[kawhill]

Read today on this website about abortion. Made me think of this concept and also of the concept of Pergatory. I was taught of these things that some people believe in, in church and school sixty years ago. I don't know for sure.

[Secret Agent Man]

Its fun to see the things they made up being set aside.

Maybe they will start being biblical again.

[kawhill]

I apologize for the ads, I figure they’ve got to try to make money as well.

[ansel12]

This is from 2007?

Wouldn’t there be interesting old threads on this?

[Pontiac]

I did not learn these things in catechism that I recall but I did learn of them from my family.

They certainly were not secrets.

[ProtectOurFreedom]

So what happens to all the babies stuck in limbo for centuries?

[pepsi_junkie]

"NO NEGATION OF BAPTISM" The document stressed that its conclusions should not be interpreted as questioning original sin or "used to negate the necessity of baptism or delay the conferral of the sacrament".

Wrong. That's exactly what it means. Salvation without baptism.

Yet another crucial element of actual Catholicism falls because a narcissistic heretic pope. Malachy was correct in his prediction the Benedict would be the last pope. Francis is an anti-pope.

[ViLaLuz]

A very interesting topic.

What does the Bible say about Limbo?
https://www.gotquestions.org/Limbo-Bible.html

[Petrosius]

Limbo was always theological speculation, not doctrine. The same is true of the present letter. Perhaps the most honest answer is I do not know, only God knows.

[fidelis]

Limbo was never an official teaching of the Church, as The Catholic Encyclopedia, published in the early 1900s, makes clear. But it was a common theological opinion for a good number of years and found it's way into local catechisms. Limbo describes a place where unbaptized children and those unbaptized persons who had reached the age of reason but had not committed mortal sin would go upon their deaths. It is not heaven, yet it is supposed to be a state of complete natural happiness.

As stated above, it was thought to be a place of natural happiness but where one would not enjoy the Beatific vision. It was not imagined as a state of torment, like hell, or temporary suffering for those bound to heaven, but still needing to be purged of their unrepented venial sins and attachments to sinful habits, which is called Purgatory.

As for the fate of unbaptized babies, the 1994 Catechism of the Catholic Church states:

CCC 1261 As regards children who have died without Baptism, the Church can only entrust them to the mercy of God, as she does in her funeral rites for them. Indeed, the great mercy of God who desires that all men should be saved, and Jesus' tenderness toward children which caused him to say: "Let the children come to me, do not hinder them," allow us to hope that there is a way of salvation for children who have died without Baptism. All the more urgent is the Church's call not to prevent little children coming to Christ through the gift of holy Baptism.

For a much more in-depth teaching on this, see the following:

The International Theological Commission: "The Hope of Salvation of Babies Who Die Without Baptism"

[metmom]

From the church that (allegedly) never changes.

[MayflowerMadam]

I thought it said the church buried a bimbo.

My eyes are blurry after removing makeup.

[Old Yeller]

How low can you go.

[MiddleEarth]

Just to be clear, this is from 2007.

[AppyPappy]

I always wanted to meet the guy who took that bong rip and said “Wait, I have an idea”.

[Cronos]

Ok, the two are different topics and both are misunderstood.

First - limbo

limbus infantium was never a dogma/doctrine. Rather it was a simple "we don't know" to the question "what about the unbaptised who die in infancy?". It is never mentioned in the Catechism either

The closest you get to a teaching is THE HOPE OF SALVATION FOR INFANTS WHO DIE WITHOUT BEING BAPTISED* which is a long-winded "we don't know, but we believe in God's mercy"

Second - purgatory -

that is a biblical belief - not in a PLACE, but the final stage of purification called purgatory.

Purgatory, is nevertheless a self-evident concept in scripture.

• Nothing unclean can enter heaven. (Revelation 21:27)
• Jesus himself suggested that there was a possibility of forgiveness of sins "in the next life" (i.e., after death), except for those who blaspheme against the Holy Spirit. (Matthew 12:31-32)
• St. Paul tells us that every man's work will be put to the test; and that, if a righteous man's work fails the test, "He will suffer loss, though he himself will be saved, but only as through fire." (I Corinthians 3:15)
• Judas Maccabeus prayed for those men who had been killed in battle, who had apparently sinned by keeping small gods they had looted during the battle at Jamnia. He and his soldiers "praised the ways of the Lord, the just judge, who reveals what is hidden, and they begged him that this sin might be completely blotted out ... He also took up a collection from all his men, totaling about four pounds of silver, and sent it to Jerusalem to provide for a sin offering. Judas did this noble thing because he believed in the resurrection of the dead. If he had not believed that the dead would be raised, it would have been foolish and useless to pray for them. In his firm and devout conviction that all of God's faithful people would receive a wonderful reward, Judas made provision for a sin offering to set free from their sin those who had died." Since those in heaven do not need forgiveness, and those in hell can't receive it, it only stands to reason he was praying for those who were otherwise righteous but needed to be cleansed of their remaining sin. (II Maccabees 12:38-45)

God says that nothing unclean shall enter heaven in Revelations 21:27. Jesus' sacrifice is what cleans us of the sin

Scripture notes that, on the Day of Judgement (your death) while your efforts in life and devotion to God may give you assurance of heaven with Christ’s blessings, any personal attachments to sin you may have must be purged, first.

(I Corinthians 3:11-15)

For no other foundation can any one lay than that which is laid, which is Jesus Christ. Now if any one builds on the foundation with gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble—each man’s work will become manifest; for the Day will disclose it, because it will be revealed with fire, and the fire will test what sort of work each one has done. If the work which any man has built on the foundation survives, he will receive a reward. If any man’s work is burned up, he will suffer loss, though he himself will be saved, but only as through fire.

Purgatory, contrary to pop culture and poor interpretation, is not a place but a state. A person in this state will be going to heaven. However, to complete their purity, God has them stand on heaven’s front porch, so to speak, to get the last bits of earthly grime off of their souls before entering.

Purgatory is also not a “second chance” in entering heaven. While Catholics believe that prayer may aid someone in the state of purgatory to be cleansed more readily so as to enter heaven soon (a word that does suggest some time goes by in a realm of timeless), such prayer cannot aid a soul found wanting by God and left outside of heaven, where hell is their only option for eternity.

[trebb]

90% of what the Church reached was designed to elevate its priests/Bishops/Popes - they perverted the New Covenant to insinuate themselves between us and Jesus and claimed they were necessary if our souls were to be saved - then had us praying to dead mortal “saints” asking them to intercede for us when Jesus had given us a direct line.