Posted on 04/04/2008 11:01:22 AM PDT by Gamecock
Last week I received the following e-mail, and I felt it would be best to share my response here on the blog.
Dear Mr. White, For someone considering converting to Catholicism, what questions would you put to them in order to discern whether or not they have examined their situation sufficiently? Say, a Top 10 list. Thanks.
When I posted this question in our chat channel a number of folks commented that it was in fact a great question, and we started to throw out some possible answers. Here is my "Top Ten List" in response to this fine inquiry.
10) Have you listened to both sides? That is, have you done more than read Rome Sweet Home and listen to a few emotion-tugging conversion stories? Have you actually taken the time to find sound, serious responses to Rome's claims, those offered by writers ever since the Reformation, such as Goode, Whitaker, Salmon, and modern writers? I specifically exclude from this list anything by Jack Chick and Dave Hunt.
9) Have you read an objective history of the early church? I refer to one that would explain the great diversity of viewpoints to be found in the writings of the first centuries, and that accurately explains the controversies, struggles, successes and failures of those early believers?
8) Have you looked carefully at the claims of Rome in a historical light, specifically, have you examined her claims regarding the "unanimous consent" of the Fathers, and all the evidence that exists that stands contrary not only to the universal claims of the Papacy but especially to the concept of Papal Infallibility? How do you explain, consistently, the history of the early church in light of modern claims made by Rome? How do you explain such things as the Pornocracy and the Babylonian Captivity of the Church without assuming the truthfulness of the very system you are embracing?
7) Have you applied the same standards to the testing of Rome's ultimate claims of authority that Roman Catholic apologists use to attack sola scriptura? How do you explain the fact that Rome's answers to her own objections are circular? For example, if she claims you need the Church to establish an infallible canon, how does that actually answer the question, since you now have to ask how Rome comes to have this infallible knowledge. Or if it is argued that sola scriptura produces anarchy, why doesn't Rome's magisterium produce unanimity and harmony? And if someone claims there are 33,000 denominations due to sola scriptura, since that outrageous number has been debunked repeatedly (see Eric Svendsen's Upon This Slippery Rock for full documentation), have you asked them why they are so dishonest and sloppy with their research?
6) Have you read the Papal Syllabus of Errors and Indulgentiarum Doctrina? Can anyone read the description of grace found in the latter document and pretend for even a moment that is the doctrine of grace Paul taught to the Romans?
5) Have you seriously considered the ramifications of Rome's doctrine of sin, forgiveness, eternal and temporal punishments, purgatory, the treasury of merit, transubstantiation, sacramental priesthood, and indulgences? Have you seriously worked through compelling and relevant biblical texts like Ephesians 2, Romans 3-5, Galatians 1-2, Hebrews 7-10 and all of John 6, in light of Roman teaching?
4) Have you pondered what it means to embrace a system that teaches you approach the sacrifice of Christ thousands of times in your life and yet you can die impure, and, in fact, even die an enemy of God, though you came to the cross over and over again? And have you pondered what it means that though the historical teachings of Rome on these issues are easily identifiable, the vast majority of Roman Catholics today, including priests, bishops, and scholars, don't believe these things anymore?
3) Have you considered what it means to proclaim a human being the Holy Father (that's a divine name, used by Jesus only of His Father) and the Vicar of Christ (that's the Holy Spirit)? Do you really find anything in Scripture whatsoever that would lead you to believe it was Christ's will that a bishop in a city hundreds of miles away in Rome would not only be the head of His church but would be treated as a king upon earth, bowed down to and treated the way the Roman Pontiff is treated?
2) Have you considered how completely unbiblical and a-historical is the entire complex of doctrines and dogmas related to Mary? Do you seriously believe the Apostles taught that Mary was immaculately conceived, and that she was a perpetual virgin (so that she traveled about Palestine with a group of young men who were not her sons, but were Jesus' cousins, or half-brothers (children of a previous marriage of Joseph), or the like? Do you really believe that dogmas defined nearly 2,000 years after the birth of Christ represent the actual teachings of the Apostles? Are you aware that such doctrines as perpetual virginity and bodily assumption have their origin in gnosticism, not Christianity, and have no foundation in apostolic doctrine or practice? How do you explain how it is you must believe these things de fide, by faith, when generations of Christians lived and died without ever even having heard of such things?
And the number 1 question I would ask of such a person is: if you claim to have once embraced the gospel of grace, whereby you confessed that your sole standing before a thrice-holy God was the seamless garment of the imputed righteousness of Christ, so that you claimed no merit of your own, no mixture of other merit with the perfect righteousness of Christ, but that you stood full and complete in Him and in Him alone, at true peace with God because there is no place in the universe safer from the wrath of God than in Christ, upon what possible grounds could you come to embrace a system that at its very heart denies you the peace that is found in a perfect Savior who accomplishes the Father's will and a Spirit who cannot fail but to bring that work to fruition in the life of God's elect? Do you really believe that the endless cycle of sacramental forgiveness to which you will now commit yourself can provide you the peace that the perfect righteousness of Christ can not?
The Game involves misrepresentation of the faith of another. I am not doing that.
Begin argument of "sins" vs "sin"...
Well put.
Thanks.
“Do I know for absolute certain that I am saved? No I don’t...”
Matt. 11:27
All things are delivered unto me of my Father: and no man knoweth the Son, but the Father; neither knoweth any man the Father, save the Son, and he to whomsoever the Son will reveal him.
John 17:3
And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.
Ephesians 2:8&9
For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Not of works, lest any man should boast.
You can know for sure. Think about what it would say about God (a God you [and the Bible] so beautifully described as a loving Father) if He were to leave His children to wonder about life’s most important question: Am I going to Heaven?
The Scriptures, “which are able to make us wise unto salvation” (2Tim. 3:15) teach us that God wants us to know and to place our faith and confidence in Him who is able to bring it (our salvation) to pass (Phil. 1:6 “Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ...”
I close with this:
Gal. 2:20 “I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.”
I am saved eternally, forever, by Christ. Not by myself, not by anything I’ve done, will do, but by Him. God, the Father, is so satisfied with the work of His Son (the Son of His love) that he imputes His (Christ’s righteousness—He has become our righteousness!) to all that come to Him by faith.
Come to Christ. Come by faith. Be no more a child, carried by every wind of doctrine...come to Christ for salvation. His death, once for all, His blood, shed for the remission of sin (including your own), His completed work on the cross, has satisfied the Father and His holy required payment for sin. His resurrection is the seal of absolute approval of His work (death and the grave could not contain Him—don’t look for Him among the dead—He is alive). He has been given the Name which is above every name and dwells at the Father’s right hand where He ever lives to make intercession for you (”For there is one God, and one Mediator between God and men, the Man Christ Jesus” 1Tim. 2:5).
Come to Christ...and believe.
Begin argument of “object” versus “prepositional phrase.”
More of your slanderous misrepresentation, distortion and false witness.
Yet you will not or can not answer one simple question. Why?
Get your popcorn here.
Extra bitterness and resentment modules are availabl on flash drives. 10 for a used indulgence memo, of course.
We have a few gritted-teeth dental appliances left for those who's grinding has been into overtime.
And for the first time ever, this season, we have some titanium replacement claws for those who really want to sink . . . . uhhhh . . . their claws . . . into the cause.
Sorry, though, we've had a run on Tums and Pepcid etc. Try some relaxation tecniques instead. Slow breaths 6-8 seconds in; 6-8 seconds out . . .
For those stiff necks, we suggest the Chinese masseurs down at the mall.
If the old fangs are getting dull, we do have a new Dremel attachment that many find quite handy--particularly before a slash and gnaw banquet.
We're trying to get some organ donations of new spleens for those who's spleens are over vented . . . but the supplier in China has been slow to reply. There's a rummor that a new company: RC RAGING ROBOTICS will offer a new nano-tech replacement soonish. No one seems to know what soonish means.
About all we've heard suggested for the over-pegged blood pressure guages and pressure problem is 3-4 teaspoons of Apple Cider vinegar in a glass of water daily or twice daily. Please let us know if it works. We'll get the word out.
We've heard that some folks are choking on their rosaries. Others are reportedly trying to chew them into powder in frustration. We're working with a supplier to design a new titanium micro beaded version so that--swallowed, they are inconsequential and they'd be too tough to chew into powder.
All, in all--chin-up. Keep the UNfaith. Keep those idolatrous kowtows going. Cheers.
/sar
Matthew 7:6
Seems like you’re being severely judgmental, without the backbone to say anything.
You think your opinion about the statement on that web site is holy?
Whose faith do you claim I am misrepresenting?
I know you by your fruits.
The Shadow knows.
That Mary was born without sin.
Your gibberish is non-responsive and unsurprising.
My Lord has seen fit to bless me with doubt, to periodically afflict me with scruples. I am forced to ever have faith and to trust myself to His mercy, for in my own self I have no strength. What need has certainty for Faith?
Ten virgins promised themselves to the Bridegroom, yet only five maintained their lamps. I pray God to strengthen me that I may endure this race. “I therefore so run, not as at an uncertainty: I so fight, not as one beating the air. But I chastise my body and bring it into subjection: lest perhaps, when I have preached to others, I myself should become a castaway.”
The Lord is merciful. I will serve Him with all that I have in the time He has given me. After that, He may do with me what He wills.
You have a smugness about ye, yet ye lie. You know me not, ye know not the fruit of my life. Ye hide behind such lines for a reason. Could it be that ye cannot provide an answer to the question I’ve asked (What can meant by the phrase, “knot of disgrace for the human race” - in the context of “the parallel made by Saint Paul between Adam and Christ”?) because ye know that there is none? Are ye so blinded by the false teaching of the RCC that ye cling to it rather than face the possibility that ONE aspect of its dogma may be wrong?
You have a smugness about ye, yet ye lie. You know me not, ye know not the fruit of my life. Ye hide behind such lines for a reason. Could it be that ye cannot provide an answer to the question I’ve asked (What can meant by the phrase, “knot of disgrace for the human race” - in the context of “the parallel made by Saint Paul between Adam and Christ”?) because ye know that there is none? Are ye so blinded by the false teaching of the RCC that ye cling to it rather than face the possibility that ONE aspect of its dogma may be wrong?
Could it be that ye cannot provide an answer to the question I’ve asked because ye know that there is none?
Not cannot, will not.
Are ye so blinded by the false teaching of the RCC that ye cling to it rather than face the possibility that ONE aspect of its dogma may be wrong?
The premise of your question is false.
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