Posted on 07/01/2015 7:13:05 AM PDT by RnMomof7
Recently there has been a surge in prominent Evangelicals calling for unity with Roman Catholicism. In one sense there seems to be strong foundational similarities that would justify these calls to unity. Catholics are baptized in the name of the Trinity. God’s revealed word in the Bible -- setting aside their addition of the Apocryphal books, for argument’s sake -- is foundational to their worldview. Catholics love Christ and believe that he died on the cross and rose again to provide grace for sinners.
Obviously there are theological differences associated with the specific teachings of each one of these perceived similarities, and I do not want to minimize the importance of these differences. But for argument‘s sake, at least on the surface, there is some common ground.
There is also a strong agreement in ethical standards. Both Roman Catholics and Evangelicals ground morality on God’s holy nature as revealed in the law of God. This means that on the hot button moral issues of the day; the murder of the unborn, human sexuality, the sanctity of marriage there is solidarity between Roman Catholic and Evangelical ethics because they are coming from the same source. Again, this seems to justify a call to some sense of unity.
Are these good enough reasons to publically stump for visible unity with Roman Catholics? That question is beyond the scope of this post. But there is a more fundamental question that must be answered first. That question serves as the dividing line between followers of Christ and the world, which separates biblical Christianity from every other worldview; does Rome possess and preach the Gospel of Jesus Christ?
The author of the book of Hebrews in chapter 10 contrasts the gospel with that which is but a shadow of the gospel. He argues:
"And every priest stands daily at his service, offering repeatedly the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins. But when Christ had offered for all time a single sacrifice for sins, he sat down at the right hand of God, waiting from that time until his enemies should be made a footstool for his feet. For by a single offering he has perfected for all time those who are being sanctified." -- Heb 10:11–14
The argument being presented here makes it clear that Christ’s singular sacrifice, his death on the cross, perfects those for whom it is made for. This is the gospel. It is contrasted with the shadow of the gospel in which sacrifices were repeatedly made year after year because though they symbolized the atoning and perfecting sacrifice of Christ, they never themselves perfected those for whom they were made. The gospel of Jesus Christ perfects and any other religious strategies cannot.
This principle is directly applicable to the question of Roman Catholicism and the gospel of God. Roman Catholic worship centers on the mass. The mass is a series of liturgical practices that culminates in the Eucharist which according to paragraph 1068 of the Catholic of the Catholic Church (hereafter CCC) is a divine sacrifice. Paragraph 1367 of CCC calls the Eucharist a “truly propitiatory” sacrifice. This sacrifice is performed repeatedly in the life of a Catholic.
The reason the Eucharist is performed repeatedly is because even though it is claimed to be a propitiatory sacrifice that can make reparation for sins (CCC, 1414), it is a sacrifice that never perfects anyone. According to the Catholic message grace is something that you get from God by performing certain acts. First, God gives you the grace for faith in Jesus (CCC, 2000). Second, when you are baptized God graciously erases the sin of Adam from your record (CCC 1257). From that point on you get more grace by doing things like participating in the sacraments, including the Eucharist. The problem is that when you commit sins, you lose some of the grace you have gained and now need more lest your grace be found wanting at final judgment. This forces the Catholic into a position where they need to return day after day, week after week, and year after year to a priest who serves to repeatedly re-present the same sacrifice which never perfects those for whom it is made, since it only offers grace to cover some sin.
This is not the gospel.
Roman Catholics need the gospel for the same reason we all need it. We are all sinners with such a messed up and low view of how holy holiness really is that we think somehow through our own efforts we can attain it. If we just had enough time and willpower we could somehow have our good deeds outweigh our bad, and this will please God just enough for me to be acceptable to him. This is a satanic lie. A satanic lie that to some degree or another we have all bought into at some point in our life.
But the truth is glorious. God is good and God is holy. He is more good and more holy than we can possibly imagine. God is so good and so holy that anything less than absolute perfection is unacceptable in his presence. It is because of God’s awesome goodness and awesome holiness that in his wisdom he has offered us grace, through faith in Christ. A good and holy sacrifice that absolutely without question completely perfects everyone for whom it is made.
“So you have nothing to add, just a neediness of assaulting Protestants?”
So, in other words, what you were planning backfired on you? Do whatever He tells you.
“If there is something you would like to add to the gracious list Petrosius offered, please do so.”
I didn’t see his list, but he is more than capable of speaking for himself. Why would you mention Petrosius but not have the common courtesy to ping him so he would know you are discussing his list? I’ll do it for you.
“There will be plenty of time to massage egos and spit at people on other threads in other discussions, where you can fulfill your needs.”
Do whatever He tells you. Does that hurt your feelings or something?
“full assent to all dogmatic Church teachings” I guess that’s what I’m asking for as a list, what are all the things in the dogma of the Catholic Church that are required of an adherent to Catholicism for their Salvation? Are there things from the Magisterium or Traditions that are not on the list yet and need to be added?
“Great post. The matter of salvation cannot be reduced to a single Bible verse.”
Yep! That’s what I tried to point out with the “Have you ever asked a Protestant that question?” reference.
“So, in other words, what you were planning backfired on you” is that mindreading and is it what you would say to someone seeking to understand the Catholic way to eternal salvation?
I have seen your method of “sharing the gospel” during your previous discussions.
"Faith with love is the faith of Christians. Without love, it is the faith of demons." -Venerable Bede
Or, as St. Paul said...
(Tagline)
So you have nothing you feel needs to be added to the gracious list from a fellow Catholic?
In my family there are Lutherans, Methodists, Catholics, members of a Christian Church, Baptists, Prebyterians, and members of a megachurch. We all consider ourselves and each other to be Christians.
It’s the “and your household, too” part that’s so interesting. Would you care to share what you think that means?
“So, in other words, what you were planning backfired on you” is that mindreading...
There was the necessary question mark at the end of the sentence.
“and is it what you would say to someone seeking to understand the Catholic way to eternal salvation?”
To someone who was genuinely seeking to understand, no. To someone who routinely posted against truth and facts in order to embrace anti-Catholicism, yes.
So you basically think Paul and Silas were lying to the jailer? Or perhaps they just didn’t want to give him the whole story for having kept them in jail?
Ok. Fair enough. Note, I’m not going to claim this is a complete list of dogmatic teachings but I’d say it’s pretty close. In no particular order one must agree:
1. God is one being in three persons (the Trinity)
2. Jesus died for our sins.
3. Baptism saves you.
4. The Church is Jesus’ Mystical Body.
5. God the Father is the Creator.
5. Jesus is His Son, God the Son.
6. God the Holy Spirit proceeds from the Father and the Son.
7. Jesus rose from the dead and sits at the right hand of the Father.
8. He ascended into heaven.
9. Jesus was born of Mary, a virgin.
10. Mary was and is a perpetual virgin.
11. Mary was conceived without Original Sin and lived a sinless life.
12. Mary was assumed bodily into heaven.
13. The Communion of Saints is real, the connection between all those on earth and all those in Heaven is through Christ.
14. Purgatory is real, and exists to purge all affects of sin from the soul that remain after death (if any)
15. The Eucharist is the Body, Blood, Soul, and Divinity of Jesus Christ.
16. Absolution through the Sacrament of Confession confers real, sanctifying grace.
17. The Sacrament of Matrimony is between one man and one woman only.
18. Contraception, that employs any device or method to thwart the natural result (conception) of the marital act is forbidden.
19. The Sacrament of the Holy Orders enables men and only men, through the power of Jesus Christ (and only His power given to the ministry of the whole Church) to confect bread and wine into the Body and Blood of Jesus Christ, to forgive sins, and to bless sacramental objects such as water, statues and Rosaries.
20. The Sacrament of the Annointing of the Sick confers actual, sanctifying (and sometimes physically healing) grace upon the recipient.
21. The Pope is the Vicar of Christ, His representitive on Earth, and speaks preserved from error when he speaks to the entire Church Universal on matters of faith and morals.
I’ve probably missed some but those are just off the top of my head. Sorry, gotta go!
Later,
The Scripture quote is this: "“Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved - and your household” - Acts 16:31
All I asked --- sincerely, and courteously --is that you share what you understand by the phrase "and your household."
And let's try to aim for a more loving tone in these exchanges. That would exclude what you just did to me.
Did Simon Magus claim he could red minds or was he just a good magician?
It is the gospel of Jesus Christ that builds HIS body ....
There is little sense in wrestling with a pig in the mud. I has taken me a long time to learn that.
The "good Thief" had the same access to the OT scriptures that the apostles had..
The OT saints were saved by believing the promise of the scripture and looking forward to the cross..
Remember that the Old Testament was in effect until Christ died on the cross... so the thief was saved on the promise just like Moses , David and the other OT saints
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.