Posted on 08/27/2010 11:45:13 AM PDT by Hank Kerchief
The ultimate intention of Catholicism is the restoration of the Holy Roman Empire. That has always been the ambition, at least covertly, but now it is being promoted overtly and openly.
The purpose of this article is only to make that intention clear. It is not a criticism of Catholics or Catholicism (unless you happen to think a Catholic dictatorship is not a good thing).
The most important point is to understand that when a Catholic talks about liberty or freedom, it is not individual liberty that is meant, not the freedom to live one's life as a responsible individual with the freedom to believe as one chooses, not the freedom to pursue happiness, not the freedom to produce and keep what one has produced as their property. What Catholicism means by freedom, is freedom to be a Catholic, in obedience to the dictates of Rome.
The Intentions Made Plain
The following is from the book Revolution and Counter-Revolution:
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"B. Catholic Culture and Civilization
"Therefore, the ideal of the Counter-Revolution is to restore and promote Catholic culture and civilization. This theme would not be sufficiently enunciated if it did not contain a definition of what we understand by Catholic culture and Catholic civilization. We realize that the terms civilization and culture are used in many different senses. Obviously, it is not our intention here to take a position on a question of terminology. We limit ourselves to using these words as relatively precise labels to indicate certain realities. We are more concerned with providing a sound idea of these realities than with debating terminology.
"A soul in the state of grace possesses all virtues to a greater or lesser degree. Illuminated by faith, it has the elements to form the only true vision of the universe.
"The fundamental element of Catholic culture is the vision of the universe elaborated according to the doctrine of the Church. This culture includes not only the learning, that is, the possession of the information needed for such an elaboration, but also the analysis and coordination of this information according to Catholic doctrine. This culture is not restricted to the theological, philosophical, or scientific field, but encompasses the breadth of human knowledge; it is reflected in the arts and implies the affirmation of values that permeate all aspects of life.
"Catholic civilization is the structuring of all human relations, of all human institutions, and of the State itself according to the doctrine of the Church.
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Got that? "Catholic civilization is the structuring of all human relations, of all human institutions, and of the State itself according to the doctrine of the Church." The other name for this is called "totalitarianism," the complete rule of every aspect of life.
This book and WEB sites like that where it is found are spreading like wildfire. These people do not believe the hope of America is the restoration of the liberties the founders sought to guarantee, these people believe the only hope for America is Fatima. Really!
In Their Own Words
The following is from the site, "RealCatholicTV." It is a plain call for a "benevolent dictatorship, a Catholic monarch;" their own words. They even suggest that when the "Lord's Payer," is recited, it is just such a Catholic dictatorship that is being prayed for.
[View video in original here or on Youtube. Will not show in FR.]
Two Comments
First, in this country, freedom of speech means that anyone may express any view no matter how much anyone else disagrees with that view, or is offended by it. I totally defend that meaning of freedom of speech.
This is what Catholics believe, and quite frankly, I do not see how any consistent Catholic could disagree with it, though I suspect some may. I have no objection to their promoting those views, because it is what they believe. Quite frankly I am delighted they are expressing them openly. For one thing, it makes it much easier to understand Catholic dialog, and what they mean by the words they use.
Secondly, I think if their views were actually implemented, it would mean the end true freedom, of course, but I do not believe there is any such danger.
It is with the writings of Irenaeus and Tertullian in the mid to late second century that we first encounter the concept of Apostolic Tradition (tradition handed down in the Church from the apostles in oral form). The word tradition simply means teaching. Irenaeus and Tertullian state emphatically that all the teachings of the Bishops that was given orally was rooted in Scripture and could be proven from the written Scriptures.
According to your church fathers, Tradition IS scripture, alone...
www.christiananswers.net/q-eden/sola-scriptura-earlychurch.html
Bull!
You could well be dismissing a valid source. There are many atheists, et al, who are extremely knowledgeable of Scripture and history.
You well could have gotten Scripture lessons from an agnostic, atheist, or lost except they were excellent bluffers.
Actually, I prefer to receive all sides of a "story". Of course that may explain my Unitarianism. :-)
This goes both ways.
That's what I've been saying has happened since the Reformation. Are you suspiciously on our side all of a sudden?
Mark ALL of Scripture is written by prophets.. notice Christ called those that fail to se Christ in the OT (like the ark of the covenant)..FOOLS
No it is not!!!!
The Torah was written by God. None of Matthew, Mark, or Luke were prophets. James was not a prophet. Where are you getting this stuff? Christ was referring to the Jews. The Greeks didn't care about the OT - they only cared about what Paul was selling them.
RN mom=So the apostles taught jesus from the Old Testament
Mark=Pardon?
Mark have you ever read the Nt for yourself? If you have and not seen the Old Testament there Christ has said that one is a FOOL
You said that the Apostles taught Jesus from the Old Testament. The Apostles didn't teach Jesus anything. Jesus taught them.
RN=But to say there was no New Testament would not be accurate.. the epistles were circulated among the churches to teach doctrine to those that had been saved
Which epistles? When were they written? When were they circulated? How many copies were made, and when? There was no Internet email. No printing press.
Awww my friend.. those letters were the New churches inspired doctrinal teaching of CHRIST
In biblical days they were not without a sort of mail service.. a letter to one church would be taken from one church to another .. They were circulated by the will and design of God
This is the biggest cop out that I have ever seen on this forum. "The will and design of God". Okay, prove it. Prove it scripturally or by another other means. I should hold you to Scripture since that is a common yet not exclusive theme with the Reformed (who will retreat quite imaginatively when confronted with the paucity of proofs for their beliefs). So okay. Prove it. Scripturally if you can. Prove it non Scripturally if you cannot prove it Scripturally. Or else don't bring it up again.
To anyone who knows anything of the Roman Empire in that nasty little snakepit of Palestine 2100 years ago, where they had to publically execute 10,000 Jews in order to stop the uprising against the Empire, to say that there was a mail service in effect (never mind that you don't even address the problems with enough lettered people with the time to copy out letters, never mind again, deciding which letters ought to be copied out, never mind yet again, deciding what should be written down and how much the authors would decide to change the words), this is so much horse hockey. Pull the rose coloured glasses off your eyes and look once again at the Passion of the Christ and tell me what the likelihood of a Pony Express or Wells Fargo was set up to copy and deliver all the letters of Christendom to their intended destinations.
Irrelevant to the question at hand... Paul was the God ordained catechist of the New Testament church ...
It is not irrelevant. It is entirely germane. Paul did not begin his epistles until at least 20 years after the death, Resurrection and Ascension of Christ. Catechism was the province of the Church - if you think that your ragged band of OPC drunkards has the power of Catechism beginning 80 years ago, by what authority do they do so? You cannot point to Calvin since your beliefs wander in many ways off the Calvin track. So what then?
I do not take scripture lessons from agnostics or atheists or pagan or the lost..
You also are not taking history lessons from historians (not me, but all those authorities readily available to those who will listen) or theology lessons from theologians who trace their authority and their instructions from Christ and the Apostles. No doubt you will take your driving lessons from your barmaid, and your tax accounting instructions from your mailman.
Are you saying you did not ask for and receive the free gift of salvation from God prior to this Touch of Almighty God??? This Touch of God apparently happened at least a year after you chose the Catholic religion...
No one suggests that there are not saved, born again Christians in the Catholic church...And as you have observed, there are Christians who are not connected with the Catholic church...
I would suggest that this Touch of God, if that is your salvation experience, had nothing to do with your particular denomination but had everything to do with YOU...
God has been seeking you and knocking on your door for a long time...You finally asked Him to come in...
Then God has blessed you. He has blessed me with several including a aged priest at the basilica near Lima, Ohio, my former Franciscan pastor in Indiana and Bishop D'Arcy of Fort Wayne - South Bend. I think that Bishop Jenky of Peoria might fit into that category, but I have not seen him in a long time, not since he was made Bishop.
shall we search the scriptures to see if what I say is true?
Very very true, to all of our detriment.
My choice to return to my Catholic faith has nothing to do with anyone/anything other than it is where I best learned insight/arts/science ect.. in my path to living an evolving richer life through Christ.
It is through Christ that we must live.
Who here is Baptist? Whoo Hooos Pentecostal? Whoo Hoos and a comic remark then lastly Do we have any Catholics here? Whoo Hoos and he says “Oh, Say Hi! to Mary, we ain't allowed to talk to her” “but Tell her THanks for the Hit Song she gave me”....roaring in laughter as those of us that know Mark Lowry sings a beautiful ballad (choking up here) Mary Did You Know? (ya’ll can u tube that)
An inspired moment. I think I could like this guy.
Really allot of stuff around here is dragging me down in misery and that just ain't good for nothin’ so back to the lighter uplifting threads.
Please feel free to drop in any time with such uplifting posts. It has done me some good and it just might have helped some other folks as well. Thank you.
You got to be kidding me...You guys think you started out as a speck of dust in a mud puddle, and you don't even know where the dust or the mud puddle came from...
What's the matter, you can't deal with the information in the article so you try to shift attention to something else to focus on instead???
To discuss the experience further on THIS THREAD would be to profane it.
After the Israelites left Egypt,603,550 Israelites were found to be fit for military service, and this number does not include the Levites and all those men unfit for service. Add in the wives, several children or more apiece and then the mixed multitude that went with them and the number most Jewish commentators arrive at is 6 million. To top it all off, there is a reason for the 600,000 that were found fit for service, and that is a deeper level of Torah.
Different sort of aura. I’m sure that two contemporaries - Pol Pot and Mother Teresa - would not cause confusion in the observer of who was who.
Be generous and call it 10% that's still 100million "authentic, earnest, practicing, truly “Christian” Roman Catholics".
Heck, be stingy and call it 1%, 10 million is still larger than many of the sects at 100%... and is "how many of your bunch are really "authentic, earnest, practicing, truly 'Christian'" really the contest ANYONE wants to get into?
That was worth a good chuckle.
Was Blessed and even encouraged to read of your spiritual experiences.
I think matching dialogue intensities is great.
Brazen hypocrisy is not so great.
I have learned over the decades that God dwells with lots of unlikely candidates . . . I see one in my mirror daily.
Which being interpreted is another way of saying, I’m happy to hope and pray . . . and even trust a bit more . . . that your assertions are true as you stated them.
The Magisterical, ah, I mean “um”, MagisteriUM, I guess.
I trust God to work through (and often in spite of) the visible Church.
I thought I said I wasn't going to answer that question until later, but maybe I just meant to.
To apply different standards for support of doctrines on the basis of preference for doctrines is hypocrisy.
Wrong. The Church Fathers are part of the Holy Tradition. Do any of them mention Sola Scriptura? (from post # 11,836)
From:
HIPPOLYTUS OF ROME
EXPOSITORY TREATISE AGAINST THE JEWS.
9. There is, brethren, one God, the knowledge of whom we gain from the Holy Scriptures, and from no other source. For just as a man, if he wishes to be skilled in the wisdom of this world, will find himself unable to get at it in any other way than by mastering the dogmas of philosophers, so all of us who wish to practise piety will be unable to learn its practice from any other quarter than the oracles of God. (www.earlychristianwritings.com)
Does “from the Holy Scriptures, and from no other source.”, qualify as sola scriptura?
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I suspect that they will apply
THE FOLLOWING STATIONS OF THE WHITE HANKY
to that:
2. THE BLACK/WHITE ICON OF DUPLICITY, THE DOUBLE STANDARD DANCE
4. ICON TO CHRONICALLY CHANGING THE SUBJECT
7. ICON OF THE RUBBER HISTORY TEXTS
8. ICON OF THE RUBBER DAFFYNITIONARY
9. ICON OF THE RUBBER LOGIC TEXT
12. ICON TO THE HOLY FLIP-FLOPS IN WORD MEANINGS AND ARGUMENTS
14. ICON TO THE FANTASIZED DIVINE RIGHT, TO BE CORRECT, PRISTINELY SANCTIFIED & PERFECTLY FLAWLESS IN ALL RESPECTS IN ALL CASES ALL THE TIME, REGARDLESS.
15. ICON TO CHRONIC & OBSESSIVE INCONSISTENCY.
AND LAST BUT NOT LEAST:
17. ICON TO THE UNDIVINE RIGHT OF TERMINAL SNOOTINESS TO THE MAX.
More of that impressive Mary-taught vocabulary, I see.
WOW
chronic unawareness across a wide range of topics seems to be the norm for some RC’s these days.
Are you really that unaware of the several sites around the world where dino tracks and human tracks are together from the same layer—if not moment—almost side by side???
Iscool—maybe you have triggered a new understanding of why so many claim so much bliss in the RC camp . . . Olympic class ignorance???
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