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Why Men Won't Commit: Men's Atitudes About Sex, Dating and Marriage
National Marriage Project (Rutgers University) ^ | 2002 | Barbara Dafoe Whitehead and David Popenoe

Posted on 10/22/2002 11:24:51 AM PDT by shrinkermd

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To: shrinkermd
6. They are waiting for the perfect soul mate and she hasn’t yet appeared

Yeah. That's it.

This guy confuses me. He's studied men's reasons for not commiting, but this statement makes me wonder how many men he actually knows.

21 posted on 10/22/2002 12:30:03 PM PDT by sharktrager
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To: sharktrager
They are waiting for the perfect soul mate and she hasn’t yet appeared

The perfect soul mate is one who will stay out of your hair and take care of the kids and keep the house clean and not embarass you in public and keep herself trim.. They're out there, only I think they mostly live on other planets. But that doesn't mean we can't shop around for her.

22 posted on 10/22/2002 12:37:27 PM PDT by Nonstatist
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#11 Liberals have trained women that all men are rapists an d any man who talks to you only wants to sleep with you.
23 posted on 10/22/2002 12:37:41 PM PDT by KneelBeforeZod
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To: shrinkermd
8. They are reluctant to marry a woman who already has children

Maybe it directly relates to #1?

1. They can get sex without marriage more easily than in times past

24 posted on 10/22/2002 12:39:16 PM PDT by Darth Dan
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To: Dark Wing
bookmark
25 posted on 10/22/2002 12:44:15 PM PDT by Dark Wing
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To: sharktrager
When I was young, I can't remember any guysI knew stating they were waiting for their soulmate.
Young men and women think everyone their "in love with" is their soulmate.
Most guys I knew were looking for the "hottest looking babe" they could find.
Wouldn't want your friends giving you hell for marrying a dog.
26 posted on 10/22/2002 12:48:08 PM PDT by philetus
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To: N. Theknow
Son: Dad, is it true in Africa men don't know who their wives are before they get married?
Father: That's true in all countries, son.
27 posted on 10/22/2002 12:49:15 PM PDT by dyed_in_the_wool
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To: KneelBeforeZod
sounds like someone got rejected and is blaming liberals.
28 posted on 10/22/2002 12:53:31 PM PDT by RolandBurnam
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To: shrinkermd
This survey is being played out in my own home. My 15 yo son has already said that marriage can wait, and wait, and wait. He looks ahead to his 30's and still doesn't see marriage there for him. (Wierd kid. When I was his age, I looked ahead to "Saturday".) He's so busy being an all-American kid (baseball, Motorcycles, camping, shooting, water recreation, etc.), he doesn't have time to waste on girls.

My 13 yo old daughter, on the other hand, has just discovered babies. Everyone's babies. Her teachers and church counselors are in their late teens and early twenties, are marrying and having kids. That "culture" has her infatuated with the lives of these healthy young adults (who DO wait until after marriage for sex). A year or so ago, she said she'd adopt..no way was she going to waste her athletic body on babies. Now.. she's changing.

So, if I read this correctly, my daughter and her friends are growing up, going to college, preparing themselves for lives as Mom's or careers, while my son and his buddies are going to disappoint them. They're having too much fun to get saddled down with kids.

29 posted on 10/22/2002 12:56:51 PM PDT by Steel and Fire and Stone
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To: Steel and Fire and Stone
I think #3 and #10 are pretty important ones :)

I do think they might have left one thing out. Most of us non-committal types feel that when we say "I do", she will say "You DID!".

30 posted on 10/22/2002 1:01:56 PM PDT by Outraged At FLA
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To: longtermmemmory; BigWaveBetty; pubmom; Endeavor

31 posted on 10/22/2002 1:02:17 PM PDT by Hillary's Lovely Legs
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To: conservatism_IS_compassion
But her eggs would still be getting old!!!
32 posted on 10/22/2002 1:09:16 PM PDT by workinggirl
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To: longtermmemmory
Marry for love? What romantic rubbish! If I can find a decent woman willing to be a proper wife, then sentimentality is irrelevant.
33 posted on 10/22/2002 1:10:22 PM PDT by Loyalist
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To: All
The comments are fascinating. One thing the authors did not consider was intelligence. In 1997 Charles Murray wrote an article for a UK paper (Sunday Times 25 May 1997) in respect to this. What he did first was gather a population to study.

"A very large database in the United States contains information about several thousand sibling pairs who have been followed since 1979. To make the analysis as unambiguous as possible, I have limited my sample to brothers and sisters whose parents are in the top 75 per cent of American earners, with a family income in 1978 averaging £40,000 (in today's money).

Families living in poverty, or even close to it, have been excluded. The parents in my sample also stayed together for at least the first seven years of the younger sibling's life.

Each pair consists of one sibling with an IQ in the normal range of 90-110 ,a range that includes 50% of the population. I will call this group the normals. The second sibling in each pair had an IQ either higher than 110, putting him in the top quartile of intelligence (the bright) or lower than 90, putting him in the bottom quartile (the dull). These constraints produced a sample of 710 pairs."

The results appropriate to this discussion were:

"The differences among the siblings go far beyond income. Marriage and children offer the most vivid example. Similar proportions of siblings married, whether normal, bright or dull - but the divorce rate was markedly higher among the dull than among the normal or bright, even after taking length of marriage into account. Demographers will find it gloomily interesting that the average age at which women had their first birth was almost four years younger for the dull siblings than for the bright ones, while the number of children born to dull women averaged 1.9, half a child more than for either the normal or the bright. Most striking of all were the different illegitimacy rates. Of all the first-born children of the normals, 21% were born out of wedlock , about a third lower than the figure for the United States as a whole, presumably reflecting the advantaged backgrounds from which the sibling sample was drawn. Their bright siblings were much lower still, with less than 10% of their babies born illegitimate. Meanwhile, 45% of the first-born of the dull siblings were born outside of marriage."

34 posted on 10/22/2002 1:11:42 PM PDT by shrinkermd
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To: shrinkermd
Yeah, dumb women are easier heh.. :P
35 posted on 10/22/2002 1:16:35 PM PDT by Outraged At FLA
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To: philetus
When I was "young" (high school grad, '74), girls were playing the field, being liberal feminists. By the time I was 28 yrs., I still hadn't married or even come close to finding a date with a potential "Ms. Right". I was a young Navy Lieutenant, in pretty good shape, not a GQ type, but I got some looks. It was almost funny .. I was stationed in the San Francisco area after my first sea tour, and I'd go to public places "looking" for women. I couldn't attract attention. Women were just not interested. I couldn't figure it out. Years later, a buddy told me "idiot.. what did you expect?! In the early 1980's, the only guys who wore short hair and tight, trendy clothes in that region were GAY!!! How were the girls supposed to know you were different?!" Hmmm.. GULP!

Anyway, I recently divorced buddy of my from back in College and I were commiserating over a beer about ten years back. We both noticed something. In our late 30's, we found that suddenly we had women of our age group taking an "interest" in us. (Though he was divorced, I was married, wasn't happy with some things.. O.K., I was STUPID, but we won't go into that discussion. Let's just say... I was aware of women in my surroundings). Anyway, the upshot of the story is that we just laughed at all the women we knew who wouldn't give us a second glance back when we were 21, women didn't marry and "lived with" guys. They were "babe's" back then, but were now lonely in their late 30's. On the other hand, my buddy had all the gorgeous, educated young women he wanted (to date), and they were in their late 20's. (He would have been married forever, but his wife decided to relieve her teens... chased some old boyfrieds, abandoned the family, etc.. This guy was a saint.)

We concluded our discussion by laughing until we put ourselves on the floor (ok, after about 3 beers). These women we grew up with had bought the whole feminist career-free-to-be-me-garbage hook, line, and sinker, while the guys in my generation couldn't find a women who wanted to marry and raise kids. Now that these women were in their late 30's, they were panicing. They realized that they'd given away their best years to dozens of losers, and had little left to offer a "family man". What comes around goes around...

I expect that's still happening today, although, from what I see working with young teens today, young women are much more focused on a future including a family life. Which is good, since my young teenage kids face growing up in the tough world created by these left-wing-sixty-hippies.

36 posted on 10/22/2002 1:16:55 PM PDT by Steel and Fire and Stone
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To: Steel and Fire and Stone
Both my sons recently got engaged after dating the same young women for 10 years a piece. The 30 year old who is marrying his college sweetheart wanted to have it all first...job,house new car, boat and some financial security. The 27 year old is marrying his high school sweetheart. They basically waited til she finished law school. Never any doubt in his mind that he would marry her just the when. Two weddings next September, 3 weeks apart. Glad they're male children.
37 posted on 10/22/2002 1:21:29 PM PDT by surrey
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To: philetus
fat women are like scooters. Fun to ride but you will get teased if your friends see you with one.
38 posted on 10/22/2002 1:22:32 PM PDT by longtermmemmory
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To: anniegetyourgun
Men can achieve their primary objective without marriage. How stupid can women be?

That's pretty true biologically. Sex does drive guys emotions and motives. It's the way we're built. However, that's only half the equation. A roommate is not a wife, even if she's a very "accommodating" roommate. You can't make a "home" with a roommate. You need the defined and understood continuity that comes with marriage.

Believe it or not, the best way for a women to corral a reluctant-to-commit guy is to get him involved with kids (niece, nephews, Little League, etc.). He'll either realize what the secret ingredient to "home" is (wive+kids), and want some of that immediately, or he'll flee like a scalded dog. Which is OK, because women shouldn't date scalded dogs.

39 posted on 10/22/2002 1:31:00 PM PDT by Steel and Fire and Stone
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To: surrey
Enjoy the grandchildren!

FReegards...SFS

40 posted on 10/22/2002 1:34:12 PM PDT by Steel and Fire and Stone
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