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Battle over evolution heating up
News 8 Austin ^ | 8/20/2003 | Antonio Castelan

Posted on 08/20/2003 6:24:57 PM PDT by new cruelty

The debate continues over what information Texas biology books should present.

The Texas Board of Education is looking to pick the best science book for students.

Members of a campaign called "Stand Up For Science'' said it's meant to protect the accurate teaching of evolution in Texas high school biology textbooks.

The push was unveiled on Wednesday by some religious leaders, scientists and parents. It comes as the state Board of Education prepares to adopt new biology textbooks this fall.

Terry Maxwell, a professor of biology at Angelo State University, doesn't believe creationism should be in biology textbooks.

"Science uses evidentiary reasoning and it uses no other approach," he said.

Creationists generally believe earth was formed supernaturally by God.

Reverend Tom Hegar said while he believes in God's powers, those ideas need to stay at home or in the church.

"Faith and science are complimentary. Don't use faith to build your science. Don't use science to try to destroy or shrink my faith," he said.

Seattle-based Discovery Institute believes the theory of intelligent design should be in Texas biology books. According to the Institute, intelligent design is the hypothesis that certain features of the universe and of living things are best explained by an intelligent cause, not an undirected process such as natural selection.

Science backers say that's the same thing as creationism.

"Textbooks should fix embarrassing factual errors and tell students about the scientific weakness of neo-Darwinism as well as its strengths," Discovery Institute officials stated in a faxed memo.

Maxwell said two different ideologies make it harder for students to learn science.

"If you interject ways of knowing other than the way science is practiced by mainstream science you confuse children," he said.

Austin biology teacher Amanda Walker said evolution is the cornerstone for understanding the living world, and influences medicine such as prostate cancer, heart disease and AIDS.

The evolution proponents also criticized what they said are attempts to teach creationist theories.

The Board of Education can reject books because of errors or failure to follow the state curriculum.

The board will make its final decision on the biology textbooks in November.

People have until Thursday, Aug. 21, to sign up to speak at the final public hearing Sept. 10.

In July, the first public hearing brought 42 speakers who offered their opinions at the public hearing on biology, but only half of them were familiar with the particular books.

Board member Gail Lowe said then she was disappointed that many of the people who testified for or against certain textbooks hadn't actually read them.

"They seem to be here to express a viewpoint, but it doesn't seem to relate to the textbooks we're actually considering," she said.


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Extended News; Front Page News; Government; News/Current Events; Philosophy; US: Texas
KEYWORDS: biology; creation; crevolist; evolution; scienceeducation; textbooks
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To: PatrickHenry
"The requested document does not exist on this server. "

Bad link?
21 posted on 08/20/2003 7:21:44 PM PDT by new cruelty
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To: PatrickHenry
Nevermind. I found the thread via search. Thanks for posting it.
22 posted on 08/20/2003 7:23:06 PM PDT by new cruelty
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To: new cruelty
That Scientific American link has been giving me fits. It's easier to find it by doing a google search on the title.
23 posted on 08/20/2003 7:24:41 PM PDT by PatrickHenry (Felix, qui potuit rerum cognoscere causas.)
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To: TheAngryClam
It amazes me that Conservatives are proud of the fact that a lot of them subscribe to such utterly inane beliefs as "creation science."

Doesn't surprise me a bit. These are Buckleycons--standing athwart Science, yelling "Stop, you're making me uncomfortable!"

Or, as "The Onion" put it: "I don't accept fundamental tenets of science AND I VOTE!"

24 posted on 08/20/2003 7:30:25 PM PDT by xm177e2 (Stalinists, Maoists, Ba'athists, Pacifists: Why are they always on the same side?)
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To: PatrickHenry
The more you do, the more you like it, as long as you can avoid the post-modernist writings about it.

That's why I loved digging holes in the ground- can't really theorize about that too much.
25 posted on 08/20/2003 7:34:00 PM PDT by TheAngryClam (TOM McCLINTOCK is my choice for governor. He should be yours too.)
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To: Bobkk47
You must be kidding!! Even Darwin came back later in life and said that people "took the ramblings of a fool and made them into a religion" (paraphrased). He also said that to look at the human eye, with all its intricacies, and not believe that there is a divine architect, is truly absurd. I suppose you believe in the big bang theory too!! If that is the case, then let's blow up a printing company and see if a book is produced in the rubble!! Get a life man . . . but better yet, get a relationship with God through His Son, Jesus Christ, and that truth will set you free!!
26 posted on 08/20/2003 7:38:17 PM PDT by Conservinator
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To: gg188
Socialism. Evolution. Global warming. And the list of liberal scams goes on

Liberals are scamming us on global warming, or they were until the Bush Admin. Their current views on socialism are unknown since their last coherent spokesman passed away a half century ago. Evolution, though, is greatly misunderstood.

For practical purposes consider evolution as a set of ordered sets where the order of each set is the complexity of the elements. This has little to do with Darwin or the evolutionary trees of which there are as many as there are paleontologists. That kind of evolution is just something scientists talk about when they're sitting around having a few beers after a hard day at the conference.

27 posted on 08/20/2003 7:38:23 PM PDT by RightWhale (Repeal the Law of the Excluded Middle)
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To: new cruelty
UNPOPULAR REASONABLE POSITION #1: Why not teach both? How long would it take to teach "creationism", anyway? An hour? Genesis isn't really all that long.

UNPOPULAR REASONABLE POSITION #2: Is it so absurd to think that evolution is God's mechanism for creating living creatures? We've discovered God's mechanism for creating stars, God's mechanism for creating crystals, God's mechanism for turning the oceans into rain, and God's mechanism for creating sunlight. All of these things have brought us wonder, and have brought us very little closer to understanding any of the important things which the Truth is about. What is so strange or hostile about yet another discovery?

28 posted on 08/20/2003 7:38:45 PM PDT by SedVictaCatoni (An embarrassed Christian.)
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To: TheAngryClam
Not what I was saying, not a-tall.

Once upon a time, education was supposed to be about training people to think. In the Middle Ages, you had to learn Grammar, Logic, and Rhetoric (the "Trivia") before you actually got into the "real" studies. Knowing how to read and write, how to follow an argument, and how to express one were considered the elementary stuff.

Not any more. Now that these skills, once considered elementary, are nearly vanished, the aim seems to be to preclude debate, not to foster it. Why do you think the libs are so apoplectic about talk radio? I will take the liberty of answering for you: They don't have any confidence in their ability to defend their position, though they have a religious certainty of its rightness. And the attempt to silence or preclude debate (the natural resort of the ideological monopolists) is in the best tradition of the Spanish Inquisition (bet you didn't expect that!)

29 posted on 08/20/2003 7:39:13 PM PDT by thulldud (It's bad luck to be superstitious.)
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To: All
On the issue of evolution, the verdict is still out on how God created the Earth.
30 posted on 08/20/2003 7:42:49 PM PDT by Heartlander
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To: SedVictaCatoni
Genesis isn't really all that long.

It's not the length... its the depth. : )

31 posted on 08/20/2003 7:43:59 PM PDT by new cruelty
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To: TheAngryClam
What's with the screen name? You aren't an ex-Scieno are ya?
32 posted on 08/20/2003 7:44:23 PM PDT by thulldud (It's bad luck to be superstitious.)
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To: new cruelty
>>Genesis isn't really all that long.

It's not the length... its the depth. : )

What depth? The explanation given for how God created the heavens, earth, and various creatures is little more than a few paragraphs long. If you take it literally, as pro-creationists tend to do (by definition), then it's a very short and very straightforward explanation.

33 posted on 08/20/2003 7:48:46 PM PDT by SedVictaCatoni (An embarrassed Christian.)
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To: thulldud
No, I'm not.

Click there and your questions will be answered.
34 posted on 08/20/2003 7:52:26 PM PDT by TheAngryClam (TOM McCLINTOCK is my choice for governor. He should be yours too.)
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To: SedVictaCatoni
The explanation given for how God created the heavens, earth, and various creatures is little more than a few paragraphs long.

Right, but it doesn't stop there. In the 2nd chapter there is a different version of the story. And then later there is John, and that is a whole different tradition. It gets very deep, or we can compartmentalize.

35 posted on 08/20/2003 7:55:56 PM PDT by RightWhale (Repeal the Law of the Excluded Middle)
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To: Russell Scott
If they would just wait, it would magically pop out of the Earth by the brillant mind that is evolution.

With this statement, you have demonstrated that you need to educate yourself on the matter before criticizing it. It is clear that you do not understand evolution, but rather your understanding is of an inaccurate strawman thereof.

Evolution implies no "design plans". Your analogy is nonsensical.
36 posted on 08/20/2003 7:56:31 PM PDT by Dimensio (Sometimes I doubt your committment to Sparkle Motion!)
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To: SedVictaCatoni
...then it's a very short and very straightforward explanation.

All those hours in Sunday school and I could have been outside playing ball. Damn.

37 posted on 08/20/2003 7:56:35 PM PDT by new cruelty
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To: Conservinator
He also said that to look at the human eye, with all its intricacies, and not believe that there is a divine architect, is truly absurd.

This sounds like you got this information from an out-of-context citation. A citation from Darwin is often used by Creationist information sources to show that even he did not believe that the eye could have evolved. They omit a following paragraph where he addresses the very concerns that he raises, explaining that in fact it is not a problem for evolution.

I suppose you believe in the big bang theory too!! If that is the case, then let's blow up a printing company and see if a book is produced in the rubble!!

This is not remotely analogous to evolution.
38 posted on 08/20/2003 7:58:45 PM PDT by Dimensio (Sometimes I doubt your committment to Sparkle Motion!)
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To: SedVictaCatoni
Why not teach both? How long would it take to teach "creationism", anyway? An hour? Genesis isn't really all that long.

Why should a religious story be taught outside of a religious studies class at all? Further, Genesis is not the only "creation" story out there.
39 posted on 08/20/2003 8:01:17 PM PDT by Dimensio (Sometimes I doubt your committment to Sparkle Motion!)
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To: TheAngryClam
May have to look some other time. It acts as if it's slashdotted or something....
40 posted on 08/20/2003 8:02:04 PM PDT by thulldud (It's bad luck to be superstitious.)
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