Posted on 01/14/2011 5:57:52 PM PST by topcat54
Evangelical book catalogs promote books such as Planet Earth: The Final Chapter, The Great Escape, and the Left Behind series. Bumper stickers warn us that the vehicle’s occupants may disappear at any moment. It is clear that there is a preoccupation with the idea of a secret rapture. Perhaps this has become more pronounced recently due to the expectation of a new millennium and the fears regarding potential Y2K problems. Perhaps psychologically people are especially receptive to the idea of an imminent, secret rapture at the present time. Additionally, many Christians are not aware that any other position relative to the second coming of Jesus Christ exists. Even in Reformed circles there are numerous people reading these books. Many of these people are unaware that this viewpoint conflicts with Scripture and Reformed Theology.
(Excerpt) Read more at reformed.org ...
Right. Smokers wake up in the morning coughing their lungs out. they dont feel well until they smoke, get a hit. No one I know who is smoke free wakes up coughing like that
“Have at it if you wish.
I’ll pass and breathe.”
I don’t smoke personally.
Just making a point that smoking doesn’t necessarily lead to COPD.
The three members of my family who smoked who have emphysema have emphysema are not related by blood.
One in Four Smokers Will Get Lung Disease
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-backroom/1721068/posts
Russian Roulette is safer and quicker.
One in four, eh?
Whatever.
According to your link,
During the 25 years, there were 2,900 deaths in the study group [of 8000 men and women]. Of those deaths, 109 were directly attributable to COPD, and nearly all those deaths were in people who were active smokers at the start of the study. Only two non-smokers died of COPD.
So, 109 COPD deaths out of 8000 people. How does that equate to Russian Roulette?
Should we go through a list of things not specifically condemned by God in Scripture?
But the point is that mere drinking or smoking is not a sin (except for those who do not have faith, Rom. 14:23). So to compare them to adultery or sodomy is absurd.
No. All we have to do is consider the ones explicitly mentioned. Anything that is not condemned is OK.
When you start listing things as forbidden that God has not said are forbidden, and apply that list to others, there is no stopping you. You have now crossed into the land of Pharisaism.
I appreciate your perspective.
Alas, I don’t have the luxury of that perspective.
Having studied the whole broad scope of such stuff for 45 or so years . . . too many non flakey sources have affirmed too many similar things over too many decades to take any comfort in your perspective.
Just ONE puzzle piece should have given folks BIG pause, as it did me, even with all the other puzzle pieces already saying the same thing . . .
the very expensive stashing of all the seeds of all the plants in the world on that Norway island.
Don’t think there will be many takers on that one.
But that says nothing about whether I can have an extra piece of chocolate cake, or chew sugarless gum, or drive in smog-filled LA, or ride motorcycles, or skydive.
And, quite frankly, it doesn't say that I can't have a cigar or a drink of Scotch on occasion. Now, maybe you are spiritually weak and have some exaggerated notion of the forbidden activities in the Bible. Maybe you read 1 Cor. 6 and see it as an absolute command not to do certain things. That's your privilege. I'm sympathetic that whatever is not of faith is sin, and so for you to practice certain things is necessarily sin, and you ought to flee from them. I pray that God will strengthen your faith so that one day you may be free from this obsession that grips you.
Our standard of faith and practice is still the Word of God. My conscience is subject to that divine Word, and I will not allow it to be captivated by the carnal restrictions of others. Jesus set me free from the Pharisees in this world.
LOL.
Rationalizations are soooooooooooooooooooooooo
. . .
human!
I can’t imagine my pretending to be more knowledgeable about such a sphere than you.
But for those other things that it is OK to enjoy in moderation,....
Smoking? Drugs? Porn?
Those aren’t listed but working on the principle that your body is the temple of the Holy Spirit and therefore we should honor God with out bodies, how does doing something that is not explicitly forbidden but is nevertheless harmful, honoring to God with our body?
Slavery is permitted. Are we wrong for not allowing that in moderation?
Do you want to have a cigar?
As I said before, 'it's personal'. I wasn't implying you have to be like me but you seem to be implying that I must be like you - otherwise I'm weak!
Not at all. You can be weak without trying to be like me.
I showed you where it was, for me! Somehow that bothers you even though you asked for Scripture
No, actually you didn't, and that has been the main point of my response. There's nothing in that passage about whether or not one can enjoy a cigar. There are general statements in the Bible about how we ought to care for our bodies for Christ's sake, and there are specific lists of morally objectionable activities (adultery, murder, etc), but there is nothing specific about the original matters that were raised (drinking and smoking). And there is certainly nothing in the Bible about some automatic abuse of a thing by the members because of the pastor. (Recall, “What the priest does in moderation, the lay person does in excess?”) That's all I was trying to say.
Now, if I had a piece of chocolate cake in the house, I'd have it - for some reason I think I deserve it right now! ;)
Ah, works righteousness. :-)
When you indiscriminately link things that are not linked in the Bible to make a point, it shows you are really not paying attention and don't care to learn. That's the nature of Pharisaism.
Those aren’t listed
Smoking is not, that's true. Drugs in this country, are outlawed by the state, which is the diaconos of God (Rom. 13), therefore objectionable based on that alone. Pornography is a sexual sin resulting in lust of the eyes (Matt. 5:28). See, they can be categorized correctly when you bother to open the Bible and not shoot from the hip.
Slavery is permitted. Are we wrong for not allowing that in moderation?
Biblical servitude is permitted. Chattel slavery is considered man-stealing and not allowed (Deut. 24:7).
Is it still your opinion that the claim, “What the priest does in moderation, the lay person does in excess,” was an accurate comment?
You don't have to pretend. You're a natural.
I’ve seen lay Catholics excuse in excess in themselves what that Catholic priest does in moderation.
The justification is that if the priest can do and God is going to let him into heaven, God can’t keep me out for the same thing. After all, he’s a priest and if he can do it a lot, I can do it more because I’m not a priest and don’t have to be held to as high a standard.
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