Posted on 12/10/2014 6:32:20 AM PST by marshmallow
"Christian unity" is one of those terms that stir up a whole spectrum of—sometimes emotional—opinions.
On the one hand, we know that Jesus prayed to the Father concerning future believers "that all of them may be one, Father, just as you are in me and I am in you" (John 17:21a, NIV).
On the other hand, charismatics know it is almost pointless to discuss the gifts of the Holy Spirit (1 Cor. 12, 14) with Baptists or most anyone else from a mainline denomination. And Protestants of just about any stripe get riled up when they hear Catholics talking about papal infallibility or their adoration of the Virgin Mary.
It's on this latter point that Rick Warren, senior pastor of Saddleback Church in Lake Forest, California, and successful author, has waded into a hornet's nest of controversy by telling a Catholic News Service interviewer that Protestants and Catholics "have far more in common than what divides us" and that Catholics do not "worship Mary like she's another god."
Regarding Warren's view that Catholics do not worship Mary, Matt Slick, writing on the website of the Christian Apologetics & Research Ministry, goes into great detail with material from Roman Catholic sources that say Mary is "the all holy one," is to be prayed to, worshipped, that she "brings us the gifts of eternal life" and she "made atonement for the sins of man."
If that's not putting her in the place of Christ as a god-like figure to be worshipped, then what is it?
"We believe in Trinity, the Bible, the resurrection, and that salvation is through Jesus Christ. These are the big issues," Warren says. "But the most important thing is if you love Jesus, we're on the same team."
To Warren's point about being on the same team, Slick.....
(Excerpt) Read more at charismanews.com ...
Are you accusing me of blasphemy ? Is that what you really believe, what is in your spirit according to your English comprehension abilities ? Truly, as God is our witness ?
...but not in another sense. The passage goes on with a prophecy about (v.17) "the rest of her children," or "her other offspring," -- in context, her other offspring other than Jesus, the Messiah -- the child the woman had given birth to earlier in Chapter 12. So that makes the woman the Messiah's Mother, not His Bride. She would, in this context, be the Bride of the Holy Spirit. This theme --- the Bride of the Holy Spirit --- returns later in Revelation, with "The Spirit and the Bride say, Come." Mary, the woman who had a child via the overshadowing of the Holy Spirit, is, in that sense, His (the Spirit's)Bride.
(Rev. 12:14, 17)"When the dragon saw that he had been hurled to the earth, he pursued the woman who had given birth to the male child....Then the dragon was enraged at the woman and went off to wage war against the rest of her offspring--those who keep God's commands and hold fast their testimony about Jesus.
As so often happens, it's one of those passages that has overlapping or "reverberating" interpretations, i.e. it is true not just once, but over and over. The meanings are not all identical, but they are kaleidoscopic: same pieces rearranged different ways, reflecting different perspectives.
YES!!
YES!!
Yes?? Then why do Catholics make graven images and bow down to them? It doesn’t say “bow down to them AND serve them” it says “bow down to them OR serve them”. Catholics DO make graven images and they DO bow down to them in direct disobedience of the second commandment.
As for bowing, we have been through this lesson (LINK) many times before: He is talking about bowing in adoration, not bowing in general. Without grasping this, it would be impossible to understand the dozens and dozens of times devout, God-pleasing Jews bow in the OT to holy people (e.g. priests, prophets and kings), to their own kinsmen, to holy places (Jerusalem and the Temple) and holy things (e.g. the Ark of the Covenant.)
Graven image found in a Baptist Church:
It is completely scriptural to refer to God as "my Savior." Inserting "personal" into the phrase adds nothing to it. It is, at best, redundant. I think it is a deliberate marketing campaign to make sales numbers. It isolates it to a personal decision where each individual is their own overseer, totally in charge of what scriptures they admit, what interpretations they allow, and what "being saved" means to them personally. Afterward comes the "make Him The Lord of your life" pleas. Did I mention baptism ? No, where does the argument to make the LORD Jesus Christ one's personal savior emphasize baptism ? It doesn't; it is a multilevel marketing term. Wherever your journey takes you is fine, no membership to a community of baptized believers ? No problem, you keep on truckin'. The Baptist model of "win 'em, wet 'em, and work 'em" is more scriptural but makes for a poor slogan in a soul winning campaign.
One more thing, sola Scriptura does not mean every single word MUST be in Scripture, just that it is taught and proven BY Scripture. So, no, trusting in Jesus Christ as my personal savior is HARDLY a "marketing technique" invented by Billy Graham. He'd probably LOL if he heard that.
If that is true you will confess blessed Mary is the mother of God with us, which testifies to us from Isaiah and Matthew. Do you confess or deny it ?
Of course, since it is falsely presupposed that one needs the assuredly infallible magisterium to correctly know what is of God.
And there's noplace in Leviticus this is even allowed!
Now you switched from Psalm 45 to Revelation 12. The "other offspring" are the descendants of the nation of Israel as the woman represents Israel.
>>She would, in this context, be the Bride of the Holy Spirit.<<
NO, Israel is the bride of the Father and while He did put her away will again take her back. Just like He cammanded Hosea to take his adulterous wife Gomer back God will take Israel back.
Isaiah 54:6 For the LORD hath called thee as a woman forsaken and grieved in spirit, and a wife of youth, when thou wast refused, saith thy God. 7 For a small moment have I forsaken thee; but with great mercies will I gather thee. 8 In a little wrath I hid my face from thee for a moment; but with everlasting kindness will I have mercy on thee, saith the LORD thy Redeemer.
>>Mary, the woman who had a child via the overshadowing of the Holy Spirit, is, in that sense, His (the Spirit's)Bride.<<
Nope, that is made up by the Catholic Church. It's God who calls Israel His wife and while He put her away for a while He takes her back just as He promised He would.
“thow shalt not make any graven images, thou shalt not bow down to them”. Do so at your own peril.
Nothing personal, but your analysis is borderline hysterical nonsense.
If that is true you will confess blessed Mary is the mother of God with us, which testifies to us from Isaiah and Matthew. Do you confess or deny it ?
I never have denied it. Perhaps you need to read others' comments more closely?
borderline?
It is equally destructive to ascribe acts of the adversary to God, don't you think? The question, then, is how one can know the difference.
1 Thessalonians 4:12-17 Douay-Rheims 1899 American Edition (DRA)
12 And we will not have you ignorant, brethren, concerning them that are asleep, that you be not sorrowful, even as others who have no hope. 13 For if we believe that Jesus died, and rose again; even so them who have slept through Jesus, will God bring with him. 14 For this we say unto you in the word of the Lord, that we who are alive, who remain unto the coming of the Lord, shall not prevent them who have slept. 15 For the Lord himself shall come down from heaven with commandment, and with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God: and the dead who are in Christ, shall rise first. 16 Then we who are alive, who are left, shall be taken up together with them in the clouds to meet Christ, into the air, and so shall we be always with the Lord. 17 Wherefore, comfort ye one another with these words.
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Perhaps your seeing-eye dog needs a seeing-eye human to guide him!
Matthew 1:25
And he knew her not till she brought forth her firstborn son: and he called his name JESUS.
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