Roman Catholicism: The One True Church?

Rapture Ready ^ | Stephen Meehan

[Old Yeller]

For years, growing up as a Roman Catholic, we were taught that we were members of the one true church. It was impressed upon us regularly by the parish priest during Mass while giving his homily; by the nuns all throughout my Catholic parochial school years of second through seventh grade.

It was impressed upon us during our preparation to receive for the first time the sacraments of Penance, Communion and Confirmation. And while attending CCD classes all the way through high school. (CCD is the Confraternity of Christian Doctrine, an association established at Rome in 1562 for the purpose of giving religious education, normally designed for children.)

It was an established fact that we understood and we never questioned the validity of it. And to be honest, it was a matter of pride, that we were privileged enough to be members of the correct church, while all others had belonged to something else that didn’t quite measure up to the status of the Roman Catholic Church.

After all, how could it be possible that Roman Catholicism is not the one true church?

Look at what Rome has to offer: It has the priests, the nuns; the bishops; the cardinals; and of course, the Pope. They have the Sacraments; the statues; the holy water; the incense; the Stations of the Cross; the Eucharist - in which Chris supposedly physically manifests Himself into the wafer after the consecration by the priest during the Mass; the Marian apparitions—which appear mainly to Roman Catholics.

And they have the Vatican, where the Vicar of Christ (who they believe is Christ’s representative on earth), governs the faithful and makes infallible proclamations and doctrine. How can this not be the one true church? No other organization on the face of the earth comes close to offering to its flock what Rome provides for its faithful.

But, of course, to be true, one must adhere to what has been established as truth and not teach or practice what is contrary to the truth. We read in Scripture a few passages that declare what is truth and what is not. Jesus proclaimed in John 14:6:

“I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man comes to the Father, but by me.”

[Resettozero]

Two different people made the same monstrous argument.

No, Art. It is you who used those words in that fashion that makes such an accusation against Almighty God, twice.

Yes, I realize that if and when you see the truth regarding Mary and her involvement in the birth of Jesus Christ, you will no longer remain in your present job. You cannot and remain a Roman Catholic.

[Kartographer]

True many will will find he will not know them. Did I not point out that most on this thread fail to follow his commandment by their pride and arrogance in trying to do the first and their total lack of of preforming the second?

Jesus replied: “Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’ This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’ All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.”

Matthew 22:37-40

I hope many of you will find a way to cast out the haltered in your heart for fellow believers no matter who they sing their Psalms. As for me having no such hate in my own heart I now will follow Proverbs 26:4-5.

Not all those who wander are lost.

[Resettozero]

Proverbs 26:4-5 New International Version (NIV)

4 Do not answer a fool according to his folly,
or you yourself will be just like him.
5 Answer a fool according to his folly,
or he will be wise in his own eyes.

Only Roman Catholics are not fools?

[Resettozero]

You cannot (see and know the truth regarding Mary) and remain a Roman Catholic.

[BipolarBob]

Wasn’t Joan of arc burned for witchcraft?

Indeed she was by a Catholic Bishop. She "heard" God talking to her.

[Arthur McGowan]

I am not interested in “arguments” from people who repeat the wicked, brainless, vicious slander that Catholics are moronic enough to worship Mary.

[LurkingSince'98]

You are obviously unschooled on the difference between veneration and worship - hugh difference but obviously lost on our modern protestant brethern due to their being ‘divinely inspired’ to not understand anything Catholic.

Someday you will take the time to look it up and be enlightened - until then ....

For the Greater Glory of God

[Resettozero]

Here's what you posted, twice, in posts 272 and 273:

I see. So according to you, God was going to impregnate Mary with or without her permission.

The Protestant God is a rapist!

Arthur McGowan, your continued credibility with even Roman Catholics is on the line because of these slanderous posts against Almighty God. Possibly more than your credibility. Are you just going to let these statements hang in the ether in hopes no one will remember what you posted? In hopes God won't remember?

Shouldn't you reconsider, repent, and reject your duplicated posts before any more time passes?

Most sincerely,

R2z

[Resettozero]

If it happened it wouldn't be the first time or the second or even the hundredth time....would it?

The bitterness evident in your post makes giving a sincere response difficult but I'll try...

You appear to have forgotten about the many murders committed by Roman Catholics over the centuries. Murders performed in the Name of God. Murders performed in the name of the Roman Catholic church.

[CynicalBear]

>>Someday you will take the time to look it up and be enlightened<<

Well, let's do look up where that word "veneration" comes from.

[http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/venerate]

Veneration - the feeling of a person who venerates; a feeling of awe, respect, etc.; reverence:

Word Origin and History for venerate
1620s, from Latin veneratus, past participle of venerari "to reverence, worship"

I think we've got it!

[CynicalBear]

>>Shouldn't you reconsider, repent, and reject your duplicated posts before any more time passes?<<

Romans 9:20 On the contrary, who are you, O man, who answers back to God? The thing molded will not say to the molder, "Why did you make me like this," will it? 21 Or does not the potter have a right over the clay, to make from the same lump one vessel for honorable use and another for common use?

Isaiah 45:9 "Woe to the one who quarrels with his Maker-- An earthenware vessel among the vessels of earth! Will the clay say to the potter, 'What are you doing?' Or the thing you are making say, 'He has no hands '?

[Arthur McGowan]

I didn’t say anything about God. I made a remark about the Protestant God.

Two different posters made the argument that “God” (i.e., the Protestant God) was determined to impregnate Mary without her consent.

I answered that such a “God” would be a rapist.

These people, and you, are willing to portray “God” as a rapist rather than admit that Mary, by her free will, cooperated in bringing the Word into the world as man.

That monster is not the REAL God, it is, apparently, the Protestant “God.”

[Resettozero]

I didn’t say anything about God. I made a remark about the Protestant God.

Two different posters made the argument that “God” (i.e., the Protestant God) was determined to impregnate Mary without her consent.

I answered that such a “God” would be a rapist.

These people, and you, are willing to portray “God” as a rapist rather than admit that Mary, by her free will, cooperated in bringing the Word into the world as man.

That monster is not the REAL God, it is, apparently, the Protestant “God.”

"These people and R2z..."

Okay then. Guess this breaks it for us, Arthur.

[MHGinTN]

God will not violate someone's free will, even to stop them from plummeting into Hell, and we KNOW that God is love, unconditional love toward usward. Since we do not know the thoughts of Mary's heart prior to Gabriel being sent to her, we really cannot say how it is that God knew Mary would bow her head and say 'thank you, Lord; be it unto me according to God's will.' To raise Mary to a spot where even some would have to come through her to Christ's Kingdom is, well, contradicting the Bible! Jesus said No man cometh unto the Father but by Me.' He didn't say 'but by me and my Mom'. But Mary consented to the mothering, sheltering of an Holy One from God.

God did not force or compel her. And that is the more astonishing, that God would choose a lowly Jewish girl betrothed to a Jewish man in order to cometh in the flesh to this world to save us who are doomed without His Grace and Mercy.

My mother was impregnated by a rape, yet she had such love and fear of the Lord that she brought me forth anyway, as her third child. It is indeed a power pro-life message that Mary chose the rigors of child bearing instead of rejecting the Holy One of God. Any woman or girl pregnant with another living human being should take a lead from Mary's bowed head.

[Kartographer]

I am not talking about one side nor the other I am saying a pox on both house! Both are guilty yet each side points to the other while making the same claim as Pontius Pilate did:“I am innocent of the blood of this just Person. You see to it.”

What strikes me as funny is I haven't identified myself other than saying I am a follower of the Lord Jesus Christ and a firm believer in his birth, death, resurrection and saving grace, yet the Catholics place me as a heathen Protestant and the Protestants treat me as a unholy Papist. That alone tells me that am am doing something right.

[CommerceComet]

Two different posters made the argument that “God” (i.e., the Protestant God) was determined to impregnate Mary without her consent. I answered that such a “God” would be a rapist.

Let's apply your "logic" in a couple of other situation. If God allows someone to develop and die of cancer, obviously against their will, is that God a murderer? What about Paul's conversion? God physically struck him down and overpowered Paul's will to make him do what God wanted. Does that make God a kidnapper and an extortioner? Such accusations would be irresponsible.

The language in Mary's statement is not clear whether she is responding positively to a request from Gabriel or simply acknowledging a superior's command to her. It doesn't really make any difference either way.

If Gabriel came to you and made a "request" from God would you say no? God knew His servant's heart and knew that her desire would be to obey, so the option of saying no isn't a realistic option at all.

God as the sovereign of all creation is perfectly within His rights to tell His servant what she is going to do. Particularly when it results in great blessings to Mary and to the world through her son, Jesus. Quite a monster God would be to have Mary do something for which she would be forever known as blessed.

Other than possibly exercising His rights as sovereign over Mary's will, the actions described have no similarity at all to the vile human crime of rape. All the abominable elements of rape were not present in this case.

[Springfield Reformer]

I didn’t say anything about God. I made a remark about the Protestant God.

So let me get this straight.  According to the CCC, the Muslims worship the same God as the Catholics.  Now the Muslim god Allah is a derivative of a pagan deity that is unlike the God of Abraham in so may ways it makes the head spin, Kismet, Fate, the Unknowable, etc.  Virtually the opposite of the very personal God of Abraham.  The kind of god that would justify lopping the heads off children for refusing to recant their belief in Jesus.

But that version of God is OK, same god as the Catholic God, because the CCC says so, even though a few moments of rational thought would inform us otherwise.  

But the Protestant God, well now that's a really bad being, totally "other" than the Catholic/Muslim god (you are in effect saying) because He actually has and uses His sovereign authority over all His created beings, brings them into being and takes them out without their consent, puts them in good homes, bad homes, makes some of them win the lottery, others can't seem to catch a break, and of their kings He blesses some with great wisdom and others He turns into beast-like creatures for a number of years and then restores them, and in both cases turns their heart like a watercourse, and all this without their consent.  

But with Mary, whose heart He already knew, He tells her this amazingly good thing will definitely happen to her, and she responds with joy, but because it was an unconditional act of the sovereign Creator, which He had every right to do, and even though Mary receives it with great joy, somehow that equates to a refusal to consent, making God evil???  

Honestly, Arthur, I expect this sort of crap from Atheists, not from those who claim to be believers.  At least atheists have an excuse of sorts. They are ontologically challenged with respect to God.  They might actually miss that God as sovereign Creator is righteous in all His deeds with respect to us, whether they involve our consent or not. It is only in respect to a person who has no inherent right to do something to us, a moral peer, that consent enters into the matter.  All humans have that peer relationship.  The law on rape is in the context of that peer relationship we have with each other.  

Think about it.  Do we give God our consent about our time of birth, or time and manner of our death?  No.  But we do require our fellow mortals to not end our life, even with our permission.  If they cross that line, we call it murder.  But when God does it, is it still murder, Arthur?  If God takes a baby home before birth, a stillborn, did God commit an abortion??  God forbid!! I speak as a man.  I hate to even say such things, but this tearing down of God into a moral peer of man is extremely offensive, and deserves a hearty rebuke.  I expect us to disagree on these issues.  I do NOT expect us to have to go into such a horrible way of speaking about God. It makes me ill.

SR

[Resettozero]

What strikes me as funny is I haven't identified myself other than saying I am a follower of the Lord Jesus Christ and a firm believer in his birth, death, resurrection and saving grace, yet the Catholics place me as a heathen Protestant and the Protestants treat me as a unholy Papist. That alone tells me that am am doing something right.

Sorry for any misunderstanding on my part. I'm neither Roman Catholic or Protestant; just a believer in Lord Jesus Christ, and do not know your affiliation or even if you fellowship with a congregation of Christians.

[Religion Moderator]

Discuss the issues all you want, but do not make it personal.

False statements presented as facts are making it personal.