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Posted on 08/13/2003 9:02:05 PM PDT by nwrep
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2 hours, 55 minutes ago
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By RAMOLA TALWAR BADAM, Associated Press Writer
BOMBAY, India - U.S. and Indian scientists said Wednesday they have discovered a new carnivorous dinosaur species in India after finding bones in the western part of the country.
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The new dinosaur species was named Rajasaurus narmadensis, or "Regal reptile from the Narmada," after the Narmada River region where the bones were found.
The dinosaurs were between 25-30 feet long, had a horn above their skulls, were relatively heavy and walked on two legs, scientists said. They preyed on long-necked herbivorous dinosaurs on the Indian subcontinent during the Cretaceous Period at the end of the dinosaur age, 65 million years ago.
"It's fabulous to be able to see this dinosaur which lived as the age of dinosaurs came to a close," said Paul Sereno, a paleontologist at the University of Chicago. "It was a significant predator that was related to species on continental Africa, Madagascar and South America."
Working with Indian scientists, Sereno and paleontologist Jeff Wilson of the University of Michigan reconstructed the dinosaur skull in a project funded partly by the National Geographic (news - web sites) Society.
A model of the assembled skull was presented Wednesday by the American scientists to their counterparts from Punjab University in northern India and the Geological Survey of India during a Bombay news conference.
Scientists said they hope the discovery will help explain the extinction of the dinosaurs and the shifting of the continents — how India separated from Africa, Madagascar, Australia and Antarctica and collided with Asia.
The dinosaur bones were discovered during the past 18 years by Indian scientists Suresh Srivastava of the Geological Survey of India and Ashok Sahni, a paleontologist at Punjab University.
When the bones were examined, "we realized we had a partial skeleton of an undiscovered species," Sereno said.
The scientists said they believe the Rajasaurus roamed the Southern Hemisphere land masses of present-day Madagascar, Africa and South America.
"People don't realize dinosaurs are the only large-bodied animal that lived, evolved and died at a time when all continents were united," Sereno said.
The cause of the dinosaurs' extinction is still debated by scientists. The Rajasaurus discovery may provide crucial clues, Sereno said.
India has seen quite a few paleontological discoveries recently.
In 1997, villagers discovered about 300 fossilized dinosaur eggs in Pisdura, 440 miles northeast of Bombay, that Indian scientists said were laid by four-legged, long-necked vegetarian creatures.
Indian scientists said the dinosaur embryos in the eggs may have suffocated during volcanic eruptions.
Darwin came from a long line of atheists and he was one himself. His theory was far from science, he was not a scientist at all but more a naturalist or compiler of stories about species. His theory has been very destructive to science introducing such words as 'imagine', 'possibly' and 'perhaps' as scientific proofs in order to promote his atheistic views.
All I can say is, you're arguing against much more than the biological theory of evolution. You're arguing against science itself. That's a very big windmill to fight indeed.
LOL! Seriously, can you name just one, and back it up?
[Hint: Acceptance of standard biology does not make one a l*b*r*l. Neither does opposing affirmative action for creationism/id.]
Before you go, how was Mars? Did you get any pix? You are going to post them here of course? How big were the telescopes? What could you make out?
Concisetraveler, many of the regulars on the science threads here on Free Republic have joined in the AGREEMENT OF THE WILLING to promote civil discourse and to avoid flame wars which lead to excessive use of the abuse button, transfer to the Smokey Backroom, and ultimately ... thread deletion.
Would you consider signing on to this code of conduct?
Accusations were made against concisetraveler. It would appear that some complaint to the management has been made. It was that unfounded accusation which prompted concisetraveler's comment. What are you going to do about the accusation?
‘But seek first his kingdom and his righteousness, and all these things will be given to you as well.’ (Matthew 6:33)
"Once there was a change in our family situation. Our pet dog passed away and we salved our grief by acquiring a new one-a blue cattle pup. He was intelligent and very mischievous. We had a lot of fun with him. while he was small, he would amuse us by trying to catch his own tail and bite it. He would spy the tip of his tail out of the corner of his eye, and, readying himself, lunge at it, as if hunting prey. But of course, the more he pounced, the more his tail moved out of his reach. The only way a dog can really have its tail is to allow it to be an attachment to its main body."
"The... tail comes along just fine---when it is not its owner's preoccupation."
"Jesus advises us that though there are many good and important things, only one can be most important-the kingdom of God and his righteousness. First things must come first. All of life, with its experiences, decisions and relationships, needs to be evaluated in light of the highest ideal."
"When God is given pride of place, the machinery of existence operates at its best."
As if there could ever be "super-naturalistic" and "im-materialistic" science
by declaring that everything evolved solely through naturalistic random chance occurances makes a theological statement.
That's a very shaky statement of what evolution says. And it is NOT a theological statement. It is no more theological than is chemistry when it explains -- naturalistically (gasp!) -- how elements combine into compounds.
It [Naturalistic, materialistic science] trys to exclude God from the mix (rather than humbly admit that there are some things beyond the realm of science)and explain everything according to the wisdom of man.
I truly shudder to think what a "proper" science book would look like if it met your standards. What do you want? A humble declaration of ignorance? A prayer for wisdom? A confession of sin? That's science?
It [Naturalistic, materialistic science] also does a very poor job of explaining much of everything and expects the world to take as facts that man is the gradual result of chance. It does not adequately explain intelligence, ignores known things (the impersonal creating the personal), and otherwise pushes what in reality is an unproven hypothesis. Examples of "missing links" are heralded before the public as fact, even though each link is highly speculative and debated (even by evolutionists). And, yet, evolutionary science expects to be lauded for its objectivity.
Hard to know where to begin there. Difficult to respond, because all you've said amounts to nothing more than a hard-core anti-science rant. So, no rebuttal there. I accept that as your emotional response to science.
It [Naturalistic, materialistic science] sees what it wants to see and discounts everything else. Whether or not God can be measured, His presence is witnessed in everything around us. Some are willfully blind to it, but it is there.
Earlier, I had asked you how science could deal with (measure, see, test, etc.) the supernatural world. You have no answer, except to continue to bash science for not doing what it cannot do. I may as well beat my dogs because they can't fly.
First of all, the comment [about bias influencing results] was on Darwin.
My comments about worldwide peer review and verification of lab results applies to evolution as well as everything else. My point was that a Hindu or Japanese biologist would have none of the alleged bias that you ascribe to Darwin
Second, would you send an agent of Osama Bin Laden before a jury of Al Qaeda for judgment? The peers reviewing the evidence also have a highly evolutionary bias.
Okay. Everyone is in on the conspiracy. I gotcha.
[The anti-scriptural solar system doesn't bother me] Because the Bible is not purporting to be a science book, and none of the supposed "geocentric" passages are purporting to be a statement of God's design.
That's a very superficial dismissal of one of the most dramatic events in the intellectual history of western civilization. If only the church fathers had listened to you, ol' Galileo would have had no problems at all. Yet, as lenient as you say you are about the once blasphemous solar system theory, you are astonishingly harsh on those who advocate evolution. I still don't understand your double standard.
I will just be criticized for posting another AIG link, but AIG and Christiananswers.net among other links have plenty of information regarding the Galileo controversy as well as the supposed geocentrism of Scripture.
Right. Don't bother.
However, Galileo's problems were more with the Aristotelian thinking of the churchmen of his day as opposed to Copernican thinking - and the Bible would have been used out of context to back up those assumptions.
Sorry. I just can't take your word for it. The learned churchmen who persecuted Galileo were undoubtedly more skilled in their scripture than even you are. And consider this ... if they could, as you claim, erroneously take scripture out of context to persecute the solar system theory, isn't it just possible that you are doing the same thing in attacking evolution theory? I mean, it's possible, right?
Give me a break! First of all, the "latest scientific research" changes with the wind. It will continue to change with the wind.
No. It doesn't change with the wind. But it does change to be consistent with newly-discovered data. This is not a weakness, as you believe. It's the reason science is so successful.
It is inadequate to explain what we see and furthermore presents a worldview that is downright dangerous.
Scientific theories to a very adequate job of explaining what we see. That's the very definition of a theory. "Dangerous?" Yeah. I suppose the discovery of fire was dangerous too. Sorry, that's a terrible argument.
With that said, I do find it important as a seminary educated theologian (also have a secular Masters and Bachelors) to stay on top of what is going on in the world of science, but hardly look to it as some sort of authority which can change the truth of the Word of God.
We're back to the original question I posed. It's the same question Galileo posed. If you can see something that is contradicted by scripture, what do you believe? Scripture or the evidence of your senses. This question is at the core of all our other issues.
I made the argument before, but just think about it. If the Genesis account of creation is only an allegory, then you have no foundation (other than some fairy tale) for marriage, for families, for sin and salvation, or a need for a Savior. If Genesis is untrue, what basis do you have to trust any more of the book?
That's exactly the kind of argument that was leveled at Galileo. "If the Bible were wrong in so many places about the immovability of the earth, then it all comes unraveled, the people will lose faith, and there will be chaos everywhere." That's what they feared. As I've been saying, the struggle you're waging against evolution, for the very same reasons, has been waged 400 years ago. But we all accept the solar system, and our religion survives anyway.
I do not desire to get into a Catholic church debate on this thread. Suffice it to say, that I believe the Pope is completely wrong on this [the 1996 statement on evolution] and disagree that this is an "enlightened" attitude at all. It is apostacy, and I shudder for the damage it will do to the members of the Catholic faith.
Well, we shall see.
I want your pings, even as I crave your hugs. But although I will look at your further Enoch postings with interest, I may not be sufficiently motivated to respond -- until something major turns up. I'm definitely not asking to be left out of your findings.
[Enthusiastic reciprocal hugs!]
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