Posted on 12/04/2006 7:52:47 PM PST by Pyro7480
'The Nativity Story' Movie Problematic for Catholics, "Unsuitable" for Young Children
By John-Henry Westen
NEW YORK, December 4, 2006 (LifeSiteNews.com) - A review of New Line Cinema's The Nativity story by Fr. Angelo Mary Geiger of the Franciscans of the Immaculate in the United States, points out that the film, which opened December 1, misinterprets scripture from a Catholic perspective.
While Fr. Geiger admits that he found the film is "in general, to be a pious and reverential presentation of the Christmas mystery." He adds however, that "not only does the movie get the Virgin Birth wrong, it thoroughly Protestantizes its portrayal of Our Lady."
In Isaiah 7:14 the Bible predicts the coming of the Messiah saying: "Therefore the Lord himself shall give you a sign. Behold a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and his name shall be called Emmanuel." Fr. Geiger, in an video blog post, explains that the Catholic Church has taught for over 2000 years that the referenced Scripture showed that Mary would not only conceive the child miraculously, but would give birth to the child miraculously - keeping her physical virginity intact during the birth.
The film, he suggests, in portraying a natural, painful birth of Christ, thus denies the truth of the virginal and miraculous birth of Christ, which, he notes, the Fathers of the Church compared to light passing through glass without breaking it. Fr. Geiger quoted the fourth century St. Augustine on the matter saying. "That same power which brought the body of the young man through closed doors, brought the body of the infant forth from the inviolate womb of the mother."
Fr. Geiger contrasts The Nativity Story with The Passion of the Christ, noting that with the latter, Catholics and Protestants could agree to support it. He suggests, however, that the latter is "a virtual coup against Catholic Mariology".
The characterization of Mary further debases her as Fr. Geiger relates in his review. "Mary in The Nativity lacks depth and stature, and becomes the subject of a treatment on teenage psychology."
Beyond the non-miraculous birth, the biggest let-down for Catholics comes from Director Catherine Hardwicke's own words. Hardwicke explains her rationale in an interview: "We wanted her [Mary] to feel accessible to a young teenager, so she wouldn't seem so far away from their life that it had no meaning for them. I wanted them to see Mary as a girl, as a teenager at first, not perfectly pious from the very first moment. So you see Mary going through stuff with her parents where they say, 'You're going to marry this guy, and these are the rules you have to follow.' Her father is telling her that she's not to have sex with Joseph for a year-and Joseph is standing right there."
Comments Fr. Geiger, "it is rather disconcerting to see Our Blessed Mother portrayed with 'attitude;' asserting herself in a rather anachronistic rebellion against an arranged marriage, choosing her words carefully with her parents, and posing meaningful silences toward those who do not understand her."
Fr. Geiger adds that the film also contains "an overly graphic scene of St. Elizabeth giving birth," which is "just not suitable, in my opinion, for young children to view."
Despite its flaws Fr. Geiger, after viewing the film, also has some good things to say about it. "Today, one must commend any sincere attempt to put Christ back into Christmas, and this film is certainly one of them," he says. "The Nativity Story in no way compares to the masterpiece which is The Passion of the Christ, but it is at least sincere, untainted by cynicism, and a worthy effort by Hollywood to end the prejudice against Christianity in the public square."
And, in addition to a good portrait of St. Joseph, the film offers "at least one cinematic and spiritual triumph" in portraying the Visitation of Mary to St. Elizabeth. "Although the Magnificat is relegated to a kind of epilogue at the movie's end, the meeting between Mary and Elizabeth is otherwise faithful to the scriptures and quite poignant. In a separate scene, the two women experience the concurrent movement of their children in utero and share deeply in each other's joy. I can't think of another piece of celluloid that illustrates the dignity of the unborn child better than this."
See Fr. Geiger's full review here:
http://airmaria.com/
You mean as in Matthew 4:4 "Man does not live by bread alone, but by every word (ρηματι, rhemati from rhema) that proceeds from the mouth of God"?
more or less..
Please consider voting in my personal request poll influencing my posting writing style at post #36 on:
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/1822163/posts?page=37
Truly, every Christian has received at least one divine revelation: that Jesus Christ is Lord. That is not something man can arrive at by mental reasoning or by closing his eyes, covering his eyes, gritting his teeth and repeating over and over to himself "I believe."
And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father. - John 6:65
Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God: - 1 John 4:2
But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you. My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: - John 10:26-27
Amazing that some would think belief comes first when it is being born again that comes first.. the belief is ancillary.. and secondary.. Therefore some heretic's are/can be sheep but merely in error(possibly) about some things.. Belief can be altered or adjusted.. but there is no way to be UN-born again..
Dr. Eckleburg: Believers receive the Holy Spirit. Believers make up a congregation. The Holy Spirit speaks to and regenerates the individual heart of each believer. The congregation and the groups of congregations making up the church exist to preach the Good News of the Gospel and to enjoy glorying God in unison.
The church exists by the will of God, led by the Holy Spirit, to serve Jesus Christ. Not vice versa.
Everything, absolutely everything, is subordinate to Jesus Christ.
Truly, the thought of the Church - or any thing other than a mortal man - being able to receive the Holy Spirit strikes me as bizarre since Jesus was speaking to Nicodemus, a man, telling him that he must be born again.
Jesus did. He lives today in all God's Children, "walking through the cities of the plague (Dylan)." As Scripture says, "to the pure all things are pure," and the grand truth is that when lepers begged to be touched by Christ and He reached out his hand, embracing them with all His will, the lepers were healed, while He remained immune to their infection. Awesome, Holy God.
From everything that I have read, this is correct. Russian Orthodoxy is different than Serb Orthodoxy which is different from Greek Orthodoxy. My suspicion is that they hold to the fundamentals but they vary in cultural areas.
That would make one wonder why America Orthodoxy would be different from any other type of Orthodoxy? They are simply following cultural trends of the nation. Perhaps I'm missing something.
I'm not sure that I read the verse quite that way. :
John 15:2 Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit. KJV
Now, the NIV, which I normally quote, says "cuts off" rather than "taketh away". That makes this a little more difficult for me. Nevertheless, I have taken either phrase to mean general discipline by God, or possibly death, as you see it. The problem I have with the death option is how to reconcile it with (POTS) verses like Phil. 1:6. He carries the good work on to completion. The death option appears to imply that man can thwart that good work begun. I don't think I can buy that because it would seem to destroy POTS. However, there is logic in your reading since "pruning" is specifically and separately mentioned. Frankly, I'm not sure what the best explanation of this verse is. :)
Moreover, one can have a 'dead faith' and still be saved as shown by 2Tim.2:13, 'if we believe not, yet he abideth faithful; he cannot deny himself', indicating a believer who has lost his faith, yet remains saved.
"Dead faith" is probably too strong for me. :) To me a dead faith is a false faith, is no faith. I don't think we can completely lose a once held true faith. We can wander or suffer, but I don't think the scriptures teach that we can totally abandon the gift of God. We are, after all, a new creation. We are permanently changed, for all time.
AMEN, brother!
He has no point. He has froth around his mouth. I showed why his jabs at the Church do not follow from the scripture he pretends to be reading. Let us see if Westmister Confession, and your remarks, patched his opus up sufficiently for the whole to begin to make sense.
Papists believe their good works can earn them salvation, while Protestants know that good works are the result of the Holy Spirit opening our hearts to God because of Christ's atonement alone
I understand the Calvin's throad clearings had to do with it. Problem with this statement is, either the Church does not teach it or there is no scripture to back it up, depending how you weasel around the words. Good works, we teach, advance out sanctification and are necessary for salvation as they form faith. They do not earn salvation in any transactional sense, but rather they form our faith, and of course all of it is only possible because of the merits of Christ. This is what the scripture teaches (2 Romans 2:6-10, James 2:11-26, Luke 17:5-10, 1 Cor 13:13), and Calvin should be addressing. Naked sloganeering is not helping his cause.
Calvin here refers to the fact that the RCC teaches you must be forgiven over and over and over again
He is referring to that, but he is wrong and does not provide any support for his error. I covered that in my previous post.
Baptism flows from the Holy Spirit and is accomplished by the will of God, not the will of the church.
I do not dispute that the individual baptism and the individual gift of salvation go together; I would not dogmatically put one over the other as the scripture does not do so; your own speculation does. The decision to baptize or not baptize belongs to the sponsors and secondarily to the Church. Regardless of the individual disposition of the participants, any valid baptism is baptism into the Catholic Chruch, as there is no other. If Calvine has any dispute with this Catohlic teaching. he failed to express it.
Believers make up a congregation
This is not scriptural. "I shall build my Church", not "you shall make up congregations".
invisible/visible
is an exptrascriptural speculation. The scruiptural truth is tha tthe Church is the mystical body of Christ, build on the rock of Peter, one body, one doctrine, one baptism.
pass.
I don’t understand what your contention is. The clergy actiong in the person of Christ effects the sacraments of the Church, under the canon law that the Church establishes. Why?
- As my Father had sent me so I send you;
- bind and loose on earth and accordingly it will be bound and loosened in heaven
In this passage, Christ says that calling out His name is not evidence that He knows a person:
But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you. My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: - John 10:26-27
Ye have been rebellious against the LORD from the day that I knew you. Deu 9:24
They sacrificed unto devils, not to God; to gods whom they knew not, to new [gods that] came newly up, whom your fathers feared not. Deu 32:17
For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and shall be joined unto his wife, and they two shall be one flesh. This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church. Eph 5:31-32
Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder. Matt 19:6
But this is that which was spoken by the prophet Joel; And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams: And on my servants and on my handmaidens I will pour out in those days of my Spirit; and they shall prophesy: And I will shew wonders in heaven above, and signs in the earth beneath; blood, and fire, and vapour of smoke: The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before that great and notable day of the Lord come: And it shall come to pass, [that] whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved. - Acts 2:16-21
But, A-G, it is obvious that Peter did not really believe. If he did, he would not have denied Christ; he would not have started sinking on the lake, etc. He said he believed, but when challeneged, his faith failed.
If his faith was given, as you say, then his faith was also taken away. We have no control over it. If God gave Peter the faith to say what he is quoted as saying Mat 16, then God must have taken that faith away from him when he denied Jesus shortly thereafter.
But, the truth is, Peter did not say Jesus is God. We read into this for obvious reasons. In the context of the Jewish mindset of a simple fisherman, he said (stripped of all the hyped tag-names) "You are the anointed one, the favored one of the living God." He does not say that Jesus is God.
Those favored by the living God (i.e. son of God) was a title of angels (benei Elohim, sons of God, as in Job), powerful Jewish kings (of Davidian line), even powerful individuals, or simply those in "filial" relationship with God (adopted by Him):
Every Jewish king was believed anoinited by God. And Jewish messiah was supposed to be a Jewish king in the literal sense, and therefore anointed by God, not divine. Peter is simply stating that Jesus was that (future) king.
Many people think Jesus was condemned because He claimed to be the Son of God. That is patently false! He was condemned because He claimed that He had the power to forgive sins, which made Him equal to God, and that was blasphemy.
When you really think about it, the scenario is a mind-boggling: a poor carpenter from Nazareth convincing a dozen or so illiterate peasants and fisherman that He is really the savior king of Israel, and that they are His royal lieutenants.
It was probably believable until things started getting rough, then the whole thing fell apart. The real belief did not start until after His resurrection (a percieved miracle and not some divine "message" from God, downloaded into their hearts, as Paul claimed his).
But even then they doubted and wanted "proof." Thomas doubted aloud. But they all had their doubts. Not one of them is quoted as saying "Of course! I knew it" when the news reached that that Christ was no longer in His tomb.
What makes us Christians is an irrational belief (or hope) in bodily resurrection. But even Paul teaches to the contrary: "I tell you this, brethren: flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God, nor does the perishable inherit the imperishable." [I Corinthians 15:50]
This tells me that Paul believed (consistent with his Judaism) in spiritual resurrection, but not one of the body (this would also be very consistent with some other very Gnostic statements of Paul's earlier writings).
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