Question: The true presence of Christ in the Eucharist is central to our Catholic faith, and many converts say it was essential to their conversion. If this is so, why is the true presence not mentioned at all in the Nicene or Apostles Creeds? Should it not be added at the end where we state things like our belief in the Communion of Saints, the resurrection of the body and so forth? — Jerry Roventini, via email

Answer: There are many things that are not mentioned in the Nicene Creed. There is no mention of the Ten Commandments or grace; neither are we told what books belong to the New Testament or that we should care for the poor, etc. The creed is not a catechism; it is a statement of certain key doctrines that were disputed at the time of its composition in the fourth century.

The creed was composed in response to debates about the divinity of Jesus Christ and the doctrine of the Holy Trinity. While there are a few concluding statements related to ecclesiology and eschatology, the Nicene Creed remains preeminently a statement of faith in the one God: Father, Son and Holy Spirit. The belief in the true presence of Jesus Christ in the Eucharist was not widely disputed at the time. And to the degree it was, the need to definitively teach on the divinity of Christ was an important foundation in order to establish his true presence in the Eucharist.

In the Sacred Liturgy, many signs and words indicate the Real Presence. The words of the consecration, which are Jesus’ own words, say, “This is my body … my blood.” The priest later says, “Behold the Lamb of God who takes away the sins of the world.” There are also signs of the Real Presence in our reverence of kneeling and genuflecting. And, as Communion is distributed, there is the simple creedal declaration and response: “The body of Christ. Amen.” Therefore, in the wider liturgy of the Mass and devotions such as adoration, the Church proclaims her belief in the True Presence.

While it would not intrinsically hurt to add to the Nicene Creed, one might wonder where it would stop. Further, since the creed is shared by the Catholic and Orthodox Churches, adding to the ancient creed might harm attempts at unity.

Pope Paul VI wrote a longer “Credo of the People of God” which does speak to the Eucharistic presence, but it is too long to recite at Mass.

An excellent book.

Excellent sermons!!

As regards the oft-quoted Mt. 16:18, note the following bishops promise in the profession of faith of Vatican 1:

• Basil of Seleucia, Oratio 25:

'You are Christ, Son of the living God.'...Now Christ called this confession a rock, and he named the one who confessed it 'Peter,' perceiving the appellation which was suitable to the author of this confession. For this is the solemn rock of religion, this the basis of salvation, this the wall of faith and the foundation of truth: 'For no other foundation can anyone lay than that which is laid, which is Christ Jesus.' To whom be glory and power forever. — Oratio XXV.4, M.P.G., Vol. 85, Col. 296-297.

• Bede, Matthaei Evangelium Expositio, 3:

You are Peter and on this rock from which you have taken your name, that is, on myself, I will build my Church, upon that perfection of faith which you confessed I will build my Church by whose society of confession should anyone deviate although in himself he seems to do great things he does not belong to the building of my Church...Metaphorically it is said to him on this rock, that is, the Saviour which you confessed, the Church is to be built, who granted participation to the faithful confessor of his name. — 80Homily 23, M.P.L., Vol. 94, Col. 260. Cited by Karlfried Froehlich, Formen, Footnote #204, p. 156 [unable to verify by me].

• Cassiodorus, Psalm 45.5:

'It will not be moved' is said about the Church to which alone that promise has been given: 'You are Peter and upon this rock I shall build my Church and the gates of Hell shall not prevail against it.' For the Church cannot be moved because it is known to have been founded on that most solid rock, namely, Christ the Lord. — Expositions in the Psalms, Volume 1; Volume 51, Psalm 45.5, p. 455

• Chrysostom (John) [who affirmed Peter was a rock, but here not the rock in Mt. 16:18]:

Therefore He added this, 'And I say unto thee, Thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my Church; that is, on the faith of his confession. — Chrysostom, Homilies on the Gospel of Saint Matthew, Homily LIIl; Philip Schaff, Nicene and Post-Nicene Fathers (http://www.ccel.org/ccel/schaff/npnf110.iii.LII.html)

• Cyril of Alexandria:

When [Peter] wisely and blamelessly confessed his faith to Jesus saying, 'You are Christ, Son of the living God,' Jesus said to divine Peter: 'You are Peter and upon this rock I will build my Church.' Now by the word 'rock', Jesus indicated, I think, the immoveable faith of the disciple.”. — Cyril Commentary on Isaiah 4.2.

• Origen, Commentary on the Gospel of Matthew (Book XII):

“For a rock is every disciple of Christ of whom those drank who drank of the spiritual rock which followed them, 1 Corinthians 10:4 and upon every such rock is built every word of the church, and the polity in accordance with it; for in each of the perfect, who have the combination of words and deeds and thoughts which fill up the blessedness, is the church built by God.'

“For all bear the surname ‘rock’ who are the imitators of Christ, that is, of the spiritual rock which followed those who are being saved, that they may drink from it the spiritual draught. But these bear the surname of rock just as Christ does. But also as members of Christ deriving their surname from Him they are called Christians, and from the rock, Peters.” — Commentary on the Gospel of Matthew (Book XII), sect. 10,11 ( http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/101612.htm)

• Hilary of Potier, On the Trinity (Book II): Thus our one immovable foundation, our one blissful rock of faith, is the confession from Peter's mouth, Thou art the Son of the living God. On it we can base an answer to every objection with which perverted ingenuity or embittered treachery may assail the truth."-- (Hilary of Potier, On the Trinity (Book II), para 23; Philip Schaff, editor, The Nicene & Post Nicene Fathers Series 2, Vol 9.

Rich, we have a record, starting in Acts and continuing through the epistles detailing what the Apostles commanded the churches and what they did - over decades.

Your belief never appears in the biblical record. Not any of the 12 Apostles, who heard Christ’s words, are recorded acting out your belief. Nor did any of the 12 Apostles instruct or teach any church to carry out what you believe.

We do have a record of churches celebrating feasts and the Lord’s Supper - the simple breaking of bread.

AMPU, my beliefs are not based on what Scripture says about the 12 Apostles. They are based on my understanding of what Scripture says about Jesus. Just as your beliefs are. We simply have a different understanding on what Jesus taught about the Eucharist.

May the peace of our Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ, be with you.

"AMPU, my beliefs are not based on what Scripture says about the 12 Apostles. They are based on my understanding of what Scripture says about Jesus.

If you take one piece of Scripture and ignore the rest, you end in error. The Apostles were there, recorded the event, and heard everything else Christ said that was not recorded during three years. Their actions, based on the totality of teaching, enshrined in Sacred, Inspired Scripture, forms The Apostle's Teaching.
You comment means you are rejecting 99% of their teaching, in favor of a brief passage.
It is never wise, as one who claims the name of Christ, to reject all He has inspired.

"Just as your beliefs are. We simply have a different understanding on what Jesus taught about the Eucharist."

No FRiend. My beliefs come from the whole, inspired counsel of God, found in the pages of His Book and not a single passage. Without all He taught us, you cannot "understand" what He taught.
It would appear that you prefer your cherished beliefs, despite everything in opposition, to embracing what HE teaches us. I dearly hope that is not true. Only you know.

Please allow me to rephrase that - my beliefs are not only based on what Scripture says about the 12 Apostles. They are also based on my understanding of what Scripture says about Jesus in the Gospels, Epistles, and Revelation, as well as the Books of the Old Testament.

I do base my beliefs on the whole, inspired counsel of God, found in all of the pages of His Book. I will not go into detail about the formation of my belief on the Eucharist, but it is based on much more than a single passage. It is based on verses from Genesis, Isaiah, Matthew, Mark, Luke, John, Acts, Romans, 1 Corinthians, and several other books of the Bible.

I do cherish my beliefs just as much as you cherish your beliefs. But I also accept that others, such as my Methodist mother and sister, my Baptist and Lutheran cousins, and my daughter who attends a Christian church, can read the same Scripture and come to a different understanding. I do take into consideration opposing statements and test them against Scripture. Some of them do inform and change my thinking.

I take to heart the words of Paul in his first letter to the Corinthians, where he says: “At present I know partially; then I shall know fully, as I am fully known.” 1 Corinthians 13:12.

May the peace of the Lord be with you

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.