of Roman Catholicism. They profess that He is true God. He suffered and died for the forgiveness of sin. He arose again, ascended into heaven, and is coming again. But he is not a complete Savior. The Christ of the Roman Catholics can not save sinners without their own good works and the intercession of priests. He is not the Christ of the Bible. We are not deceived by this Christ. He is a false Christ.
There is, however, another false Christ who is much more dangerous than the Christ of the cults and the Christ of Roman Catholicism. He has deceived people for many years and he continues to deceive millions. This Christ is so dangerous that, if it were not impossible, he would deceive the very elect (Matt. 24:24). He is the Christ of Arminianism.
This false Christ is extremely dangerous because in many ways he appears to be the True Christ. They say that he is true God, equal with the Father and the Holy Spirit. They say that he died on the cross to save sinners. They even say that he saves by his grace alone, without the work of man. This Christ will have nothing to do with the Christ of the cults and the Christ of Roman Catholicism.
But watch out! Be warned! The Christ of Arminianism is not the Christ of the Bible. Do not be fooled!
1. The Christ of Arminianism - loves every individual person in the world and sincerely desires their salvation.
The Christ of the Bible - earnestly loves and desires the salvation of only those whom God has unconditionally chosen to salvation. (Ps. 5:5, Ps. 7:11, Ps. 11:5, Matt. 11:27, John 17:9-10, Acts 2:47, Acts 13:48, Rom. 9:10-13, Rom. 9:21-24, Eph. 1:3-4)
2. The Christ of Arminianism - offers salvation to every sinner and does all in his power to bring them to salvation. His offer and work are often frustrated, for many refuse to come.
The Christ of the Bible - effectually calls to Himself only the elect and sovereignly brings them to salvation. Not one of them will be lost. (Isa. 55:11, John 5:21, John 6:37-40, John 10:25-30, John 17:2, Phil. 2:13)
3. The Christ of Arminianism - can not regenerate and save a sinner who does not first choose Christ with his own "free will." All men have a "free will" by which they can either accept or reject Christ. That "free will" may not be violated by Christ.
The Christ of the Bible - sovereignly regenerates the elect sinner apart from his choice, for without regeneration the spiritually dead sinner can not choose Christ. Faith is not man's contribution to salvation but the gift of Christ which He sovereignly imparts in regeneration. (John 3:3, John 6:44 & 65, John 15:16, Acts 11:18, Rom. 9:16, Eph. 2:1,Eph. 2:8-10, Phil. 1:29, Hebr. 12:2)
4. The Christ of Arminianism - died on the cross for every individual person and thereby made it possible for every person to be saved. His death, apart from the choice of man, was not able to actually save anyone for many for whom he died are lost.
The Christ of the Bible - died for only God's elect people and thereby actually obtained salvation for all those for whom He died. His death was a substitutionary satisfaction which actually took away the guilt of His chosen people. (Luke 19:10, John 10:14-15 & 26, Acts 20:28, Rom. 5:10, Eph. 5:25, Hebr. 9:12, I Peter 3:18)
5. The Christ of Arminianism - loses many whom he has "saved" because they do not continue in faith. Even if he does give them "eternal security," as some say, that security is not based upon his will or work but the choice which the sinner made when he accepted Christ.
The Christ of the Bible - preserves His chosen people so that they can not lose their salvation but persevere in the faith to the very end. He preserves them by the sovereign electing will of God, the power of His death, and the mighty working of His Spirit. (John 5:24, John 10:26-29, Rom. 8:29-30, Rom. 8:35-39, I Peter 1:2-5, Jude 24-25)
As you can see, although the Christ of Arminianism and the Christ of the Bible may at first seem to be the same, they are very different. One is a false Christ. The other is the true Christ. One is weak and helpless. He bows before the sovereign "free will" of man. The other is the reigning Lord Who wills what He pleases and sovereignly accomplishes all that He wills.
If you believe and serve the Christ of Arminianism, you must recognize the fact that you do not serve the Christ of the Bible. You have been deceived! Study the Scriptures and learn of the True Christ. Pray for grace to repent and trust Christ as your sovereign
Has it occurred to you that maybe your observation was wrong? That maybe you're looking for more than what is actually present? You remind me of another Freeper who seems to be somewhat obsessed with certain conspiracies and is convinced that the rest of us are blind because we cannot see what seems so obvious to that particular Freeper. If Satanists were present in this discussion (highly unlikely), it would be obvious to the rest of us in fairly short order. Unlike you, I'm not going to speculate on that, because I know the majority of the posters here. You obviously don't.
Correction, THAT is the most historically and theologically ignorant statement I've seen in awhile.
Where in the world did you get that particular bit of falsehood??? Whoever has been feeding you this stuff is lying to you. If you are implying that we're Nazis, You might want to rethink your position. You're not exactly endearing yourself to anyone with your charges of blasphemy, heresy, etc. You can oppose without all the name-calling. We get the point. All the descriptive terms and adjectives are unnecessary. Ask your questions, state your views, but expect to be engaged in serious and vigorous rebuttal. The Word of God is the final authority here. You will also be asked questions and be expected to defend yourself from scripture, not with name-calling and hurling insults.
I'm not quite sure how you derived a compliment from that, but it was quite unintentional, I assure you.
Have you made your descision yet?
In reality, you're asking the wrong person. Have you seen me post anything like that? There is also such a thing as trying to inject a little humor and levity into things, so we don't get to taking ourselves too seriously. Do you suppose some people were offended by Jeff Foxworthy's "You might be a Redneck if..." jokes? When has it become incumbent on Christians that they must never do anything or say anything or write anything that might in any conceivable, possible way, by even the most unlikely set of circumstances, offend even one person? Since when did giving offense, intentional or unintentional become the "mother of all sins?"
As for the two verses you quoted and how they fit into TULIP, The verses you quoted are concerned with overall conduct, first to God, and then to others. TULIP is dealing with doctrine. As such, they are two different things. Possibly I can explore this more at length later, but I am at work and do not have all my resources available to me here.
I asked one of the few Calvinists who has actually demonstrated a desire for rational, calm conversation. Do you actually think I'll get away without a smart-ass response from the swarm?
The verses you quoted are concerned with overall conduct, first to God, and then to others. TULIP is dealing with doctrine. As such, they are two different things.
Precisely the answer I predicted. What that says to me is that TULIP is an entire belief system that ignores what Jesus said was the greatest commandment.
I think you're reading too much (or not enough, as the case may be) into what I said. TULIP is an explanation of certain defined principles of Christianity. No one is saying that it is the whole of Christianity, except you, by the statement you just made. I'm not saying that to be a smart-ass or to put you down. I'm simply pointing out that you're taking the part and calling it the whole, and then condemning it for not including something else.
I'm not gonna do the search, but yeah, they have.
I think if you were to ask a Calvinist, they would agree that whosoever will, may come. It's just they understand that not everyone will come.
God does not hinder anyone from getting saved.
Well, I never have...it's a major part of it, but there is more...
Exactly. John 3:16-17 do not address the issue of man's ability, only the benefits that are theirs if they do come. The issue of man's ability is also important, but that is not the issue being addressed in these verses.
Herein lies the danger in taking one or two verses and trying to make an all-inclusive doctrine out of it (them). Context, and the whole of scripture must be taken into account.
What about Joshua's household? Did Joshua poll everyone in it to see if they would serve the Lord, or did he decide for them?
That's disgusting webber, knock it off.
I think that's an unfair assertion. The doctrines of TULIP deal with the mechanics of the redemptive process from election through glorification. The doctrine is by no means in conflict with or incompatible with Jesus' words regarding love. These words would apply and are relevant whether you believe in the Calvinist election or the Arminian election. Paul's words are applicable...if we speak with the tongue of angels but have not love, we are just a resounding noise. Certainly it would do us all well to remember this. It's not our doctrine that saves us, it's our faith in the Risen Christ, and that should be manifest in our interaction with each other. Its absence does not necessarily indicate a lack of that faith, but it does show a need for improvement.
That being said, love does not necessarily mean being heavy on the saccarine.
Anyway, I think your assessment of Calvinism in relation to the Lord's commandments is not valid. Making such an assessment of Calvinists would be a different matter, but that goes both ways :)
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