Posted on 09/30/2003 12:19:22 PM PDT by sheltonmac
The South's unconditional surrender in 1865 apparently was unacceptable to today's Neo-Confederates.
They'd like to rewrite history, demonizing Abraham Lincoln and the federal government that forced them to remain in the awful United States against their will.
On top of that, now they are opposing the U.S. Navy's plan to bury the crew of the CSS H.L. Hunley under the American flag next year.
The Hunley was the first submarine to sink an enemy vessel. In 1863, it rammed and fatally damaged the Union warship USS Housatonic with a fixed torpedo, but then the manually driven sub sank on its way home, killing its eight-man crew.
It might have been a lucky shot from the Housatonic, leaks caused by the torpedo explosion, an accidental strike by another Union ship, malfunction of its snorkel valves, damage to its steering planes or getting stuck in the mud.
In any case, the Navy found and raised its remains and plans a full-dress military funeral and burial service on April 17, 2004, in Charleston, S.C. The four-mile funeral procession is expected to draw 10,000 to 20,000 people, many in period costume or Confederate battle dress.
But the Sons of Confederate Veterans, generally a moderate group that works diligently to preserve Southern history and heritage, has a radical wing that is salivating with anger.
One Texas Confederate has drawn 1,600 signatures on a petition saying "the flag of their eternal enemy, the United States of America," must not fly over the Hunley crew's funeral.
To their credit, the funeral's organizers will leave the U.S. flag flying.
After all, the search and preservation of the Hunley artifacts, as well as the funeral itself, were paid for by U.S. taxpayers.
Also, the Hunley crew was born under the Stars and Stripes. The Confederacy was never an internationally recognized nation, so the crewmen also died as citizens of the United States.
They were in rebellion, but they were still Americans.
This whole issue is an insult to all Southerners who fought under the U.S. flag before and since the Civil War.
But it isn't the only outrage by rabid secessionists.
They are also opposing the placement of a statue of Abraham Lincoln in Richmond, Va., the Confederate capital.
According to an article by Bob Moser and published in the Southern Poverty Law Center's magazine "Intelligence Report," which monitors right-wing and hate groups, the U.S. Historical Society announced it was donating a statue of Lincoln to Richmond.
Lincoln visited that city in April 1865 to begin healing the wounds caused by the war.
The proposed life-sized statue has Lincoln resting on a bench, looking sad, his arm around his 12-year-old son, Tad. The base of the statue has a quote from his second inaugural address.
However, the League of the South and the Sons of Confederate Veterans raised a stink, calling Lincoln a tyrant and war criminal. Neo-Confederates are trying to make Lincoln "a figure few history students would recognize: a racist dictator who trashed the Constitution and turned the USA into an imperialist welfare state," Moser's article says.
White supremacist groups have jumped onto the bandwagon. Their motto is "Taking America back starts with taking Lincoln down."
Actually, if it weren't for the forgiving nature of Lincoln, Richmond would be a smoking hole in the ground and hundreds of Confederate leaders -- including Jefferson Davis -- would be hanging from trees from Fredericksburg, Va., to Atlanta.
Robert E. Lee said, "I surrendered as much to Lincoln's goodness as I did to Grant's armies."
Revisionist history to suit a political agenda is as intellectually abhorrent as whitewashing slavery itself. It's racism under a different flag. While it's not a criminal offense, it is a crime against truth and history.
I'm not talking about re-enactors here. These folks just want to live history. But the Neo-Confederate movement is a disguised attempt to change history.
In the end, the Confederacy was out-fought, out-lasted, eventually out-generaled and totally over-matched. It was a criminal idea to start with, and its success would have changed the course of modern history for the worse.
Coming to that realization cost this nation half a million lives.
So I hope that all Neo-Confederates -- 140 years after the fact -- can finally get out of their racist, twisted, angry time machine and join us here in 2003.
But what shall we do with the negroes after they are free? I can hardly believe that the South and North can live in peace, unless we can get rid of the negroes. Certainly they cannot if we don't get rid of the negroes whom we have armed and disciplined and who have fought with us, to the amount, I believe, of some one hundred and fifty thousand men. I believe that it would be better to export them all to some fertile country with a good climate, which they could have to themselves. You have been a stanch friend of the race from the time you first advised me to enlist them at New Orleans. You have had a good deal of experience in moving bodies of men by water,--your movement up the James was a magnificent one. Now, we shall have no use for our very large navy; what, then, are our difficulties in sending all the blacks away?" - Abraham Lincoln, April 11, 1865, quoted in Butler's Book, p. 903
After 1862, President Lincoln dropped the idea of colonization.
The facts indicate otherwise. In November 1864 he asked the Attorney General for a ruling that would let him keep Mitchell to continue colonization. In April 1865 he asked his longtime political advisor and ally Gen. Benjamin Butler to devise a colonization plan. Meanwhile there is absolutely no substantial evidence, direct or indirect, that Lincoln ever abandoned or repudiated his previous colonization beliefs.
In order to be "racist" a statement must attack one or more particular RACES. Are you maintaining that yankees are a distinct race onto themselves?
Lincoln really should have informed HIS Department of the Interior.
|LINK|
RECORDS OF THE OFFICE OF THE SECRETARY OF THE INTERIOR (RECORD GROUP 48)
Records of the Office of the Secretary of the Interior Relating to the Suppression of the African Slave Trade and Negro Colonization, 1854-1872. M160. 10 rolls. DP.
[3] (2) Communications from the Department of State, Nov. 6, 1860-Nov. 7, 1870, including letters referred by that department to the Secretary of the Interior; correspondence relating to the slave ships Delicia and William L. Cogswell; letters relating to colonization on the island of Fernando Po near Kingston, Jamaica, and at Quito, Ecuador; and information concerning the activities and termination of the Mixed Courts of Justice
[3] (5) Communications from the Treasury Department, July 18, 1860-Feb. 3, 1872, relating mainly to salary drafts of personnel of the Mixed Courts of Justice and of special agents outside the United States, accounts of U.S. marshals, and payment of prize money. Included are a copy of a contract between the United States and the American Colonization Society and a statement of the expenses and disbursements of the U.S. marshal at New York, Dec. 18, 1862-Sept. 18, 1864
[6] (2) Communications relating to T. I. Moreno, U.S. marshal for the Southern District of Florida, May 4, 1860-Apr. 3, 1862, including reports on various slave ships; correspondence relating to drafts drawn by Moreno; reports concerning recaptured Africans transported to Liberia on ships of the American Colonization Society; a statistical report showing the number of births and deaths among the Africans at Key West, FL, and the number transported to Liberia; and correspondence and testimonials pertaining to Moreno's loyalty to the Union
[8] (1) Communications relating to Rev. James Mitchell, emigration agent of the Department of the Interior, Apr. 8, 1862-June 6, 1865, including correspondence promoting colonization in Haiti, a draft of a letter from the Secretary of the Interior to President Lincoln recommending the discontinuance of Mitchell's services, correspondence between Mitchell and the Secretary relating to the former's position and authority, letters concerning Mitchell's claim for compensation, and a copy of a report from Mitchell to President Lincoln concerning colonization
[8] (2) Miscellaneous letters pertaining to colonization, May 23, 1860-oct. 10, 1868, including communications to the Secretary of State concerning offers to transport recaptured blacks to Liberia; requests for appointment as agents, reports from agents; a copy of a note from the Spanish Minister to the Secretary of State concerning colonization on the island of Fernando Po; communications relating to proposed colonization on the islands of Guadeloupe and Martinique and in Mexico; and colonization accounts
[8] (3) Communications relating to colonization in British Honduras, Mar. 7, 1861-May 20, 1863, including several of the James Grant papers, copies of original land grants in British Honduras, letters from John Hodge, an agent of the British Honduras Company, and pamphlets concerning the advantages of colonization in British Honduras
[8] (4) Communications relating to S. C. Pomeroy, U.S. colonization agent, Sept. 12, 1862-Jan. 30, 1872, including a copy of his instructions, a contract between the United States and Ambrose Thompson pertaining to colonization on the Isthmus of Chiriqui, and correspondence regarding the settlement of accounts
[8] (5) Records relating to negotiations with Denmark concerning colonization, Apr. 23, 1862-Oct. 3, 1865. Included are an agreement dated July 19, 1862, as to the receiving of recaptured blacks in St. Croix, Danish West Indies; printed and manuscript copies of the provisional act to regulate the relations between the proprietors of landed estates and the rural population of free laborers of the Danish West Indies; and a communication from the Danish Legation to the State Department regarding the agreement of 1861
[8] (6) Miscellaneous contracts and agreements pertaining to colonization, 1860-65, including proposals for furnishing ships to transport blacks from Key West, FL; copies of contracts with the American Colonization Society for transporting blacks from Key West to Liberia and for the support of liberated Africans; a copy of an agreement between the Republic of Liberia and the American Colonization Society regarding recaptured Africans landed in Liberia by the society under its contract with the United States; several drafts of contracts; the charter of the ship Ocean Ranger; a printed statement relating to the colonization of free blacks at Ile a Vache; and a draft of a Haitian proclamation relating to colonization
[8] (7) Requisitions and letters, 1861-66, mainly letters from G. C. Whiting to the Secretary of the Interior or to the disbursing agent requesting requisitions for the U.S. marshals and attorneys or for Rev. James Mitchell
[9] (4) Communications, Feb. 9, 1863-Jan. 18, 1869, relating to the claim of James De Long, U.S. consul at Aux Cayes, Haiti, for money expended assisting the colonists at Ile a Vache
[10] (1) Communications from Rev. John Seys, U.S. agent for liberated Africans at Monrovia, 1860-65, consisting of accounts and receipts for expenditures; reports concerning the arrival of American Colonization Society vessels and the condition of liberated Africans; and a report to the Secretary of the Interior concerning the contract between the American Colonization Society and the Liberian government and the number of recaptured Africans delivered to the society's agent
[10] (2) Accounts and financial correspondence of the American Colonization Society, Jan. 1861-May 1863, including communications from the Treasury Department to the Department of the Interior concerning accounts of the society
[10] (3) Communications pertaining to Rev. William McLain, financial secretary of the American Colonization Society, May 23, 1860-Dec. 2, 1868, including proposals for transporting Africans to Liberia, letters from McLain relating to the sailing schedules of the society's ships, letters transmitting reports to the department from agents; and correspondence concerning the claim of the American Colonization Society for the support of recaptured Africans
MANHATTAN X-FILES
Mulder, having travelled in the belly of the beast, emerges at 8th avenue and 34th street and looks back at Penn Station. He sees the Garden. [Madison Square]. Scully emerges from the subway station.
[Mulder] Scully, quick, follow me!
[Scully] Mulder, where are we going?
[Mulder] They're out there Scully, they're out there!
[Scully] Who's out there, Mulder? Little green men?
[Mulder] No Scully, rednecks.
[Scully] Who told you New York was full of rednecks, Mulder?
[Mulder] My secret source, Mike, from Chicago.
[Scully] Why did he talk?
[Mulder] He's being held to ransom.
[Scully] What are we looking for?
[Mulder] The Redneck leader.
[Scully] But how do we find him? What do we look for?
[Mulder] Up in mid-town Scully, we're looking for a really big trailer park with Confederate flags all over the place.
[Scully] How will we find the Redneck leader?
[Mulder] He's the one in the double-wide.
[Wlat] Shovel that crap back in your manure wagon. The Judiciary Act of 1789 requires that "controversies of a civil nature" be submitted to the Supreme Court. That's why the slave power didn't dare bring any of this crap before the courts.
Wlat, you left a few of your Tennessee dingbat guano droppings out of your incomplete irrelevant load of crap quote.
SEC . 13. And be it further enacted, That the Supreme Court shall have exclusive jurisdiction of all controversies of a civil nature, where a state is a party, except between a state and its citizens; and except also between a state and citizens of other states, or aliens, in which latter case it shall have original but not exclusive jurisdiction. ...
In an attempt to arrest your advanced case of recto-cranial inversion, I will explain it one more time. NO federal law can determine a Constitutional question.
Your Militia Law and Judiciary Act are equally irrelevant, which explains why no legal expert even discusses them in this context.
Assume you could find a Federal law called the Prohibition of Secession Act. Assume further that it states, explicitly, "Secession from the Union is prohibited."
If secession violates the Constitution, the Federal law would do nothing that was not already done by the Constitution. If secession does not violate the Constitution, the Federal law is unconstitutional, null and void. In either case, it would be the Constitution that would decide the issue, not some law passed by Congress.
If Congress passed, and the President signed, a law declaring abortion unlawful in all cases, it would be as irrelevant as your inane comments. The Court has held abortion to be a Constitutional issue. Only laws made pursuant to the Constitution can be valid and meaningful.
Letter on the Relation of the White and African Races in the United States Showing the Necessity of the Colonization of the Latter
Addressed to President Abraham Lincoln
May 18, 1862
Let us then, earnestly and respectfully recommend as a remedy for our present troubles and future danger, the perfecting the proposed plans of the administration in regard to those two conflicting races, and the careful and gradual removal of the colored race to some desirable and convenient home. This suggests that the tropical lands of our own hemisphere should be devoted to their use, and that all available means should be seized to pour a flood of Anglo-African civilization on the tropical lands of the old hemisphere most accessible to us (Western Africa.) In doing this we take from imperialism its temptation to tamper with our republicanism; for by preserving the heterogeneous character of our population, we perpetuate our republican equality in social and civil life.It further suggests that our legislation should cover the wants and well-being of both races, and that statesmen should consider, first, the good of the white race, then, the good and well-being of the black; making at least as liberal appropriations for the colonization of the Indian, upon whom millions on millions have been expended with but imperfect success in the cause of civilization, whilst the slender means of the friends of the African civilization have produced lasting results. Some affect to fear that the man of color will not remove to a separate locality. It is not to be expected that a race, which has hardly attained a mental majority, will rise in a day to the stature of the men who found empires, build cities, and lay the ground work of civil institutions like ours; nor should they be expected to do this unaided and alone. They should receive the kind attention, direction, and aid of those who understand such things; nor will the world condemn a gentle pressure in the forward course to overcome the natural inertia of masses long used to the driver's will and rod. Let us do justice in the provision we make for their future comfort, and surety they will do justice to our distracted Republic. If they should fail to do this, there would then be more propriety in weighing the requirement of some to remove without consultation, but not till then. The more intelligent men of color can now see the necessity that rests upon us, and they will aid us in this work. We know that there is a growing sentiment in the country which considered the removal of the freed man, without consulting him, "a moral and military necessity" -- as a measure necessary to the purity of public morals and the peace of the country; and this unhappy war of white man with white man, about the condition of the black, will multiply this sentiment. But we cannot go further now than suggesting, that the mandatory relation held by the rebel master should escheat to the Federal government in a modified sense, so as to enable his proper government and gradual removal to a proper home where he can be independent.
Perhaps he merely considered Butler a better choice than Ninian W. Edwards whom he utilized on the Chiriqui project.
Ninian Wirt Edwards
In August 1861, Ninian Wirt Edwards was appointed by President Lincoln captain commissary of subsistence, which appointment he held until 22 June 1865.
Abraham Lincoln Papers at the Library of Congress. Transcribed and Annotated by the Lincoln Studies Center, Knox College. Galesburg, Illinois.
From Ozias M. Hatch, William Butler, and Jesse K. Dubois to Abraham Lincoln, July 22, 1861
Springfield. Illinois July 22d 1861
Dr Sir.
It is reported in this city, that you have written a letter to Mr Ninian W. Edwards, in which you say, "that as soon as Congress passes the necessary laws, you will appoint him Quarter Master, to be assigned duty and attached to General Fremonts Division." 1 We do not believe that you have written such a letter, although it comes to us upon what, under ordinary circumstances, would be good authority. For several years we have been ferriting out, and exposing, the most stupendous and unprecedented frauds ever perpetrated in this country, by men closely connected with Mr Edwards. The desperate character of this contest, and its results you know as well as we do. Knowing all this we cannot, as we have said, believe it to be true. We wish however to protest against such an appointment, in the most emphatic manner, and do most solemnly protest against it. If appointed we feel assured that he may be an instrument only, in the hands of these men, with Gov Matteson at their head.
[Note 1 Lincoln appointed Ninian Edwards a captain and commissary of subsistence in August 1861.]
We do not charge corruption upon Mr Edwards, but do say from association and circumstances he ought not to be appointed to said office.
Respectfully and Truly Yours,
O. M. Hatch Sec. State.
William Butler Treasurer
Jesse K Dubois Auditor
Abraham Lincoln Papers at the Library of Congress. Transcribed and Annotated by the Lincoln Studies Center, Knox College. Galesburg, Illinois.
From Jesse K. Dubois, William Butler, and Ozias M. Hatch to Abraham Lincoln, October 21, 1861
Springfield October 21st 1861
Dr Sir.
As we predicted, Joel A. Matteson, under a contract made with between Ninian W. Edwards commissary on the one part, and Dr Fowler and Mr Gooddell of the other part, is now, in person, furnishing subsistence to the troops at Camp Butler; and claims the right to do so at the other encampments in this state. We again insist that this outrage against common decency be corrected. We protest that Mr Edwards is not, or ought not to be permitted to make such contracts, and we respectfully ask that he be assigned to duty, elsewhere, and be required to contract directly with honest men, and not indirectly with thieves and scoundrels.
Respectfully Your friends
Jesse K Dubois
William Butler
O. M. Hatch
Abraham Lincoln Papers at the Library of Congress. Transcribed and Annotated by the Lincoln Studies Center, Knox College. Galesburg, Illinois.
From Ninian W. Edwards to Abraham Lincoln, August 9, 1861
Washington City. D. C.
Aug. 9th. 1861.
Dear Sir
I have carefully examined the matters referred to me by the President you--, and set forth in the printed paper hereto attached and have found the general and leading statements set forth in said printed paper fully verified--
The subject has been twice before Congress. An appropriation of $10.000 was made June 22. 1860, to obtain a survey of the harbors, and to ascertain the quantity and quality of coal upon the lands of the Chiriqui Improvement Company, as well as the practicability of connecting the harbors by Railroad--
The evidences are, upon these questions, therefore, documentary -- obtained by the officers of the U. S. government; and published in the Executive documents of Congress -- such evidence as this, I take for granted, may be deemed entirely reliable-- It is contained in a report of the persons who were sent, in pursuance of an act of Congress, to the Isthmus of Chiriqui to examine into and report upon the quality and probable quantity of coal to be found there upon the lands of the Chiriqui Improvement Company; upon the character of the harbors of Chiriqui lagoon and Goljito; upon the practicability of building a rail road across said isthmus, so as to connect said harbor; and generally upon the value of the privileges contracted for in a conditional contract made by the Secretary of the Navy, and Ambrose W Thompson and the Chiriqui Improvement Company--
The report of Commodore Engle declares the harbors to be "great" grand" & incomparable" -- superior in every requisite for naval purposes, to any that are known--
The report of the government geologist Dr Evans, shows that the coal is inexhaustible in quantity, while the analysis of it by Dr Jackson -- a well known geologist of Boston, proves its quality to be of the best kind, and highly desirable for steam purposes--
The report of the Surveyor, Lieut. Morton, declares that a railroad is entirely practicable--
The titles have heretofore undergone examination-- In the documents of Congress all the evidences seem to have been produced -- and these shew them to be perfect-- The Minister Plenipotentiary from New Grenada to the United States has given an official certificate, under the seal of his Legation that they are "authentic and as such entitled to full faith and credit"
...yada...yada...yada...
But what shall we do with the negroes after they are free? I can hardly believe that the South and North can live in peace, unless we can get rid of the negroes. Certainly they cannot if we don't get rid of the negroes whom we have armed and disciplined and who have fought with us, to the amount, I believe, of some one hundred and fifty thousand men. I believe that it would be better to export them all to some fertile country with a good climate, which they could have to themselves. You have been a stanch friend of the race from the time you first advised me to enlist them at New Orleans. You have had a good deal of experience in moving bodies of men by water,--your movement up the James was a magnificent one. Now, we shall have no use for our very large navy; what, then, are our difficulties in sending all the blacks away?" - Abraham Lincoln, April 11, 1865, quoted in Butler's Book, p. 903
That's Butler quoting Lincoln.
After 1862, President Lincoln dropped the idea of colonization and began to work for voting rights for black soldiers.
Butler's account of this conversation cannot be corroborated; it is useless as source material in any case.
Walt
Mitchell's position became a sinecure.
Walt
When did he do this?
Nathaniel Banks was by far the most inept of union commanders.
I think that it would have been a close race between Butler, Banks, and Siegal but that's another discussion.
Yada, yada, yada indeed. Where in there was the forced deportation of anyone mentioned?
You mean the kind of voluntary colonization that had been going on for 40 years or so?
Just as Mitchell's letter indicates this was only a small scale colonization attempt and was intended to precede a larger one at the end of the war which could include forced colonization.
So now it's a plot? A long term scheme to accomplish the forced removal of over 4 million people? Where is that brought out in the memo?
After 1862 President Lincoln is amply on the record as supporting voting rights for blacks. That is why Booth shot him.
He is on the record thanking the governor of Massachusetts for taking blacks as permanent residents.
He is nowhere on the record supporting colonization. He dropped the idea.
Walt
As I already noted you are wrong on this, and despite your disappointment Walt, Yankees are not a race.
Please inform me of what I have posted that is from the "Klan". But as an aside, when someone from the KKK told you that the sun rose yesterday, it would still be the truth.
I have yet to see any poster on this forum espousing the separation of the races, or that one race is superior to another, or for the return of slavery to America. My support for Confederates is based on my belief in the legality of their actions, which was recognized by the Constitution of the United States Of America, and by much of the known world. It still exists today in parts of Africa, the Middle East, and parts of the Far East - primarily in Muslim countries.
I find it curious that the condemnation is reserved for a PART of a country that participated in the practice of slavery when the entire country had done so at one time, each state agreeing to it via their ratification of the Constitution.
Clearly you are in denial of Lincoln's own words. I have posted all the excerpts and links to his views on colonization.
I post facts, you call names.
the arrogant, ignorant, self-righteous damnyankees are almost without exception RUDE, vulgar & loudmouthed when they come south.(could it be that only the most objectionable of northerners, i.e.,the damnedyankees come south???)
we wish all of them would stay home.
free dixie,sw
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