FOX NEWS: Rev. Gene Robinson Confirmed As Episcopal Church Bishop

Fox News Live

[Brian S]

Rev. Gene Robinson Confirmed As Episcopal Church Bishop

[Elsie]

I even expect to see many who are in LDS fellowships in Heaven, despite their doctrines.

 

I would HOPE you are right, but..............

 

Romans 10:1-3

 

 1.  Brothers, my heart's desire and prayer to God for the Israelites (LDS members) is that they may be saved.
 2.  For I can testify about them that they are zealous for God, but their zeal is not based on knowledge.
 3.  Since they did not know the righteousness that comes from God and sought to establish their own, they did not submit to God's righteousness.

 

Proverbs 19:2
   It is not good to have zeal without knowledge, nor to be hasty and miss the way.

 

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NIV Numbers 25:10-13
 10.  The LORD said to Moses,
 11.  "Phinehas son of Eleazar, the son of Aaron, the priest, has turned my anger away from the Israelites; for he was as zealous as I am for my honor among them, so that in my zeal I did not put an end to them.
 12.  Therefore tell him I am making my covenant of peace with him.
 13.  He and his descendants (not the LDS group) will have a covenant of a lasting priesthood, because he was zealous for the honor of his God and made atonement for the Israelites."

 

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As to the 'Gay' priest and his ilk:

 

NIV Deuteronomy 29:14-25
 14.  I am making this covenant, with its oath, not only with you 
 15.  who are standing here with us today in the presence of the LORD our God but also with those who are not here today.
 16.  You yourselves know how we lived in Egypt and how we passed through the countries on the way here.
 17.  You saw among them their detestable images and idols of wood and stone, of silver and gold.
 18.  Make sure there is no man or woman, clan or tribe among you today whose heart turns away from the LORD our God to go and worship the gods of those nations; make sure there is no root among you that produces such bitter poison.
 19.  When such a person hears the words of this oath, he invokes a blessing on himself and therefore thinks, "I will be safe, even though I persist in going my own way." This will bring disaster on the watered land as well as the dry.
 20.  The LORD will never be willing to forgive him; his wrath and zeal will burn against that man. All the curses written in this book will fall upon him, and the LORD will blot out his name from under heaven.
 21.  The LORD will single him out from all the tribes of Israel for disaster, according to all the curses of the covenant written in this Book of the Law.
 22.  Your children who follow you in later generations and foreigners who come from distant lands will see the calamities that have fallen on the land and the diseases with which the LORD has afflicted it.
 23.  The whole land will be a burning waste of salt and sulfur--nothing planted, nothing sprouting, no vegetation growing on it. It will be like the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah, Admah and Zeboiim, which the LORD overthrew in fierce anger.
 24.  All the nations will ask: "Why has the LORD done this to this land? Why this fierce, burning anger?"
 25.  And the answer will be: "It is because this people abandoned the covenant of the LORD, the God of their fathers, the covenant he made with them when he brought them out of Egypt.

 

 

 

[Elsie]

I even expect to see many who are in LDS fellowships in Heaven, despite their doctrines

How do you feel about Jehovah Witnesses?

[Aquinasfan]

Episcopalians.......aren't they the same as the Unitarians, a psuedo-religeous liberal cult?

Not even close. The UU's are in a class by themselves.

[Aquinasfan]

Yes, I did know that there are Catholic priests who were once married, but they are celibate widowers, correct?

There are 8 Rites within the Catholic Church. In America, the most common Rite by far is the Latin Rite, "Western Rite" or "Roman" Church. The other Rites are the "Eastern Rites." In the Eastern Rites married men may become priests. However, they cannot become bishops. Also, unmarried, ordained priests are not allowed to marry.

These policies are a matter of Church discipline, not dogmatic teaching. The Church law is based on pastoral concerns and tradition. Therefore, in some cases, the pope has granted exemptions allowing married men to become priests in the Latin Rite. These men have mostly been married Episcopalian priests seeking to become Catholic priests.

[Credo]

Actually there's an old saw that I can expand on.
Liberal mainline protestant denominations, Reformed Judaism and Unitarian Universalists are essentially the democratic party with holidays.

[Aquinasfan]

Sola scriptura still means sola scriptura.

Where's that in the Bible?

[Aquinasfan]

1. that Jesus Christ is our new High Priest (and only mediator)

2. that all believers in Jesus (regenerate ones) are priests

The word "priest" derives from the old English rendering of "presbyter," and has been carried down to this day. An exhaustive treatment of the priesthood here.

Briefly, by typology:

OT-----------------------------------------> NT

Israel as a royal priesthood --------------> Priesthood of believers
Ministerial priesthood---------------------> Ordained priests
High Priest--------------------------------> Jesus as eternal High Priest

Another related type

Vice regent of the House of David ("keeper of the keys" in Isaiah 22) -----------> Vicar of Christ ("keeper of the keys," Matthew 16:19)

[Aquinasfan]

What do you get when you cross a Jehovah's Witness with a Unitarian?

Someone who knocks on your door for no particular reason.

[jimt]

You must have missed the poll where Freepers made Bill Clinton "the most evil man of the century".

Now THAT was a fun one!

[k omalley]

"Not so! There are many Bible-preaching churches where sinners find grace, and saved sinners learn to walk in the ways of Christ."

Oh, absolutely. I was refering to those folks who have hijacked the ECUSA and some of the other churches with their paltry god and their eternally re-interpreted scripture, and their twisting wrong into right. If I had such a "faith" I think that sleeping in would be a better option.

[aberaussie]

Either way, orthodox beleivers in the ELCA don't win! Even with a delay, the gay cabal will continue to eat away at the ELCA, leaving it in a weakened, and less than orthodox state. Only either takeover by the orthodox laity, or our leaving for orthodox church bodies, can help! We need A LOT MORE than a Freep!! Orthodox believers in the ELCA need to get together as Christians and help each other deal with this bad situation.

That is what I have observed as well. The gay advocates just do not give up. If they lose in one venue they just move to another. They have been very successful at making their presence know and approved of at national youth gatherings. That started right after I left youth ministry in the eighties, but the stories my replacement told me about ELCA youth events made my hair curl. He told me if they could not "get in the door, they would go in a window!" This year at the ELCA National Youth Gathering, the attendees voted to be accepting of gay and lesbian youth. I would like for them to define their terms. It sounds like that could mean a lot of different things. Needless to say, my kids do not go to events sponsored by the ELCA, only those sponsored and led my church and leaders I know and trust. I homeschool too.

Are you familiar with the Word Alone Network? It is a group of conservative ELCAers trying to keep the denomination scriptural. It started with the passing of Called to Common Mission, which is the agreement we have with the ECUSA that many folks object to. Now they are focusing on the sexuality study. It is pretty active in the midwest and perhaps the northeast, but I don't hear anything from members down here in the south.

I hate to be negative, but I was nearly the youngest person(at 45) in my class about the homosexual issue. I think the pro-gay folks have an advantage in that the culture is conditioning the younger people to not be concerned about this issue. All they have to do is wait for the old fogeys to die off.

[AnAmericanMother]

Credit Harold Hill for the comment.

I simply provided the picture. From the chapter headings in my old copy of Screwtape

My 15 year old daughter read it, and said it made her feel paranoid and self-examining for a long time. Just what I need -- problems with scrupulosity in a 15 year old girl! (She has a picture of St. Maria Goretti over her bed. I DO encourage that sort of thinking, because the boys are starting to indicate an interest. Of course, they'll have to deal not only with her but with her 6'6" 240 pound daddy with a shotgun and martial arts training, not to mention her small but extremely mean mother! :-D )

[AnAmericanMother]

You seem to be plugged in to the Anglican Use group.

Tell me, can somebody get in touch with whoever the Cardinal or other authority is in charge of Anglican Use and tell him to get started on an outreach program?

Even without having been to church since this vote, I know of several families in our parish who would be standing at the door of an Anglican Use parish waiting for the priest to unlock, if there were such a parish closer than Texas and South Carolina! And there are probably enough in the metro Atlanta area to start a VERY large parish right off the bat. Folks who could provide money, space, a house for the priest, and a good portion of his salary while the church got organized.

But somebody has to start the ball rolling.

[aberaussie]

Missouri Synod here. C'mon over. As far as I know, both in doctrine and in practice, nothing's changed in at least fifty years. Sola scriptura still means sola scriptura. The Bible is God's Word, and if that offends some, we won't be mad if they don't show up.

Thanks for the invite. ;-) We have found a little LCMS congregation that we like nearby...in fact when I was on our last call committee, we tried to get the pastor to jump to ELCA. Instead, he took this struggling LCMS congregation and seems to really be making a difference there. I could attend church there, but it is hard to leave a congregation where I have been on staff, my kids have been baptized and confirmed, the youth I worked with in the eighties are now the parents of the current youth...and this is a conservative congregation. I hope they will consider leaving the ELCA if this passes, but there may be enough "tolerant" members to prevent it.

I grew up in the LCMS...was there for the big split in the 70's. I just remember a lot of arguing and tension. I also have been on a homeschool list for Lutherans that was largely LCMS, and the endless arguing over the finest points of doctrine got to me, and I had to leave. Of course, their telling me I could not possibly be a Christian if I stayed in the ELCA did not help ;-) I appreciate the concern for being true to scripture, but some folks I have talked to could use a little grace. The congregation I have visited here and another in Tennessee that my husband's brother and sister-in-law attend seem to be very grace-filled *and* scriptural, so I guess it just depends on with whom you are speaking!

Keep us in your prayers! Luther did not want to leave the Catholic church; he wanted to reform it. There are many of us in the ELCA who are working to bring the church back to biblical foundations.

[freebilly]

Do all these denominations lead to Christ?

I know people from all denominations who love Christ. For several years I was a member of a Presbyterian congregation. I found it pretty colorless and bland, but when I prayed about it I kept getting a different answer than the one I wanted to hear. God kept telling me that I needed to be at that Church at that time and that I needed to bring myself fully to Him through service at that Church. I began teaching a Sunday school class, and the experience deepened my relationship with Christ. I was forced to read and study more scripture than I'd ever had before, and when I finally left that Church it was on God's schedule, not on mine.

Luke 9:49-50 tell us this:

John answered and said, "Master, we saw someone casting out demons in Your name; and we tried to prevent him because he does not follow along with us."

But Jesus said to him, "Do not hinder him; for he who is not against you is for you."

Ultimately, it is not denominations that bring people salvation. That task belongs to Christ. In the final analysis I'll let God sort this all out on Judgment Day.

[AnAmericanMother]

Actually, there is another circumstance under which non-Catholics may receive. If you can show the priest that it is an emergency and that you adhere to proper doctrine (especially the Real Presence), you may receive after confession and absolution.

We used to do this pretty regularly because my family used to wander around Central America and the Caribbean during Christmas and Easter vacations. When Christmas or Easter rolled around, if we weren't on a British island or in a former British colony, there was never an Anglican church available. My dad (who speaks fluent Italian which will "go" in Mexico) would call on the local parish priest, explain our difficulty, vouch for our good faith, we would make confession and go to Mass.

Of course, my dad could sell a walk-in freezer to an Eskimo . . . . :-D so your mileage may vary.

[freebilly]

I even expect to see many who are in LDS fellowships in Heaven, despite their doctrines. It's all up to the individuals, I'd say.

I know many LDS folk who've shared their testimonies with me. Many of their doctrines are so non-scriptural in basis that I don't think it can actually call itself a Church that preaches salvation only through Christ.

That said, we know that God judges the heart not the outward appearance, and it's possible that members of LDS Churches will be allowed into the Kingdom.

[unspun]

I know many LDS folk who've shared their testimonies with me. Many of their doctrines are so non-scriptural in basis that I don't think it can actually call itself a Church that preaches salvation only through Christ. That said, we know that God judges the heart not the outward appearance, and it's possible that members of LDS Churches will be allowed into the Kingdom.

Yes, and that goes even for individuals raised in non-Christian traditions, if they do respond to an appeal of the Holy Spirit, based upon some bit of revelation the Lord Jesus affords them. And He who died to save them and lives intent to bring them into the kingdom will be their judge. (I'm glad that responsibility is His and not mine. ;-)

Romans 1-2

[AnAmericanMother]

Best way I ever heard this explained was by a wise old priest, who told me that it is perfectly true that "no man cometh to the Father save through" Christ, but that as mortals of limited knowledge we cannot know or understand the ways that Christ may manifest himself to men, even if they are not nominally Christians or are doubtful. I think the Catholics call it a "baptism of desire". I don't think we should reject the possibility out of hand.

[longtermmemmory]

Homosexuals do not care about old people. Why should they, they have the children. Public schools are forced to use GLSEN materials which LITERALLY encourage children to "try something bad." That is a verbatim quote.

This is liberalism on parade. It is what has destroyed the democrat party and it continued to eat the episcopal church. Hopefully, the faithful will fight this evil.