Posted on 10/06/2015 10:35:57 AM PDT by envisio
I have read a little and did some research on baptism and if there is a need to get baptized as an adult after being baptized as a child.
I looked for the Church’s standing on it and I looked for scripture written about it. My research left me with the half-baked conclusion, in the eyes of the Lord, one only needs baptized once.
I was baptized as a small child without any realization of what was happening. In the 40 years to follow there were plenty of times I was lost, sinning, doing the devils deeds with the liquor and the drugs and the whores and on all fours in the parkinglot puking only to repeat it again the next day for years in my 20s. I never got into any real trouble; no felonies or violence, just drunken antics of a stupid 20something year old. Of course, as we get older, we settle down and put away our childish behavior to be adults. In no way will my wild youth define my legacy since then.
Recent events have tested my faith and questioned a merciful God. Ultimately those events brought me closer to God, and it was my wife’s wish that I completely give my life to Christ. She did and I am quite sure she is sitting by His side right now, praying that I do the same.
I am a sinner. I have confessed my sins and asked for forgiveness. I have accepted Jesus Christ as my savior. I want to complete it with water. I want to get baptized again, but I don’t want it to be vain. I don’t want to do it for myself as a vain show that’s not necessary just to make me feel better. I want to do it because God wants me to do it.
So, since you folks are far more learned on the teachings of the bible, and FReepdom is unmatched in advice dealing with church and God, my question is… Even if the original baptism was done at a time when I did not know what was happening… Is a second baptism common? Is it vain? Will it make me complete in my transition to being born again? Is it necessary?
Hmm, Ananias was the vehicle the Holy Spirit chose to work thru to heal Paul’s blindness and baptize him, yet the Holy Spirit allowed Ananias to give Paul a false idea of when his sins were forgiven......and not only Paul but millions of Christians who have read or heard Acts for close to 2,000 years. Very interesting belief.
Or, just possibly, what Ananias preached to Paul was true, especially since it is consistent with the rest of the NT and was the faith the Church received from all the Apostles and has been believed for 2,000 years.
If baptism is not for regeneration, can you show me from the Scriptures what is baptism for?
Where does it say in Acts 9 that Paul’s sins were forgiven BEFORE he was baptized??
If baptismal regeneration is a “false gospel”, that would mean every Christian who lived from the first century until the 16th century had a false gospel, including the bishops in the 4th century who fixed the 27 book NT canon.
Isn’t it strange the the Apostles traveled all over the known world teaching and baptizing and their disciples and disciples of their disciples all believed in baptismal regeneration. How did that happen? I thought the Holy Spirit was promised to the Church to lead it to all truth? I thought the gates of hell wouldn’t prevail against the Church?
Now, let’s consider for a minute that historical orthodox Christian belief is true and not a false gospel.
Wouldn’t that mean those that deny baptismal regeneration have the false gospel?
I will go with what the Bible says and Christians have always believed over some 16th century tradition of men any day.
Using that criteria one could impeach most of the scripture in the New Testament.
Fear not, they know what it is....it is when Christ took bread into His hands and said "take and eat of this THIS IS MY BODY"....that is the Eucharist, taught by even Martin Luther and denied by protestants.....sad
You mean like, 'Paul repented'???
Baptizing newborns is not biblical and therefore, unnecessary. Water baptism is a public affirmation of faith in Jesus Christ. There are several verses admonishing people to repent and be baptized, also pray to receive the Holy Spirit. Baptism is only for confessing Christians.
1Pe 3:21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:
Just as we have been telling you...Baptism is an answer...A reaction...It is our response from a good conscience toward God...
Well there you go...Those who believed in baptismal regeneration were not really Christians...They only stole the name...
YOu are ignoring the fact that there WERE Christians outside of your religion that your religion falsely accused of being heretics...
Isn’t it strange the the Apostles traveled all over the known world teaching and baptizing and their disciples and disciples of their disciples all believed in baptismal regeneration. How did that happen?
The apostles neither believed it nor taught it...What they did teach is there were other people teaching damnable heresies tho...Deceivers...Perverters of the scriptures...You remember Paul writing about those??? Those who encouraged the people to call the clergy father...Those who liked to wear long robes and look religious...Those who told their clergy they couldn't get married...You read about those, right???
I thought the Holy Spirit was promised to the Church to lead it to all truth? I thought the gates of hell wouldn’t prevail against the Church?
That's just more proof that the Catholic religion is not the church of the scriptures...
Now, let’s consider for a minute that historical orthodox Christian belief is true and not a false gospel.
Can't do that and believe the bible at the same time...
BINGO!!! Right answer, first post out of the box.
I would add one small thing: the act of being Baptized is indeed a public affirmation of one's commitment to following Jesus Christ.
That public affirmation does not need to be in front of an entire church, or in front of a large group of strangers.
A small group of close friends and family is certainly appropriate.
My wife and I were baptized together in 2002. Our witnesses were our young children, members of the pastoral staff of the church we attended, and some of the folks we knew through our church and which we volunteered our time with. I think the total was somewhere between 15-20 people tops.
Some members of our church keep it small with close family as witnesses, others are baptized at the end of one of our church services in front of @ 2,000 people. It varies widely.
But be sure to coordinate this passage with Saul/Paul's experience recounted in Acts 9:5-6 Saul is converted, professing Christ as Lord; vv. 15-16 Saul is elected to apostleship; vv. 17-18a,b Saul is healed; v. 18c Saul rises up; and v. 18d Saul is baptized.
Just when during Ananias' visit he was filled with the Holy Spirit is not exactly defined (I presume when Ananias laid hands on him, see 9:17), but the fact is that he lived Romans 10:9-10, and was thus saved, which doctrine he later preached.
Baptism did not effect Saul's salvation, only God saving by grace through faith can do that; and that is the crux of the import to the author of this thread. By God's promise in 1 John 1:9 confession, repentance, belief, forgiveness, and cleansing from all unrighteousness occur all in the same instant, with the rite of baptism to follow after when this is the first (and saving) instance of repentant believing confession. The same pattern is reflected in 8:36-38, and in Romans 6:3-6.
Robertson's Word Pictures presents this Acts 22:16 "washing" phenomenon succinctly:
"Be baptized (baptisai). First aorist middle (causative), not passive, Get thyself baptized (Robertson, Grammar, p. 808). Cf. 1 Cor. 10:2. Submit yourself to baptism. So as to apolousai, Get washed off as in 1 Cor. 6:11. It is possible, as in Acts 2:38, to take these words as teaching baptismal remission or salvation by means of baptism, but to do so is in my opinion a complete subversion of Paul’s vivid and picturesque language. As in Rom. 6:4-6 where baptism is the picture of death, burial and resurrection, so here baptism pictures the change that had already taken place when Paul surrendered to Jesus on the way (Acts 22:10). Baptism here pictures the washing away of sins by the blood of Christ."
That is, the ritual washing of the body by immersion is only a symbolic recounting of what has already happened to the blood-washed heart at the moment of repentant exercise of faith to appropriate God's promised instantaneous cleansing from sins (see Heb. 10:22).
Well the Bible is quite clear of the promises that God makes to you in Baptism.
Cleanses you from iniquity, gives you a heart of flesh rather that of stone. Ezekiel 36:25-33
Makes you a disciple of Jesus. Matthew 28:19 (with teaching)
Forgives your sins. Acts 2:38 (With repentance)
Gives you the Holy Spirit. John 3:5, Acts 2:38.
Joins you with the death and resurrection of Jesus. Romans 6:2-5, Colossians 2:12.
Washes the Church and makes her holy. Ephesians 5:25-26
Clothes you in Christ. Galatians 3:27.
Regenerates you. Titus 3:5.
Saves you. 1 Peter 3:21.
And of course, there’s only one baptism. Ephesians 4. Something which the Church has always confessed. “...and I acknowledge one baptism for the remission of sins...”
So the question is then, if someone wants to be baptized a second time, is it that they believe God isn’t faithful on his promises, or is it because God somehow didn’t make them in their baptism, perhaps due to age? I do note that there is no age requirement in any of those verses...
Based on the foregoing, I would say that any “second baptism” is nothing more than getting wet, and could demonstrate a lack of faith in God’s promises.
But, if you believe it’s nothing more than a symbol or a pledge or something (for the reasons stated, I do not), then what’s the harm, since under that belief system, it doesn’t actually DO anything...
From Robertson's Word Pictures:
Acts 9:5
"Lord (kurie). It is open to question if kurie should not here be translated “Sir” as in Act_16:30 and in Mt. 21:29, 21:30; Jn. 5:7, 12:21, 20:15; and should be so in Jn. 9:36. It is hardly likely that at this stage Saul recognized Jesus as Lord, though he does so greet him in Acts 22:10 “What shall I do, Lord?” Saul may have recognized the vision as from God as Cornelius says “Lord” in Acts 10:4. Saul surrendered instantly as Thomas did (Jn. 20:28) and as little Samuel (1 Sam. 3:9). This surrender of the will to Christ was the conversion of Saul. He saw a real Person, the Risen Christ, to whom he surrendered his life. On this point he never wavered for a moment to the end."
In other words, Paul's conversion was so obvious and implicit that it is painful to see someone not perceive what the words demonstrate, especially when it is rehearsed again in chapter 22.
You asked to show one verse where someone was baptized without repenting..........did Paul ever repent?
I could name many more, do you want me to?
An answer? A reaction? Lol, Christians don’t need answers nor reactions. They need salvation.
Baptism doth also now SAVE us.
What does it do Peter??
baptism doth also now SAVE us.
What do you know, historical Christianity is correct.
Other Christians that did not believe in baptismal regeneration??
Ok......do any of these “Christians” have names from the second or third century?
Since you tell us they lived, they must have had names and left writings that we can examine, right??
It may be painful to some, but I want to know what the Scriptures say, not some guy named Robertson.
The Scriptures say Paul did not have sins forgiven before his baptism or else Ananias would not have told him “....be baptized and wash away your sins calling on his name”
What does Mr Wittman teach baptism is for? I look at his web site and it’s impossible to find. Surely there was a reason Jesus commanded the Church to baptize, why??
Can you cite any Scriptures that say baptism is a public affirmation of your following Jesus Christ?
Any?
If “water” baptism is a public affirmation of faith in Jesus Christ, why was the eunuch anxious to be baptized when there was absolutely no public around to witness it. Same with Paul in Acts 22, no public was around to witness his baptism.
The fact is no where in the Bible does it teach that baptism is a public affirmation of faith in Jesus Christ. That is a 16th century novelty.
The Bible teaches and the Church has always believed baptism is for:
Remission of sins
Receiving the Holy Spirit
Placing one into Christ.
One more point, the Bible never uses the term “water baptism”, there is only one baptism so there is no need for an adjective in front of baptism.
Of course he repented...He turned from killing Christians to accepting Jesus as his Lord...
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.