Lay-zerrrs!
Posted on 05/30/2008 10:21:34 AM PDT by Ultra Sonic 007
Some of you will remember my recent decision to become a Catholic. I suppose I should be surprised it ended getting derailed into a 'Catholic vs. Protestant' thread, but after going further into the Religion forum, I suppose it's par for the course.
There seems to be a bit of big issue concerning Mary. I wanted to share an observation of sorts.
Now...although I was formerly going by 'Sola Scriptura', my father was born and raised Catholic, so I do have some knowledge of Catholic doctrine (not enough, at any rate...so consider all observations thusly).
Mary as a 'co-redeemer', Mary as someone to intercede for us with regards to our Lord Jesus.
Now...I can definitely see how this would raise some hairs. After all, Jesus Himself said that He is the Way, the Truth, and the Life, and that none come to the Father but through Him. I completely agree.
I do notice a bit of a fundamental difference in perception though. Call it a conflict of POV. Do Catholics worship Mary (as I've seen a number of Protestants proclaim), or do they rather respect and venerate her (as I've seen Catholics claim)? Note that it's one thing to regard someone with reverence; I revere President Bush as the noted leader of the free world. I revere my father. I revere Dr. O'Neil, a humorous and brilliant math teacher at my university. It's an act of respect.
But do I WORSHIP them?
No. Big difference between respecting/revering and worshiping. At least, that's how I view it.
I suppose it's also a foible to ask Mary to pray for us, on our behalf...but don't we tend to also ask other people to pray for us? Doesn't President Bush ask for people to pray for him? Don't we ask our family members to pray for us for protection while on a trip? I don't see quite a big disconnect between that and asking Mary to help pray for our wellbeing.
There is some question to the fact that she is physically dead. Though it stands to consider that she is still alive, in Heaven. Is it not common practice to not just regard our physical life, but to regard most of all our spirit, our soul? That which survives the flesh before ascending to Heaven or descending to Hell after God's judgment?
I don't think it's that big of a deal. I could change my mind after reading more in-depth, but I don't think that the Catholic Church has decreed via papal infallibility that Mary is to be placed on a higher pedestal than Jesus, or even to be His equal.
Do I think she is someone to be revered and respected? Certainly. She is the mother of Jesus, who knew Him for His entire life as a human on Earth. Given that He respected her (for He came to fulfill the old laws; including 'Honor Thy Father and Mother'), I don't think it's unnatural for other humans to do the same. I think it's somewhat presumptuous to regard it on the same level as idolatry or supplanting Jesus with another.
In a way, I guess the way Catholics treat Mary and the saints is similar to how the masses treated the Apostles following the Resurrection and Jesus's Ascension: people who are considered holy in that they have a deep connection with Jesus and His Word, His Teachings, His Message. As the Apostles spread the Good News and are remembered and revered to this day for their work, so to are the works of those sainted remembered and revered. Likewise with Mary. Are the Apostles worshiped? No. That's how it holds with Mary and the saints.
At least, that's how my initial thoughts on the subject are. I'll have to do more reading.
OK, as soon as you show me the word Trinity...
No crying, just pity.
Prayers of pity, in fact, for your behavior. You are lost.
Ok, no white hankie, but from whence does the sanctification come?
Do you understand that ? denotes a question?
Do you feel my posts are so fascinating that your ping list needs to be called in?
Do you think your posts are so fascinating that your ping list needs to be called in?
Or...do you need reinforcements?
It wasn’t written in English, you know. I gave you the Hebrew from Psalms and the Greek from John. Those with eyes will see.
Do you mean interpretation of Scripture? **gasp**
The personal assaults are a little late today.
Do you have an intelligent answer? I would love one.
If I need to explain any of the following words, please let me know.
I
enjoy
sharing
the
joke!
LOL.
See, they put Mary’s heart on their hall table and pat it for luck when they pass by. Didn’t you know???
I try to share intelligent answers where there’s an abundant capacity to appreciate them . . . which usually comes after comprehending them.
Who is "they?"
Catholics rightfully reject "sola fide," but otherwise I cannot recognize whom you might mean.
And since you seem to be addressing non-Christians, I know you're not talking about Catholics.
What you say is really what I’m saying, but what have you done with Jesus and Him ONLY. He’s the one who saves you. Not Mary, not baptism, not the Eucharist or any of the other extra-biblical things that are Catholic beliefs.
I have every bit of the grace of God and it’s not going to bop in and out of me every time I sin. You can call us what you like, but protestants have every bit as much grace and the Holy Spirit as Catholics say they do. We believe Jesus is our salvation, not baptism, not works, not Mary or the Eucharist. I don’t doubt that you love the Lord, tiki.
This is not an ego thing. It’s just the truth of the gospel of Jesus Christ. Believe it or not, that’s not my problem.
That’s some pretty light footwork there.
Funny, unless you recognize that Protestants like you are tied to the error called sola scriptura.
Catholics, wisely, reject it.
Amen. Seems obvious to anyone who reads the Scriptures.
Three of the four Gospels have Jesus chastising a believer who seeks to elevate His mother above those who possess faith in Him. All believers are the equal of His mother.
If Catholics would simply read the Gospel they might better understand the Gospel, God willing.
I understand you comment, do you?
Based on your understanding, not the Catholic Church.
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