Posted on 12/12/2013 12:59:05 PM PST by DouglasKC
How do you know you're saved?
Imagine you arrive at a most important banquet that's hosted by Christ Himself. After all--you're a Christian. Picture coming to His home and walking right up to the door. Perhaps you're a little surprised that the door is closed and you're shut outside. But not to be deterred, you knock and knock. No response, no reaction. So you call out, "Jesus open the door, Lord it's me." Still, no response, no reaction. At long last, you hear Jesus' voice and He says, "I never knew you!" What a devastating and shocking situation in which to find yourself.
(Excerpt) Read more at ucg.org ...
>> What other meaning do you assign to Christ’s proclamation from the Cross of “It is finished.”? <<
.
It was the traditional pronouncement of the Cohen Gadol, as the passover sacrifice was completed. Yeshua, as Cohen Ha Gadol, was required to follow Passover as described in Torah in the minutest detail.
It meant that the sacrifice was complete. It didn’t mean anything else that you may have imagined.
>> “I never knew you; depart from me, you workers of lawlessness” <<
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Yes being without Torah. - Are you without Torah?
That is what Yeshua demanded of us, that we keep his commandments, his Torah. (Not the ‘oral’ torah of men, which was defeated at the cross)
So, your Bible begins and ends with one sentence in Ephesians?
What of Yeshua’s words?
>> “I have been a born-again evangelical Christian for 50 some years” <<
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Nobody but Yeshua is ‘born again’ yet.
The “Born Again” he referred to was the changing of our corrupt bodies into incorruptible flesh. That rebirth happens at the last trump when he comes in the cloud with his angels.
It only happens for “Those that endure to the end.”
What is enduring? - It is keeping faith and his commandments each and every minute of every day, which one can only do if he has traversed the Mikva of the Ruach Kodesh. (the baptism of the spirit in modern English)
>> “Ooops. I’m reading FR comments that this is an Amstrong off-shoot...” <<
.
No. Armstrong was an offshoot of Yeshua’s Way, you had it backwards.
>> “ I would say that it was his death on the cross that made salvation possible. And when he died this act was finished.” <<
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Our Passover is finished; our lives go on, in which we must endure in the faith, following his commandments.
>> “What does Jacob’s life tell you, prior to Haran?” <<
It was a life fulfilling prophecy mostly.
Jacob means supplanter, not twister.
Following the scriptures, you will note that his name remained Jacob, but his seed became Israel.
Then why would Yeshua have said...
Matthew 24:
[13] But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.
Mark 13
[13] And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.
>> “Yet, in this very thread, we have people who will NOT acknowledge that the Lord was speaking to a specific GROUP of people when these ‘commands’ are trotted out to be followed.” <<
Yes, he was speaking to those who he came to save.
verse 27 The man asked him, "What is your name?"
"Jacob," he answered.
verse 28 Then the man said, "Your name will no longer be Jacob, but Israel, because you have struggled with God and with men and have overcome."
Actually, the name comes from the Hebrew root qb (meaning to follow, to be behind), and it refers to the circumstances of Jacob’s birth, catching hold of his brother’s heel as Esau was born first.
Yet in every subsequent verse his name is Jacob.
“Your ancestors ate the manna in the desert, but they died;
this is the bread that comes down from heaven so that one may eat it and not die.
I am the living bread that came down from heaven; whoever eats this bread will live forever; and the bread that I will give is my flesh for the life of the world.”
The Jews quarreled among themselves, saying, “How can this man give us (his) flesh to eat?”
Jesus said to them, “Amen, amen, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you do not have life within you.
Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise him on the last day.
For my flesh is true food, and my blood is true drink
Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood remains in me and I in him.
Just as the living Father sent me and I have life because of the Father, so also the one who feeds on me will have life because of me.
This is the bread that came down from heaven. Unlike your ancestors who ate and still died, whoever eats this bread will live forever.”
These things he said while teaching in the synagogue in Capernaum
Then many of his disciples who were listening said, “This saying is hard; who can accept it?”
Since Jesus knew that his disciples were murmuring about this, he said to them, “Does this shock you?
What if you were to see the Son of Man ascending to where he was before?
It is the spirit that gives life, while the flesh is of no avail. The words I have spoken to you are spirit and life.
But there are some of you who do not believe.” Jesus knew from the beginning the ones who would not believe and the one who would betray him.
And he said, “For this reason I have told you that no one can come to me unless it is granted him by my Father.”
As a result of this, many (of) his disciples returned to their former way of life and no longer accompanied him
Jesus then said to the Twelve, “Do you also want to leave?”
Simon Peter answered him, “Master, to whom shall we go? You have the words of eternal life.
We have come to believe and are convinced that you are the Holy One of God.”
Jesus answered them, “Did I not choose you twelve? Yet is not one of you a devil?”
He was referring to Judas, son of Simon the Iscariot; it was he who would betray him, one of the Twelve.” [John 6: 49-71]
Those are explicit quotes regarding the time of the abomination that makes desolate. It is very misleading to ignore that basic context.
Does not apply. I made no “snarky comment” I simply stated fact. When you get to a Bible believing and following church then maybe a discussion will ensue, but if you are dragging around that ridiculous Armstrongism / UCG bilge then that precludes any real discussion.
What are His commandments again?
HMMMmmm...
Whom did He NOT 'come to save'?
I've been to plenty of churches and know plenty of church doctrine and beliefs and believe me this is more bible believing and following then any I've seen so feel free to discuss.
p.s. You're still being snarky.
Those are explicit quotes regarding the time of the abomination that makes desolate. It is very misleading to ignore that basic context.
Poppycock. This was in answer to this question:
Mat 24:3 Now as He sat on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to Him privately, saying, "Tell us, when will these things be? And what will be the sign of Your coming, and of the end of the age?"
The basic context is the return of Christ, his second coming. He clearly and absolutely states "He who endures to the end will be SAVED."
I just don't understand you guys. The concept of overcoming sin and enduring to the end is all over the place in the bible. It can't be good to put our heads in the sand and hold on to mistaken, traditional ideas rather then listen to the Lord and his disciples from the pages of the holy bible.
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