Posted on 07/14/2018 3:34:56 PM PDT by pcottraux
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My first, gut response is that suffering Proves God’s existence.
Details to be worked out.
My lefty ex felt that if there was a god he wouldn’t let children die. I couldn’t contest that.
“My first, gut response is that suffering Proves Gods existence.”
I agree with you. I also feel that there is no such thing as free will when there is no suffering involved.
Suffering led me to God. If everything stayed A-Ok I would have just kept going until I died. Our time here is nothing compared to eternity.
Mankind sinned and was thrown out of the Garden of Eden. You only have to read the first few pages of the Bible to know that.
Alvin Plantinga made a logical philosophical argument that God allowing free will can explain evil.
No.
Suffering proves the existence of sin, rebellion against God.
Our ‘new gods’ (overlords, atheists, elitists) that are so ‘loving and tolerant’ encourage and promote the indoctrination, abuse and death of children.
My unbiblical opinion is if this world was perfect and there was no pain, why would Heaven be needed.
Pain is to let you know you’re alive and let you know you love somebody.
Pardons if that sounds too flippant.
No, it proves Satan’s (Allah’s) existence.
I agree with both of you. If God had not established Law, but Free Will within it, we would never learn anything or be able or inspired to perfect ourselves.
If you see every adverse condition as an opportunity to learn and grow, life goes a lot easier on you than otherwise.
I wonder what Jesus would say about human suffering here on Earth, since He suffered more than most humans will in their entire sniveling, pathetic lifetimes.
Jesus had the benefit of far superior knowledge and understanding; there was only ONE of him, to give the rest of us inspiration and consolation.
But good point, nonetheless.
“God is not your celestial butler.” —Dennis Prager
“Does Suffering in the World Disprove God’s Existence?”
No. This world would not be this world in every natural sense without what are some tragic consequences from aspects of it for not just humans but many forms of life. Earthquakes, floods, tornados, hurricanes, landslides and many other things are part of what makes this world the dynamic place it is. From them, sometimes, many tragedies to humans can occur. Our suffering from such things is not something we see G-d preventing. It happens. I live with the understanding that G-d wants and expects the natural forces of the earth to work as they do, whether sometimes tragic to us or not. Without the natural forces that bring those things this world would not exists as we know it.
Yet what does G-d offer us, in spite of suffering, all suffering. G-d told us to remember that “yea though we walk in the vallye of the shadow of death, He is with us”.
Yes, we may suffer, but that is not a “disconnect” with G-d, it is a part of life, and what G-d says is He can help us through it.
“Suffering” versus G-d is an irrelevant question, that if atheists need an answer to then what they really need is G-d.
That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh His sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust.—Matthew 5:45
God does not return evil for evil; He does not bear grudges, burn with resentment, or plot to get even. Rather, He freely gives even to evil doers while He patiently works toward the completion of His purpose!
This is one of the few New Testament verses that depicts God as commander of nature. Schweizer notes that in Palestine rain was extremely important and beneficial, the hot sun, was less so. He notes that in Greece at this time the burning power of the sun was often a symbol of godly power while the rain was a symbol of godly benevolence. By contrast in wetter and more northern societies, rain is often viewed as unpleasant.
Most scholars feel that in this verse both rain and sun are meant to be positive. The prominent Rabbi Joshua ben Nehemiah had made similar note of rain’s equal treatment of the good and the wicked, and saw it as a sign of God’s benevolence.
Greek philosopher Seneca, writing in the same era as Jesus lived, also has a very similar discussion of how nature aids both the good and the ill.
**Does Suffering in the World Disprove God’s Existence?**
No, it is God’s plan. There is suffering in the Bible, so that is an indicator that we also will suffer.
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