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Pope Goes The Weasel [Vanity]
mountainmanna.com ^ | October 30, 2014 | Pastor

Posted on 10/30/2014 7:16:19 AM PDT by Keli Kilohana

To The Editor

The Pope has the "That's-Not-What-He-Meant" Czardinal running his slippers off! In the pope's desperation to be relevant, Francis used words about Creation that will hurt Christians for a long time. However. while media outlets concentrate on Francis saying that God is not a magician, I grieve that a pope would dare to say that God is not divine. How can anyone support a pope—or church—that says that God is not divine?

The church’s role as arbiter of so-called scientific thought seems so important to Francis that he is willing to sacrifice the divinity of our Creator in order to glamorize the secular elements of man. Please note similar off the wall comments by Francis on atheism, the economy and homosexuality. The pope proves that when anyone seeks in such a manner to be relevant and open-minded, his or her brain falls out and he or she declares his or her faith is a fraud. If evolution is compatible with creation, then Adam's and Eve's parents were non-human apes. Francis, if we evolved from apes and monkeys, why are there still apes and monkeys?

The assertion from a pope that God is neither divine nor omnipotent is startling. If that assertion is true, then obviously the miracle of the Virgin Birth is also a myth. But what is perhaps most startling to me is that such an admission would be met with blasé acceptance by the Christian world.

It seems the pope is no magician either. His infallibility is a myth.

Pastor Terry K. Hagedorn
Calvary Baptist Church
PO Box 282 Reedsville, WV
Ph. 304-864-3870
MOUNTAIN MANNA, 96.7 FM, Sundays 9:30am
http://mountainmanna.com
"Pointing Mountaineers to Mount Calvary."


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KEYWORDS: magician; pope
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To: NKP_Vet
And Pastor Terry you will burn in hell for calling Jesus a liar when he said “if you don’t my blood and drink my blood my blood you have no life in you”. Amen.


You forgot a verb there my FRiend.

For the record: John 6:53 “Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except ye eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, ye have no life in you.”

Also for the record:
Luke 23:40-43 “And one of the malefactors which were hanged railed on him, saying, If thou be Christ, save thyself and us. But the other answering rebuked him, saying, Dost not thou fear God, seeing thou art in the same condemnation? And we indeed justly; for we receive the due reward of our deeds: but this man hath done nothing amiss. And he said unto Jesus, Lord, remember me when thou comest into thy kingdom. And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, Today shalt thou be with me in paradise.”

Poor guy never did have a chance to get off the cross and go to Mass.

Romans 10:9 “That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.”

61 posted on 10/30/2014 2:34:55 PM PDT by Idaho_Cowboy (Ride for the Brand. Joshua 24:15)
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To: Idaho_Cowboy

“Poor guy never did have a chance to get off the cross and go to Mass”

You’re right but no where did Jesus say he was going to heaven. You assume that. But even if he did and the thief mde it to heaven without being “born again” or baptised, so what? God can do anything he feels like doing and causing the Big Big was one of them.


62 posted on 10/30/2014 2:48:09 PM PDT by NKP_Vet ("PRO FIDE, PRO UTILITATE HOMINUM")
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To: NKP_Vet

You’re right but no where did Jesus say he was going to heaven. You assume that


Is another way to be with Jesus in paradise?


63 posted on 10/30/2014 3:03:23 PM PDT by Idaho_Cowboy (Ride for the Brand. Joshua 24:15)
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To: Idaho_Cowboy

We all know Jesus could and does forgive sinners, as He delegated that power to the Apostles (Mat18:18). He certainly could have forgiven the man on the cross next to Him.

I bet the poor sinner was never baptized either, but all of these things are management decisions, and we are just in sales.

Here is the context of Romans 10:9. Others have said it better, so here it is:

“Thou shalt be saved. To confess the Lord Jesus, and to call upon the name of the Lord, (ver. 13.) is not barely the professing of a belief in the person of Christ: but moreover implies a belief of his whole doctrine, and an obedience to his law; without which the calling of him Lord will save no man. (St. Matthew vii. 21.) (Challoner) -— This passage must be understood like many others of this apostle, of a faith accompanied by a good-will ready to perform what faith says must be practised; as it is required in this very place, that what we believe in the heart, we should confess with our mouth. (Estius)”

Also, demons know that Jesus is Lord and God raised Him from the dead. They have said so. In fact, Jesus commanded them NOT to reveal His divine nature. So, proof texting doesn’t work.


64 posted on 10/30/2014 3:06:36 PM PDT by SpirituTuo
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To: Alex Murphy

But who would be his translator?

So there we go. Right back to square one. lol

That said, this latest kerfuffle does appear to have been caused by faulty translation (as has been explained better on another thread, and as one can see when eyeballing more directly the original Italian language which he spoke) for there is difference between the word demiurge as Bergoglio used the term in Italian, and capital "D" Divine.

That was clarified well enough also when he basically repeated or restated his argument there, pointing at the difference between a creator and the Creator, with Bergoglio saying that God was capital "C" Creator, not just some limited, lower-case creator of the physical world, as some ancient Greco-Roman (or other) philosopher would describe God or 'gods' -- those having powers, but those powers being in some manner circumscribed, or limited.

What this results in, in this context, is having philosophical acceptance for what could be termed --- theistic evolution -- Old Earth Creationism -- Intelligent Design, etc.

I don't see what the problem with that is, although I do understand those of two opposing camps could be reaching down to the ground about now to pick up rocks to hurl at me. Please...everyone...don't take that "go get your own dirt" punchline as a directive, or at least be a bit more gentle in how yous' share it. ;^')

That was my own take on things, from grade school onwards, without having those terms defined for me, or having been exposed to comparative arguments which insisted that there must be an either/or choice, as in acceptance for some amount of validity for ToE (Theory of Evolution) -- or else a woodenly literal "6000 years" of time since Creation of all elements, and/or the earth itself also.

65 posted on 10/30/2014 3:41:25 PM PDT by BlueDragon (don't forget, freepers. turn off the eyetalions...or else everything (textual) will be slanted)
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To: NKP_Vet

I wasn’t reminding you of anything.

I was commenting on your self-righteous condemnation of a Christian pastor to hell just because he doesn’t follow your belief system.

I think God can do that, but men cannot.

So you condemn Pastor Terry to hell because of something you made up? Or do you have a link to where the Pastor called Jesus a liar?

No I don’t think so.

But there is a link to you quoting Jesus as saying “if you don’t my blood and drink my blood my blood you have no life in you.”

Jesus doesn’t like that.

If you are a born again Christian with a personal relationship with Jesus, you can go to Him right now and confess your sin and he will forgive you. Or do you have to wait until you can confess to a priest so that he can forgive you?

Zeal is a good thing if applied properly.


66 posted on 10/30/2014 3:45:08 PM PDT by Syncro (Benghazi-LIES/CoverupIRS-LIES/CoverupDOJ-NO Justice--Etc Marxist Treason IMPEACH!)
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To: SpirituTuo
You choose not to accept Roman Catholicism as the one, true, Church founded by Christ...No I don't because it is not true. The church (made up of every born again Christian that has a personal relationship with Jesus) started when Jesus walked the earth and it was not the Catholic church.

It didn't exist for several centuries after Jesus was around.

the Vicar of Christ, is known as the Supreme Pontiff, or more simply, the Pope (Bishop of Rome).

To you maybe, which is fine if you believe that, but to Christians and Jesus...no Biblical evidence.

Supreme, Vicar? Sounds like mighty fine titles but un Scriptural. Kinda like the Pharisees of old that Jesus had some pretty stern words for. They liked fancy titles and clothes too.

By not accepting His church, your are morally free to ignore the teachings of His church. You are not bound to anything any Pope says.

Thank you, but I am quite aware that it is not "His" church and that I can continue on being a born again Christian with a personal relationship with Jesus.

And even though the Catholic denomination says I have to be a part of it for salvation, I have received Jesus' Biblical salvation and am quite content to believe His words for that.

In short, no Catholic, no problem

A very true statement!

But I will still speak out when Catholicism tries to subvert the church, the true body of Christ.

67 posted on 10/30/2014 3:57:39 PM PDT by Syncro (Benghazi-LIES/CoverupIRS-LIES/CoverupDOJ-NO Justice--Etc Marxist Treason IMPEACH!)
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To: SpirituTuo
Read your unnecessary hyperbole, kind of a waste of keystrokes.

So, how in the world can the Pope force you to do anything?

Why ask that, I never said he could?

As Vicar of Christ, the Pope is responsible to preach the Gospel message.

Then he should stick to that.

Instead of declaring that Islamic Muslims have the same god as Catholics (not true at all) and declaring evolution and Big Bang theory are right and praising homosexuals.

He built the Church on Peter (You are Peter and upon this rock...).

No He didn't, His church is built on the Rock, the Rock that is Jesus.

That's been shown over and over again here on the RF.

Christ calls all people to Himself.

True, very good statement!

We are called to unified in Christ. Therefore, unity is what we should achieve. Unity under the Vicar of Christ.

You were doing so well until that last sentence, but I made it true.

68 posted on 10/30/2014 4:36:19 PM PDT by Syncro (Benghazi-LIES/CoverupIRS-LIES/CoverupDOJ-NO Justice--Etc Marxist Treason IMPEACH!)
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To: NKP_Vet
Wow, another one going to hell?

The thief on the cross?

I'm gobsmacked at seeing that...

God can do anything he feels like doing and causing the Big Big was one of them.

Coffee didn't kick in?

Oh and BTW, the thief was born again on the cross. You didn't notice? You can find it in the NT.

69 posted on 10/30/2014 4:44:05 PM PDT by Syncro (Benghazi-LIES/CoverupIRS-LIES/CoverupDOJ-NO Justice--Etc Marxist Treason IMPEACH!)
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To: Syncro

Who is subversive, the one who follows the Church instituted by Christ at the Last Supper, and has been led by Peter and his successors, or the one who has decided to go their own way?

The “Church,” the universal (catholic) Church, is made of all Christians. All Christians MUST have a personal relationship with Jesus Christ, or there Christianity is hollow.

You choose not to believe the Roman Catholic Church, as that is your right as a human being. Faith is a gift from the Holy Spirit, and as you seek the Truth (not just a what, but a who) and honestly try to live out the Great Commission, who am I to judge?

However, we will have to agree to disagree about what you consider fact, and what is verifiable through the centuries.

I hope and pray you continue to have the zeal for Christ you demonstrate. I also hope and pray you will consider looking at books by Dr. Scott Hahn, Tim Staples, and Jimmy Akin, who, like you, have the fire for Christ, and come from evangelical backgrounds.


70 posted on 10/30/2014 5:42:20 PM PDT by SpirituTuo
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To: NKP_Vet

They just haven’t heard of a Baptism of Desire or a Baptism of Blood.

Or a perfect Act of Contrition.


71 posted on 10/30/2014 5:44:16 PM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: NKP_Vet
100 percent correct but don’t try telling a good ole boy evangelical that God didn’t start it all in 7 days about 4,000 years ago. I guess they think that God was too stupid to have caused the Big Bang millions and millions of years ago, to include animals (people) with no souls, and finally wanted to perfect the world so he created Adam and Eve. They just can’t handle the fact that one person could be that smart.

Really...Really???

Gen 1:26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

Gen 2:7 And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.

So according to you and your pope, Adam evolved from some other life form...Yet when Adam received the breath of life, he became a living soul...Adam's ancestors didn't get the breath of life or they didn't becoming living souls???

Bible doesn't say anything about Adam's mother and father living in the garden of Eden with him...Surely Adam had (not perfectly human) siblings and cousins...What happened to them???

Why did God have to create Eve out of a rib of Adam??? Surely God could have breathed life into one of Adam's female cousins to make her a living soul as well for his mate...(Were all of Adam's ancestors NOT living??? Zombies???)...

Why doesn't your religion write its own version of Genesis to fill in the idiotic, ridiculous gaps that it has created by falling for the evolution scam???

And if your religion wrote the scriptures as you always claim, why did it write a nonsensical book like Genesis which your religion doesn't even believe???

72 posted on 10/30/2014 6:15:56 PM PDT by Iscool
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To: Salvation

You’re right. And what the Pope said on the Big Bang has been the church position for years. When the priest who came up with the theory was asked didn’t it conflict with his beliefs he said “no at all, God causes everything”. Great answer.


73 posted on 10/30/2014 6:17:06 PM PDT by NKP_Vet ("PRO FIDE, PRO UTILITATE HOMINUM")
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To: Idaho_Cowboy
Since the document wasn’t released in English, let’s wait until the official translation comes out.

We're all still waiting for your official translations on all the other things your pope has said which you guys claim is a mistranslation...

74 posted on 10/30/2014 6:17:42 PM PDT by Iscool
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To: Salvation
And take the helmet of salvation and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God.

The verses you quote tell you to use the bible as your weapon against Satan...Yet you guys claim it is Mary that does your fighting for you...Is it any wonder you can't avoid Satan's influence in your religion???

75 posted on 10/30/2014 6:20:58 PM PDT by Iscool
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To: Iscool

“So according to you and your pope, Adam evolved from some other life form...Yet when Adam received the breath of life, he became a living soul...Adam’s ancestors didn’t get the breath of life or they didn’t becoming living souls?”

You are showing your ignorance of Catholicism. God made everything, but we don’t know how many years ago God made the first man, but we do know he didn’t have a soul until Adam and Eve. We also know he made the universe and everything in it, but again don’t know how long ago. But the world as Christians know it started with Adam and Eve.


76 posted on 10/30/2014 6:24:14 PM PDT by NKP_Vet ("PRO FIDE, PRO UTILITATE HOMINUM")
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To: Patriotic1
It appears that you copied that text from somewhere. Can you direct me to it

Here

References for the material are at the bottom of the page...

77 posted on 10/30/2014 6:34:58 PM PDT by Iscool
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To: SpirituTuo
You don’t seem to understand infallibility, so here is what it means (From the Catechism of the Catholic Church) http://www.vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive/catechism/p123a9p4.htm:

I think we all understand Catholic infallibility...We just don't buy it...

78 posted on 10/30/2014 6:39:38 PM PDT by Iscool
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To: SpirituTuo
“Thou shalt be saved. To confess the Lord Jesus, and to call upon the name of the Lord, (ver. 13.) is not barely the professing of a belief in the person of Christ: but moreover implies a belief of his whole doctrine, and an obedience to his law; without which the calling of him Lord will save no man. (St. Matthew vii. 21.) (Challoner) -— This passage must be understood like many others of this apostle, of a faith accompanied by a good-will ready to perform what faith says must be practised; as it is required in this very place, that what we believe in the heart, we should confess with our mouth. (Estius)”

One person's opinion...That's all...And it's wrong...

79 posted on 10/30/2014 6:46:09 PM PDT by Iscool
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To: Iscool

Not my official translation, as I don’t speak Italian! Talk about a disaster.

I don’t claim he was mistranslated, just I didn’t know what was actually said. Google Translate is OK, but far from perfect.

There are a couple of posts out there discussing the use of the English word “divine,” when the word “demiurge” seems more consistent with the rest of the speech.


80 posted on 10/30/2014 6:46:42 PM PDT by SpirituTuo
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