Posted on 03/04/2020 7:44:23 AM PST by Gamecock
People need to know what they are being saved from.
The good news is only good news when the alternative is NOT good.
The fact of the matter is, people are going to hell unless Jesus saves them. Once they know that, then you give them the good news that God provided a way out for them.
You are really confused.
It’s no infringement on ANYONE’S FA rights to tell them something.
Because they are free to say, No thanks, don’t want to hear it.
However, it IS an infringement to someone’s FA rights to tell them they can’t say it.
Solipsism. A billion people, each with their own personal jesus relationship means a billion jesuses.
People need to know what they are being saved from.
The good news is only good news when the alternative is NOT good.
People already know what they are being saved from. It is one of the two inevitable things. Not the tax one. The other one. :)
The bible is pretty darned clear about it, starting in Genesis 3. :)
To believe more than that is to believe the Creator of this Universe, and your Creator. If you would entertain more on this topic my essay page is addressed on my profile page, or I would enjoy discussing this further via freepmail. Have good one today.
No, it does not mean a billion Jesus’s. There is an explanation on my essay site in the current essay posted there.
Do you believe you'll die someday?
I was just trying to show that MormonISM has a little bit MORE to believe in than classical Christianity.
I find they are merely deceived.
They've placed their faith in something as surely as we Christians have.
Of course they'll defend their beliefs just as strongly as us Christians.
It's up to the Holy Spirit to do the mind changing.
It's those times when they are NOT interacting with us that the real work is being accomplished.
There is already that internal doubt that their own writings and teachings produce. All we have to do is to show an alternative.
For instance; for those who have accepted LATER writings than the Bible or are awaiting even MORE revelation from GOD; they have to reconcile 1 Corinthians 1:7 where Paul states:
Therefore you do not lack any spiritual gift as you eagerly wait for our Lord Jesus Christ to be revealed.
We'll get back to this.
We'll also return to this one.
To which 3, of the 43, are you referring?
Acts 1:3
So I see. You have empirical data that proves there is no creator, and everything from the universe (origin of matter and a vast ordered system and DNA) to healings that are contrary to natural laws, to Biblical prophecies, are all naturally explained as excluding any supernatural superintendence, and which can also cause catastrophes, and you thus disallow the possibility of a creator and afterlife. If not, then your position is based on faith, with a degree of evidential warrant, as mine is.
And what in the world are you doing on a pro-God (of the Bible) forum? What is your supreme moral standard?
Now the LDS church teaches it a bit different than Christianity; thus FPROY2222s somewhat skewed understanding and questioning.
"Now, it may be contended that a judgment, with some degree of salvation for all, encourages the sinner to pursue his dark ways. Not so. However generous the judgment, it is measured by our works. Our punishment will be the heavy regret that we might have received a greater reward, a higher kingdom, had our lives conformed more nearly to truth. Such remorse may yield keener pain than physical torture." (Understandable Religion, p. 89)
While Widtsoe is careful not to call a heavenly kingdom "hell", he is nonetheless certain that there will be a keen regret for lost opportunities:
"Humanity will be grouped according to their works in three main divisions: Celestial (like the sun), Telestial (like the moon), Terrestrial (like the earth). Within each group there will be many gradations and divisions, until from the lowest to the highest in all groups there will be a series of gradually ascending glories. There can be no talk of a hell, except for the few 'sons of Perdition,' but undoubtedly the regret for lost opportunities will be keen among those in the lower degrees of glory." (Program of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, p. 226)
Joseph Fielding Smith, on the other hand, considers the tormenting regret experienced in the bottom two heavenly kingdoms and concludes "in that sense it will be hell":
"This earth will become a celestial kingdom when it is sanctified. Those who enter the terrestrial kingdom will have to go to some other sphere which will be prepared for them. Those who enter the telestial kingdom, likewise will have to go to some earth which is prepared for them, and there will be another place which is hell where the devil and those who are punished to go with him will dwell. Of course, those who enter the telestial kingdom, and those who enter the terrestrial kingdom will have the eternal punishment which will come to them in knowing that they might, if they had kept the commandments of the Lord, have returned to his presence as his sons and his daughters. This will be a torment to them, and in that sense it will be hell." (Answers to Gospel Questions, v. 2, p. 210)
This line of thinking is interesting in light of Joseph Smith's following teaching:
"A man is his own tormenter and his own condemner. Hence the saying, They shall go into the lake that burns with fire and brimstone. The torment of disappointment in the mind of man is as exquisite as a lake burning with fire and brimstone" (TPJS, p. 357)
The entry in the Encyclopedia of Mormonism on "Damnation" essentially explains that the bottom two kingdoms of heaven are kingdoms of damnation:
"Just as there are varying degrees and types of salvation, coupled with eternal progression in some areas (D&C 76:96-98; 131:1-4), so are there varying degrees and types of damnation. In LDS doctrine, to be damned means to be stopped, blocked, or limited in one's progress. Individuals are damned whenever they are prevented from reaching their full potential as children of God. Damnation is falling short of what one might have enjoyed if one had received and been faithful to the whole law of the gospel. In this sense, all who do not achieve the highest degree of the Celestial Kingdom are damned, even though they are saved in some degree of glory."
Is this similar to:
A billion people, each with their own ideas about what god(s) is(are) like, means a billion (or none) gods?
Aye; there's the rub; for folks CANNOT 'know' what they are being saved from.
They have to take THAT on 'faith'; too!
This IS?
Then it's a Christian Caucus; where we cannot speak AGAINST anything NON-Christian.
But; since we are allowed to do so; it cannot be a caucus; therefore anyone with a view about god, GOD, gods or random molecular collisions may chime in; right?
Thw whole “damnation” thing is interesting in that “damned” only occurs three times in the bible. Two times it means they will be condemned (strongs 2632), and one means judged (2919).
And condemned means “judged worthy of punishment”.
And that is where the question is begged: What is the punishment? We know it is eternal in duration, but there seems to be disagreement of the condition of the person punished there.
I don’t think it’s being grounded or wearing a dunce cap. I think it’s something else. Maybe capital punishment. And even more permanent.
One needs to ask what is the purpose of “punishment”? Why do we punish our children. Why is anyone “punished”?
I generally accept this definition: inflict a penalty or sanction on (someone) as retribution for an offense, especially a transgression of a legal or moral code.
No.
One Jesus to whom one billion people can relate and grow into the likeness of.
Jesus meets people where they are and takes each one on their own growth path in Him.
Do you really have any understanding of what growing in the likeness of Jesus even means? Because I suspect not.
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