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The Worship of Mary? (An Observation)
Posted on 05/30/2008 10:21:34 AM PDT by Ultra Sonic 007
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To: thefrankbaum
The link is to another thread on FR, an article written by a single Priest concerning Padre Pio and the proposed title of "Co-redemptrix." In no way is it an authoritative Church document. Read the comments on that thread. Every Catholic there defends, supports and practically glorifies that entire thread.
Are all those Catholic FReepers wrong? Misguided? Not adhering to Catholic dogma?
John Paul II referred to Mary as the "co-redeemer" on at least eight occasions during his papacy.
Or was JPII not "authoritative" enough?
461
posted on
06/01/2008 2:10:58 PM PDT
by
Dr. Eckleburg
("I don't think they want my respect; I think they want my submission." - Flemming Rose)
To: GCC Catholic
There is a location noted to be the tomb of Mary.
A legendary story is there is a location noted to be the tomb of Mary.
462
posted on
06/01/2008 2:11:02 PM PDT
by
OLD REGGIE
(I am most likely a Biblical Unitarian? Let me be perfectly clear. I know nothing.)
To: John Leland 1789
But does not the Vatican actually view the prefix co- as something much greater?Well, it ain't dogma in any event, so talking about how the Vatican views it is a little tricky. AND, as a point this thread seems to need to be repeated, "more" isn't "all, "higher" isn't "highest", etc.
My understanding is that all the elect are promised kingly crowns. Unless this is a fashion statement, there seems to be an implication that God will share his power with the saints in heaven in a big way.
But it's still His power, and however great Mary may be or have become, she can't be God. She's always a creature.
463
posted on
06/01/2008 2:11:25 PM PDT
by
Mad Dawg
(Oh Mary, conceived without sin, pray for us who have recourse to thee.)
To: OLD REGGIE
? I thought she went up bodily into heaven
464
posted on
06/01/2008 2:12:28 PM PDT
by
1000 silverlings
(Everything that deceives also enchants: Plato)
To: Dr. Eckleburg
John Paul II often spoke of his love for Poland. Loving Poland is not Catholic teaching. Benedict XVI speaks often of his love for classical music. Loving classical music is not Catholic teaching.
465
posted on
06/01/2008 2:13:20 PM PDT
by
Petronski
(Scripture & Tradition must be accepted & honored w/equal sentiments of devotion & reverence. CCC 82)
To: Dr. Eckleburg
Mary is not on the cross with Jesus Christ, No, she was, as scripture tells us, watching her grown Son, a man in his prime at 33, be tortured to death, from the foot of the cross. If you are not a mother, you cannot possibly know what that means. I am quite certain she would have joyfully, instantly, taken His place were such a thing possible. I am sure she wanted to die with Him. I am positive she felt every blow.
It's infinitely sad that someone who professes to be a Christian would need reminding of that fact. Those heartless, uncomprehending, cold, so-called Christians have my most fervent prayers that Christ will forgive them, and save them. Just as I am sure the soldiers were in Mary's prayers, just as Christ prayed to His Father for their forgiveness.
Cold! Heartless! And yet, loved by Christ unto their salvation...
To: OLD REGGIE
Wow, if anonymous internet dude posts it on the internet and underlines it, it’s GOT to be true.
467
posted on
06/01/2008 2:14:23 PM PDT
by
Petronski
(Scripture & Tradition must be accepted & honored w/equal sentiments of devotion & reverence. CCC 82)
To: SoothingDave; CharlesWayneCT
In my Bible, the story ends with Jesus making wine. How does your story end?
Far from that way for certain. But then, you are noted for cherrypicking Scripture.
468
posted on
06/01/2008 2:17:03 PM PDT
by
OLD REGGIE
(I am most likely a Biblical Unitarian? Let me be perfectly clear. I know nothing.)
To: Mad Dawg
What can I say? It is great to see that there are those who understand things the way I do. It is special. Thanks again. God is good.
469
posted on
06/01/2008 2:17:08 PM PDT
by
mgist
To: OLD REGGIE
And legend says it has always been empty.
To: Dr. Eckleburg
Are all those Catholic FReepers wrong? Misguided? Not adhering to Catholic dogma?Catholics as a group believe a lot of things. That fact alone does not make them dogma, nor does believing something mean "not adhering to Catholic dogma" unless Catholic dogma says not to believe that thing.
471
posted on
06/01/2008 2:17:19 PM PDT
by
Petronski
(Scripture & Tradition must be accepted & honored w/equal sentiments of devotion & reverence. CCC 82)
To: LordBridey
So do you believe, as you earlier stated, that "all matters of faith are dubious?"
Or is this like saying "Mary is a co-redeemer but not really?"
472
posted on
06/01/2008 2:17:40 PM PDT
by
Dr. Eckleburg
("I don't think they want my respect; I think they want my submission." - Flemming Rose)
To: Judith Anne; Dr. Eckleburg; OLD REGGIE; Iscool
Those heartless, uncomprehending, cold, so-called ChristiansThis is inferring something you know nothing about and is in essence, mind-reading. Many of us weep at Communion and at hymns such as "Were you there when they crucified my Lord". You are making this personal when we are merely talking finer points of theology
473
posted on
06/01/2008 2:17:43 PM PDT
by
1000 silverlings
(Everything that deceives also enchants: Plato)
To: 1000 silverlings
On open threads, it is the thin-skinned ones who are the disruptors. Making a general statement into a specific one about you is thin-skinned.
474
posted on
06/01/2008 2:20:12 PM PDT
by
Petronski
(Scripture & Tradition must be accepted & honored w/equal sentiments of devotion & reverence. CCC 82)
To: Ultra Sonic 007
I suppose it's also a foible to ask Mary to pray for us, on our behalf...but don't we tend to also ask other people to pray for us? I ask living people to pray for me, not dead ones.
To: rabidralph
476
posted on
06/01/2008 2:21:28 PM PDT
by
Petronski
(Scripture & Tradition must be accepted & honored w/equal sentiments of devotion & reverence. CCC 82)
To: netmilsmom; 1000 silverlings; Iscool; Manfred the Wonder Dawg
I guess that was found on Vatican.org. No, it was found by the posting and support of Catholic FReepers who responded in droves with happy enthusiasm to Mary's "co-redemptrix" status among them on the Padre Pio thread.
It was also found from the lips of your pope, JPII, who called Mary the "co-redeemer" on at least eight occasions during his papacy.
477
posted on
06/01/2008 2:22:19 PM PDT
by
Dr. Eckleburg
("I don't think they want my respect; I think they want my submission." - Flemming Rose)
To: OLD REGGIE
Jefferson's Shrine, Lincoln's Shrine, Washington's Shrine, Sagamore Hill Shrine, Mount Rushmore Shrine...Yeah, pretty much. Jefferson's and Lincolns are clearly designed to mimic temples with a humongo idol in the middle.
And people are on their knees praying to them every day.
Mutatis mutandis, yeah I think pretty much. They aren't revered for their religious stuff (well, some Unitarians are pretty devoted to Mr. Jefferson hereabouts) but, after their kind, as you might say, they receive devotion. Certainly I read some of Lincolns writings with the political analog of religious devotion.
478
posted on
06/01/2008 2:22:47 PM PDT
by
Mad Dawg
(Oh Mary, conceived without sin, pray for us who have recourse to thee.)
To: Judith Anne
No, she was, as scripture tells us, watching her grown Son, a man in his prime at 33, be tortured to death, from the foot of the cross. If you are not a mother, you cannot possibly know what that means. I am quite certain she would have joyfully, instantly, taken His place were such a thing possible. I am sure she wanted to die with Him. I am positive she felt every blow. It's infinitely sad that someone who professes to be a Christian would need reminding of that fact. Those heartless, uncomprehending, cold, so-called Christians have my most fervent prayers that Christ will forgive them, and save them. Just as I am sure the soldiers were in Mary's prayers, just as Christ prayed to His Father for their forgiveness. Cold! Heartless! And yet, loved by Christ unto their salvation...
My sentiments exactly. If we look at humanity now, a good mother, obedient to God, is essential to society. Women have been brainwashed and degraded into something Our Lady wouldn't even recognize. Thank you Jesus for giving us a role model we needed. May everyone be so blessed to understand your gifts.
479
posted on
06/01/2008 2:22:50 PM PDT
by
mgist
To: Petronski
Do you imagine I am on your witness stand, fielding your hostile interrogatories? Is this my cross-examination? Hmmm....doesn't "Satan" mean "Adversary"? Nevertheless, just feel the thumbscrews turnin' and feel that old fire burnin' -- ROFL!
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