Posted on 05/30/2008 10:21:34 AM PDT by Ultra Sonic 007
Some of you will remember my recent decision to become a Catholic. I suppose I should be surprised it ended getting derailed into a 'Catholic vs. Protestant' thread, but after going further into the Religion forum, I suppose it's par for the course.
There seems to be a bit of big issue concerning Mary. I wanted to share an observation of sorts.
Now...although I was formerly going by 'Sola Scriptura', my father was born and raised Catholic, so I do have some knowledge of Catholic doctrine (not enough, at any rate...so consider all observations thusly).
Mary as a 'co-redeemer', Mary as someone to intercede for us with regards to our Lord Jesus.
Now...I can definitely see how this would raise some hairs. After all, Jesus Himself said that He is the Way, the Truth, and the Life, and that none come to the Father but through Him. I completely agree.
I do notice a bit of a fundamental difference in perception though. Call it a conflict of POV. Do Catholics worship Mary (as I've seen a number of Protestants proclaim), or do they rather respect and venerate her (as I've seen Catholics claim)? Note that it's one thing to regard someone with reverence; I revere President Bush as the noted leader of the free world. I revere my father. I revere Dr. O'Neil, a humorous and brilliant math teacher at my university. It's an act of respect.
But do I WORSHIP them?
No. Big difference between respecting/revering and worshiping. At least, that's how I view it.
I suppose it's also a foible to ask Mary to pray for us, on our behalf...but don't we tend to also ask other people to pray for us? Doesn't President Bush ask for people to pray for him? Don't we ask our family members to pray for us for protection while on a trip? I don't see quite a big disconnect between that and asking Mary to help pray for our wellbeing.
There is some question to the fact that she is physically dead. Though it stands to consider that she is still alive, in Heaven. Is it not common practice to not just regard our physical life, but to regard most of all our spirit, our soul? That which survives the flesh before ascending to Heaven or descending to Hell after God's judgment?
I don't think it's that big of a deal. I could change my mind after reading more in-depth, but I don't think that the Catholic Church has decreed via papal infallibility that Mary is to be placed on a higher pedestal than Jesus, or even to be His equal.
Do I think she is someone to be revered and respected? Certainly. She is the mother of Jesus, who knew Him for His entire life as a human on Earth. Given that He respected her (for He came to fulfill the old laws; including 'Honor Thy Father and Mother'), I don't think it's unnatural for other humans to do the same. I think it's somewhat presumptuous to regard it on the same level as idolatry or supplanting Jesus with another.
In a way, I guess the way Catholics treat Mary and the saints is similar to how the masses treated the Apostles following the Resurrection and Jesus's Ascension: people who are considered holy in that they have a deep connection with Jesus and His Word, His Teachings, His Message. As the Apostles spread the Good News and are remembered and revered to this day for their work, so to are the works of those sainted remembered and revered. Likewise with Mary. Are the Apostles worshiped? No. That's how it holds with Mary and the saints.
At least, that's how my initial thoughts on the subject are. I'll have to do more reading.
wow! I am impressed by your post. Thanks.
What’s a little idolatry among pagans? :-)
No, it’s your church’s outlook on itself that’s absurd. I feel sorry for you guys.
where?
I might ask the same thing of a friend in a prayer group.
How did you "know" that?
...and to insult me while doing it.
Hmmm, how sweeping! How did you know that?
Oh well, I tried.
What did you try?
Then why not plead to Christ then? Mary cannot do one thing to help anyone attain salvation. That’s God’s job, not hers.
VERY WELL PUT.
THX.
You pulled that sentence out of the middle of a paragraph. That is manipulation characteristic of the Catholic Church.
Why choose when one can plead to both?
Mary cannot do one thing to help anyone attain salvation.
Such is your false belief.
It's idiocy can stand all on its own.
That is manipulation characteristic of the Catholic Church.
Tell us all about the scientific methodology you used in making this judgment.
No Gibberish Rule (NGR) invoked automatically.
MORE WONDERFUL.
Am putting your excellent posts in my RC docs files under it’s own title. PETER AS PEBBLE VS CHRIST THE ROCK
“I’ll give your explanation more weight when you produce better credentials than D.A. Carson, who subscribes to the feminine gender theory.”
I am not familiar with Carson’s work on this subject but if mine agrees with his I am elated.
“Such extravagant rationalizations would never even occur to people were it not for the Protestant aversion to the Papacy.”
My study has nothing to do with an “aversion to the Papacy”, in fact the “Papacy” does not bother me. What I do care about is an accurate exegesis of the scriptures within their historical context.
I am not a theologan, However, who says that “Woman” was a) the correct translation or b) that in those times Woman may have been a sign of respect. or c) the most important, that Jesus was giving respect and equality to women ( ie, he was the first Femminist!) in a society that treated them like chattel or slaves( as they do in parts of the mideast, like the Taliban).
Scriptures didn’t come from a particular earthly church, but “holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.” (2 Peter 1:21)
Individual holy men were selected by the Holy Ghost.
Mind reading again, Petronski????
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.