Hey, it's your word. You're the one who constantly flings the accusation around this forum. It's in the majority of your posts.
This might help tone down your rhetoric...
Posted on 08/27/2010 11:45:13 AM PDT by Hank Kerchief
The ultimate intention of Catholicism is the restoration of the Holy Roman Empire. That has always been the ambition, at least covertly, but now it is being promoted overtly and openly.
The purpose of this article is only to make that intention clear. It is not a criticism of Catholics or Catholicism (unless you happen to think a Catholic dictatorship is not a good thing).
The most important point is to understand that when a Catholic talks about liberty or freedom, it is not individual liberty that is meant, not the freedom to live one's life as a responsible individual with the freedom to believe as one chooses, not the freedom to pursue happiness, not the freedom to produce and keep what one has produced as their property. What Catholicism means by freedom, is freedom to be a Catholic, in obedience to the dictates of Rome.
The Intentions Made Plain
The following is from the book Revolution and Counter-Revolution:
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"B. Catholic Culture and Civilization
"Therefore, the ideal of the Counter-Revolution is to restore and promote Catholic culture and civilization. This theme would not be sufficiently enunciated if it did not contain a definition of what we understand by Catholic culture and Catholic civilization. We realize that the terms civilization and culture are used in many different senses. Obviously, it is not our intention here to take a position on a question of terminology. We limit ourselves to using these words as relatively precise labels to indicate certain realities. We are more concerned with providing a sound idea of these realities than with debating terminology.
"A soul in the state of grace possesses all virtues to a greater or lesser degree. Illuminated by faith, it has the elements to form the only true vision of the universe.
"The fundamental element of Catholic culture is the vision of the universe elaborated according to the doctrine of the Church. This culture includes not only the learning, that is, the possession of the information needed for such an elaboration, but also the analysis and coordination of this information according to Catholic doctrine. This culture is not restricted to the theological, philosophical, or scientific field, but encompasses the breadth of human knowledge; it is reflected in the arts and implies the affirmation of values that permeate all aspects of life.
"Catholic civilization is the structuring of all human relations, of all human institutions, and of the State itself according to the doctrine of the Church.
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Got that? "Catholic civilization is the structuring of all human relations, of all human institutions, and of the State itself according to the doctrine of the Church." The other name for this is called "totalitarianism," the complete rule of every aspect of life.
This book and WEB sites like that where it is found are spreading like wildfire. These people do not believe the hope of America is the restoration of the liberties the founders sought to guarantee, these people believe the only hope for America is Fatima. Really!
In Their Own Words
The following is from the site, "RealCatholicTV." It is a plain call for a "benevolent dictatorship, a Catholic monarch;" their own words. They even suggest that when the "Lord's Payer," is recited, it is just such a Catholic dictatorship that is being prayed for.
[View video in original here or on Youtube. Will not show in FR.]
Two Comments
First, in this country, freedom of speech means that anyone may express any view no matter how much anyone else disagrees with that view, or is offended by it. I totally defend that meaning of freedom of speech.
This is what Catholics believe, and quite frankly, I do not see how any consistent Catholic could disagree with it, though I suspect some may. I have no objection to their promoting those views, because it is what they believe. Quite frankly I am delighted they are expressing them openly. For one thing, it makes it much easier to understand Catholic dialog, and what they mean by the words they use.
Secondly, I think if their views were actually implemented, it would mean the end true freedom, of course, but I do not believe there is any such danger.
My youngest daughter is pushing 13. My oldest daughter is about 4 weeks away from giving birth to our third grandchild, since our second was born last week...
Logic and reason are good as far as they go, but they cannot reach up to heaven. That is why we need God in his grace to reach down. And since I know how imperfect all logic and reason is, and particularly my own, I understand that while I am a Baptist who believes much of Catholic theology is wrong, it is also possible that I am the one who is wrong.
If I remember that I may well be the one who is wrong, then I am less likely to insist God work with all His servants to bring them in line with me!
I dont know, looks like an awful little girl to be on a green horse
It's not Calvin's limited atonement. It's Christ's . If Christ died for a man, and paid for his sins, that man has been saved. It's not that difficult to understand. Not one drop of Christ's blood was wasted. It atoned for every sin God wished it to atone for.
And a stone of stumbling, and a rock of offence, even to them which stumble at the word, being disobedient: whereunto also they were apppointed." -- 1 Peter 2:7-8"Unto you therefore which believe he is precious: but unto them which be disobedient, the stone which the builders disallowed, the same is made the head of the corner,
If God wanted all men to be saved, all men would be saved.
Yep. That's what they figure purgatory is for. All those who will be saved, but who have not yet joined Rome, will be "influenced" in purgatory to change their minds and kiss the pope's ring.
Magick requires a multitude of props.
Christians accept the LXX O.T that comes through the Church and don’t accept the Council of Jamnia that denied the Divinity of Christ
I suggest reading this..
http://www.columbia.edu/cu/augustine/arch/sbrandt/canon.htm
lol. Keep trying. 8~)
And your corollary is: God wants some men to go to hell - nothing personal, mind you, just for His pleasure.
A hateful god indeed.
and I suggest you read the OT in the original Hebrew
No one is misquoting anything. We're disagreeing about the conclusions drawn from those texts.
RC apologists would like nothing better than to stage their debate alone, without an opposing point of view.
It's called "good catechizing."
Really. But what of your post:
Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved.
I foresee your answer will remove man and free will from the equation. Still, the choice of reply is yours to make.
Hey, it's your word. You're the one who constantly flings the accusation around this forum. It's in the majority of your posts.
This might help tone down your rhetoric...
And the Councils of Hippo and Carthage were.........local Councils. The "approved" Catholic Bible Canon was set at the Council of Trent. Agreed?
No, since Scripture tells us anything not of faith is sin.
Only the man who has been reborn by the Holy Spirit can repent, obey and believe in Jesus Christ.
And the rebirth from natural man to spiritual man is accomplished by God according to His determinate will, and not because we will it. Read your Bible.
That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again." -- John 3:5-7"Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
How and why are men born again?
By the Holy Spirit, according to the will and purpose of God.
So then it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy." -- Romans 9:15-16"For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion.
If so, does that make God "hateful?"
lol. I see. Another Roman Catholic who knows better than the church fathers.
On this, I'll trust Augustine.
Men get what they choose tempered with God's mercy at their judgement. Unlike the Calvinist view, God does not want them to go to hell, does not create them such that they are doomed to hell. Catholics do not believe in Limited Atonement or Double Predestination or Totally Depraved or Irresistible Grace or..
We can do nothing without God’s grace.
None of these scripture necessarily result in Calvinism. And if you make them such, you end up with a god quite foreign to Christian love.
Calvin's view of "natural man" is perverted.
And yet He sends some to eternal torment anyway.
Why doesn’t God give all men enough grace to save them, if that’s what He really wants?
You said it didn’t take much effort on God”s part to get your attention, but it took a considerable amount yo get Paul’s.
Is there a point where God stops making the effort, stops giving His grace? When a man denies Him once? Six times? 200?
Calvin's view of the natural man is founded on Scripture. Read your Bible.
For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace. Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be. So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God." -- Romans 8:5-8 "For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit.
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