Do we really want to go back?

Mississippi Catholic ^ | August 17, 2007 | Fr. Henry Shelton

[maryz]

Dear Editor

Lex Orandi, Lex Credendi.

“Have you ‘heard’ Mass lately?”

In recent months I have seen reports of a move in the church to make the Mass of Pope Pius V (Tridentine Mass) more available to the laity. This would include returning to the Mass being “said” by the priest with his back to the people. A recent article on this subject in the Tupelo paper, the Daily Journal, quoted one lay woman who attends this Mass describe the priest as the pilot and the laity as passengers. She said she would not want the pilot flying her plane to be facing the passengers.

I have some questions I wish to raise regarding the Mass of Pius V.

1. Does the Mass of Pius V give the worshipper a sense of God’s presence (the holy) among the worshippers gathered or is the “holy” only present on the altar?

2. Does the Mass of Pius V give the worshipper a sense of being gathered together for corporate worship or private, personal devotion?

3. Does the Mass of Pius V help foster in the worshipper a sense of their own priesthood (per baptism) which enables them to offer the Mass with the priest (per ordination)?

4. Does the Mass of Pius V promote in the worshipper a sense of God who is immersed in the world and their life, or a sense of God removed from the world and their life? A God removed from flesh or a God made flesh?

5. Does the Mass of Pius V help convey the bond of intimacy between God and his people intended by the covenant ritual or does it promote a sense of God’s aloofness from his people?

One of the most potent tools the church has to catechize both the priests and laity is the way Mass is celebrated, whether that of Pius V or Paul VI. These two forms of the Mass operate from very different theologies. They convey very different ideas about God, Jesus, holiness, priesthood, laity, worship, and spirituality – I believe the Mass of Pius V, with its heavy emphasis on the transcendent nature of God contributed to most Catholics not receiving Holy Communion at Mass. It took Pope Pius X to make it a law of the church for Catholics to receive Holy Communion at least once-a-year for them to be in good standing in the church. I am old enough to remember those days.

Do we truly want to go back to an experience of Mass where the priest’s role is described as “saying Mass” and the laity’s role that of “hearing Mass”
“Lex orandi, lex credendi.”

[roamer]

The Real Reasons

 

I would like to explain the incorrect and the correct reasons of conserving the Traditional Mass, as we have previously published, [as follows]:

Why do we love, preserve and prefer the classic liturgical form of Roman rite, The Traditional Mass?

Would it be only because we are nostalgic or sentimentally attached to past forms of liturgy?  This reason alone would not be enough.

Would it be because we deny the power of the Pope to modify and promulgate liturgical laws?  This would be against the Pope's supreme power dogma!

Would it be because we just consider the New Mass, or Paul VI's Mass, invalid, heterodox, sinful, sacrilegious, or not Catholic?  These statements would be against Church's indefectibility dogma and unity of cult dogma, and they have already received the Teaching Church's anathema.  Therefore, it [the Novus Ordo's promulgation] is a universal liturgical law, promulgated by Church's supreme authority 34 years ago and adopted unanimously by the whole Teaching Church.

The real reasons we love, prefer, and preserve the Classical liturgical form of the Roman rite are:

for a better and more precise expression of our faith in eucharistic dogmas,

for safety, for protection against abuses,

for the good of whole Church, in contribution for liturgical crisis' reform,

for wealth and solemnity of rites,

for better precision and clarity of rubrics (giving no space to "ambiguities, liberties, creativities, adaptations, reductions, and instrumentalizations," as complains Pope John Paul II in Ecclesia de Eucharistia, nn. 10, 52, 61),

for the sense of sacredness,

more wealth and precision of prayers' formulas, in reverence,

for personal and ritual humility,

for elevation and nobility of ceremonies,

for respect, beauty, good taste, piety, sacred language, tradition, and legitimate right recognized by Church's Supreme Authority. (Bishop Fernando Rifan, copied)

 

I know that this has been posted before, I just wanted to repost it -- hope that is ok...

[maryz]

Always good to have a reminder! ;-)

[fr maximilian mary]

Ave Maria!

Thanks for re-posting it (I never saw it before). Pray for us as the priests in my friary are having a “practicum” for the Tridentine Mass this Friday (the brothers on Thursday for serving).

Pax et bonum.

[roamer]

**Pray for us as the priests in my friary are having a "practicum" for the Tridentine Mass this Friday (the brothers on Thursday for serving).**

 

Consider it done.

[marshmallow]

If the Novus Ordo is as clearly superior as Fr. Shelton believes, then nobody will "go back", right?

What's he afraid of and what am I missing?

[maryz]

Good question! You could see this reaction maybe if the Pope had decreed that the old Mass would be the only one allowed (except for "indults" every other Sunday in months with no R or whatever!), but this is weird.

I think it was Diogenes of CWN who compared it to someone opening a used Edsel dealership on the same street with all the Mercedes, Lexis, Toyota, etc. dealerships -- would they all join together fiercely to prevent it?

[Bigg Red]

I did not call the Mass an “abhomination”. Actually, I don’t even know what an abhomination is. Perhaps it is some liturgical term that, in my great ignorance, I am unaware of.

My criticism is directed at how the Mass has been stripped of its beauty and turned into a kumbaya fest that, , IMO, detracts from the celebration of our Savior’s Sacrifice.

[ArrogantBustard]

I'm soooooo sorry.

You called it a monstrosity.

Calling the Mass a "monstrosity" is monstrous.

Calling abuses of the Mass "monstrosities", or "abhominations", or any number of other epithets is deserved.

But that's not what you did.

My criticism is directed at how the Mass has been stripped of its beauty and turned into a kumbaya fest that, , IMO, detracts from the celebration of our Savior’s Sacrifice.

Are you referring to the widespread abuses of the Mass, or to the Mass itself?

[Bigg Red]

Are you referring to the widespread abuses of the Mass...

&&
Yes, of course. I would not call the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass a monstrosity.

I am no theologian and not religious scholar of any sort, but I know that, during the course of my lifetime, I have seen the liturgy robbed of its beauty and diminished in its capacity to inspire reverence. I have, consequently, felt robbed, myself, of the deep level of experiencing the Holy Mystery that I once was afforded. After all these years, I still grieve for that.

Interestingly enough, not long after posting comments here, I spotted this posting. This priest sums up extremely well much of what I feel has been lost.

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-religion/1888300/posts

BTW, I think that the word you were going for is “abomination”.

[Bigg Red]

Sorry, this part of my last post to you was an erroneous fragment that should have been deleted:

Interestingly enough, not long after posting comments here, I spotted this posting. This priest sums up extremely well much of what I feel has been lost.

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-religion/1888300/posts

[ArrogantBustard]

Thank you for clarifying that. I’ve seen some downright blasphemous rhetoric from self described Traditionalists. Not knowing you or what position you take on the matter of the current Mass, I did not wish to let that bit go unchallenged.

Thanks for the link. I’ve already been there. It’s an excellent thread.

[fr maximilian mary]

Ave Maria!

Thanks for the prayers. The training with the Priestly Fraternity of St. Peter priest, Rev. Mark Fischer, went very well. We should have 3 priests offering the extraordinary form of the Roman Rite, the Tridentine Mass, on a regular basis. We will start with low Mass on Fridays and go from there.

Introibo ad altare Deum...

[Smokin' Joe]

When the priest has his back to the people while praying the Canon of the Mass two things likely: 1. people realize that they are NOT the center of attention; God is and 2. the Mass is a re-enactment of the SACRIFICE of the Son in whom we are baptized to the Father...

Spot on.

[Salvation]

We are all called through our baptism and confirmation to spread the Gospel and call people to conversion through evangelizing. It’s not really a priesthood, but it is definitely a lay position that has been sorely neglected in the Catholic Church. It is starting to get worken up — thanks be to God!

[roamer]

Thanks for the prayers.  The training with the Priestly Fraternity of St. Peter priest, Rev. Mark Fischer, went very well.  We should have 3 priests offering the extraordinary form of the Roman Rite, the Tridentine Mass, on a regular basis.  We will start with low Mass on Fridays and go from there.

Wow!  That is very good news.  I have been thinking about you and your request.  I wanted to know the outcome of your test, but didn't know how to ask you.  It never entered my mind to sign on to see if you responded (*s*).  Congratulations!!

I will continue to keep you in my prayers.  We need good Priest to carry our Tradition.  I think that we came very close to losing it and many people don't even know it.

Sorry that this is so late -- I just don't sign on everyday, but I do pray everyday.