Posted on 01/24/2003 6:07:20 AM PST by Stand Watch Listen
Walk up to a Canadian and ask him what sets his country apart from the USA, and he'll likely reply with one of five things: Gun control; a less hawkish, more diplomatic approach to world affairs; a collective preoccupation with adverse weather patterns; a burning passion for hockey; and a socialized health care system.
Canada's health care system is its touchstone. Canadians are literally brainwashed into believing that Canada wouldn't be the great country it is without its health care program. According to Canadian lore, America is full of people who are paying through the eyeteeth for medical treatment, and if you're not wealthy, you either don't get the treatment you need, or you declare bankruptcy.
Being a Canadian myself, I grew up hearing all about these nightmarish tales of the "evil American health care system". All the while, I was having to go to the doctor three days in a row, only to be turned away each time because the doctor had seen his maximum allowable government-funded quota of patients for the day.
In my home province of British Columbia, 24 people died in one year while waiting for heart surgery. On the other side of the country, kids in desperate need of heart surgery at the Hospital for Sick Children in Toronto were being sent home. At Moncton Hospital in New Brunswick, patients were being kept in hallways and closets because of a lack of beds. In some cases, ambulance workers spoke of how they would drive dying patients from one emergency room to another in search of available beds or adequate equipment.
Despite all these horror stories, Canadians somehow remain convinced that medical care in Canada is preferable to that in the US. The reality is that socialized medicine is an abysmal failure. Under this system, everyone is supposed to receive equal access to health care, but what really ends up happening is that no one receives any care at all. But at least we're all in the SAME sinking boat, eh?
Under the Canadian system, anyone who wants to escape this disaster of Titanic proportions has no choice but to look elsewhere for health care. This, in effect, creates the two-tier system of which Canadians are so deathly afraid. Those with money are going to the USA for treatment while everyone else is stuck dealing with the inexpensive - but totally ineffective - Canadian system.
Note to Hillary Clinton and others like her who want to bring socialized health care to the USA: When people in a country that has such a program are turning to one that doesn't in order to get the treatment they require, that should be a bit of a hint for you.
A citizen of the USA is twice as likely to have open heart surgery as a Canadian. Seattle, Washington--with a population of roughly half a million people--has more CAT scanners than the entire province of British Columbia, which has a population of 3 million.
There are more MRI scanners in Washington state than in all of Canada. Why such a shortage of diagnostic equipment? Because in Canada, there is only one, single, giant "HMO," and it's run by the government.
The government decides where to allocate resources and where to cut costs. And if you don't like your government-run HMO in Canada, there are no competing HMOs you can turn to in order to obtain better treatment. The only alternatives you have are to whine and complain, or to fork out some money to get treatment in the USA.
Hillary's dream is to have a socialized health care system in the USA, along with a Patient's Bill of Rights that would allow for people to sue their HMO. What you'd effectively have then is people suing the government for not providing them with the care they require.
I hope Hillary has borrowed Al Gore's "lock box" to save up those pennies, because if Canada's socialized health system is any indication, she'd better get ready for the mother of all class action suits against her proposed "government-run HMO."
(Rachel Marsden is a director of the Free Congress Foundation.)
Free Congress Foundation
Given the amount pant load in your posts, I would say that you are definately "loaded"
A 2002 study in Health Affairs estimates that in 1998-99 only 640 Canadians went to Buffalo, Detroit, and Seattle for diagnostic radiology services. Compared to the more than 480,000 MRI procedures performed each year in Ontario's public hospitals, this figure is minuscule.
A government study shows that the government system is just peachy- stop the presses! How hard did they look for people crossing the border for MRIs? Does it mention how many of the 480,000 MRIs in Ontario were performed on family pets? And why is it legal to buy an MRI for Fido but not for grandma?
You're doing you income tax wrong.
Ok tax expert, what box do I use to claim the 5% payroll tax that gets grabbed from my employer before it even hits my paycheque? Where do I get a rebate on the 15% sales tax for everything I buy? Where do I get back the grand a year I fork over in tobacco taxes? How do I avoid the 15% surtax they whack you with if your earnings are anything above the poverty line? I'm anxious to find out.
Those problems started happening long before the alleged "cost-cutting" took place. Also, during the late '90s while the usual suspects where whining about cutbacks the Province of Ontario was increasing health care spending by about 5% a year. The fundamental flaw is that people who think it's "free" over-use it and the only way to control expenditures is through rationing.
Gee, can you name any non-profit centre providing MRI services other than government run ones?
study in Health Affairs Where did it say it was a government study? Ontario Health Coalition is hardly supported by the Government.
And why is it legal to buy an MRI for Fido but not for grandma
Check again . There are private MRI clinics in several provinces, including 20 in BC, Alberta and Quebec. One in NS and soon 20 more in Ontario. And the only place Fido can is in London at Lawson Research for a $1000 a scan
5% payroll tax that gets grabbed from my employer
Assuming you are referring to the payroll tax that employers pay, not you as an employee (if you think it's abolishment would give you an extra 5% gross , dream on). It's 1.95% in Ontario , not 5%.
If you're think you're paying too much , like the over 50% you said you do, to a system that does nothing for him. you need tax advice and a lesson on who pays for the society you live in. And the grand a year I fork over in tobacco taxes is easy. Quit.
Freedom is good, and socialism is bad. That part you seem to understand. If you want to start the debate by telling this forum why socialism is good, get to it. I'll be happy to carve you up, comrade.
Here is another topic for you "debaters": Saddam Hussein -
Trying to change the subject before we even start is pretty predictable comrade.
And don't chock on each other's genitals
The genitals comment will probably get you booted, so stay away from that long enough so I can make you look like the moron you truly are. BTW, What does " chock" mean? Did you go to a commie school too?
As to what am I doing here, well, it's mildly amusing, so why not. Beats watching CNN.
As to amusment, better to watch CNN. They are boring to you because they are almost as leftist as you are, and that kind of childish crap is truly boring. And it isn't amusing, it's stupid, like your philosophy.
I know you are just trying to get booted so you can slink away like all lefties and claim you were kicked off the forum so you don't have to be shown up as an imbecile.
Before we start, learn how to format in HTML so you won't look as stupid as you are.
Very good question.
Her political friends will go to Walter Reed or Bethesda. You can bet there will be a nationwide system of "Defense" hospitals open only to the politically well-connected.
George Clooney and Barbra pose a bit of a problem, however. The original Hillary! plan specified a $50,000 fine and five years in federal prison for doctors treating patients outside of the system.
If she keeps that in, my guess is that there will have to be maquiladora hospitals in Tijuana, Juarez, Nogales and elsewhere for the non-political elite.
I had the opportunity to lecture at the medical school in Bratislava about six months after the fall of communism. The hospital was incredibly dreary and underequipped. We then toured the "cancer hospital", which was beyond state-of-the-art. When I asked how come there was one hospital in the country that was so advanced, they told me that up until six months ago, it was the "special hospital" for Central Committee members and their families.
Such hospitals exist everywhere there is socialized medicine, and Hillary! will have to create them here for her friends after she destroys what we have now.
Do you know what province she lives in? Each is different.
My neighbour had his knee replaced in October. From his first visit with a specialist it took a little over 3 months. An 76 year old lady I know is having her hip done the last week in February. Her first consultation with the surgeon in Toronto was Dec 16th. Her surgeon does 10 a week Distances can be a problem. The lady I mentioned has to travel over 200 miles. Difficult for someone who has arthritis both hips and spine.
My father had cataracts removed from his eye in September and removed from his other eye last Wednesday morning. Because of his deteriorating eye sight in September he was faced with the very real possibility of losing his drivers license. He can now read the paper without his glasses. He doesn't have much choice. His old pair are out of focus and he gets his new pair next week.
Like you said, please don't speak for all in your country, That's true, but by the same token, for each unhappy patient needing treatment, there are thousands who are happy. Just like in the USA.
Under the plan being proposed by Hillary and the Democrats, people like myself seeking medical treatment, even for life saving procedures would have to seek the permission of nameless, faceless Washington Beureurats to undergo those procedures.
I can tell you if I had to seek this kind of permission, I would most likely be denied simply because of my outspoken criticism of the Democrat party's social and political agenda.
I'm afraid such a health care plan as what's being proposed by Hillary and her ilk would be politically biased against conservatives and christians and in favor of those loyal to the Democrats. Poltical loyality and not need would be what determines who gets medical treatment.
I'm afraid such a plan would do more harm than good for this country. The idea of Hillary controlling my access to health care and palying you know what with my life is something this conservative Reppublican does not find very appealing.
Regards.
Americans are subsidizing the Canadian health care system by paying more for perscription drugs. If it wasn't for the americans you would not have the low cost drugs you have!
and pay the world's highest prices.
SS. I will say it real slow.
Americans subsidze your health care system.
If canadians had to pay the "real" cost of the drugs, Your system would be in total disfuncation!
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