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I THINK THE SNIPERS ARE AL QAEDA
Various Cable Networks ^ | 11 October 2002 | Myself

Posted on 10/11/2002 1:40:39 PM PDT by LSUfan

I'm watching this sniper coverage on the cable networks and everyone is so sure that this is a nut of some sort: a gun nut, a military nut, a serial killer, etc.

But we have evidence to indicate that there is more than one. Two nuts? The President of the Marine Scout Sniper Assoc was just on MSNBC and said that he is sure that the shooter isn't alone because he doubts that anyone could stalk, lay-up, take the shot, egress and just drive off in his minivan.

So now they have all the wonderful psychological profilers on...including some 300 lb private detective...and they are all talking about this like these guys are deranged or disturbed. They all refer to "spree" killers and "serial" killers.

Excuse me, but I'd like to see the list of serial killing TEAMS in American history! And I'd like to learn more about the spree killers who take 10 shots, get 10 kills, including one within 50 yards of a state trooper in plain sight and then vanish without a trace.

These guys have training, motivation, and resources and they are operating as a team. The fact that they shot with the cop right there tells me they were totally confident. I believe they plan these like operations, script them, rehearse them, conduct recons and then execute them LIKE OPERATIONS.

Who does that sound like to you?

Why isn't the media even thinking about the Islamic terrorism angle?

Also: this sniper was taking a big chance with daylight attacks in an urban environment, including one with a cop in plain sight. That (to me) implies that he has area security and avenues of egress and methods of egress covered. That's a lot easier to do in a daylight urban scenario if you have a team, as opposed to a lone gunman.

The fact that these attacks occurred just as the tanker was blown up in Yemen also makes me suspicious. Not to mention the 1 year anniversary of Enduring Freedom.

Just talked to a close friend who is with a DC think tank and is also a retired Col. of Marines. He is tuned in to law enforcement in the DC area as well as he is also a director of a company that sells computer equipment designed for tactical and security use. He has personal and professional contacts with law enforcement in the DC area. Also, his wife was two blocks away from one of the shootings when it happened, and in fact when he heard that a woman in her 30s had been killed in that particular spot while vacuuming her vehicle, he was extremely worried, because that fit her description. He couldn't reach her by phone for a good 15 minutes.

In general: it should be remembered that the month of October was the month in which Sheikh Omar Abdel al-Rahman, OBL's favorite mullah, and a top OBL lieutenant, Ayman al-Zawahiri, were convicted in connection with the 1993 World Trade Center bombing. Also, October was the month in which we started our assault on the Taliban and al Qaeda in Afghanistan.

These aren't some bad militia boys who got into some bad moonshine...these guys aren't shooting up the countryside. They're likely conducting recon, setting up their shots and bugging out to live to do it again. My friend tells me that terrorism is definitely on everyone's lips and minds and that the Feds have involved in this out the ying yang from the get go...BATF, FBI...even Secret Service because of the proximity to DC.

My buddy points out that Al Qaeda said specifically that it would target schools, so this might be the start of something.

GET THIS:

Two of the shots were HEAD SHOTS at a moving target at 150 meters. While a tourso shot at 150 meters is not a terribly hard shot for someone with training, a HEAD SHOT at 150 meters on a moving target would be a virtually impossible shot for a nut with no training. Next time you go to the gun show, take a look at the guy to your left and the guy to your right. Chances are, unless they grew up hunting or were in the military, you'd be pretty safe if they took a shot at you at 150yds while you were moving. Hint: Marines qualify out to the 500 yard line with the M16A2. That is what training will do. I qualified expert and am still an avid shooter today. I shoot a heavy barrel AR15A2 in 5.56mm and a National Match M1A in 7.62 NATO. I am NOT at all confident that I could get a head shot on a moving target at 150 meters. In fact...I would not even try. I would shoot center of mass. What all this indicates is a very highly trained shooter with good gear and most likely a spotter.

And GET THIS as well:

My buddy tells me that the FBI al Qaeda profilers have been predicting some sort of random attack as a contrast to 9-11. Something that sends the message: "no one anywhere is safe from us." al Qaeda has specifically said that they have the right to kill hundreds of thousands of "American children." This fits in with the critique of the al Qaeda training video that came out not long ago.

Here is another coincidence (?): In his Oct 4th column, Bill Gertz of the Washington Times said: "U.S. intelligence agencies received reports this week indicating Islamic terrorists have targeted American schools for attack, intelligence officials said. The reports indicate that the targeting includes plans to attack all levels of educational institutions in the United States, ranging from elementary schools to colleges and universities, said officials familiar with the reports." One of the victims was a 13 year old schoolboy.

Now REALLY GET THIS:

In the public release, law enforecemnt has not mentioned any race or ethnicity of the perps. But the unclassified bulletin that is being circulated by the Feds describes says that one of the local deputies got a description of two "Hispanics" but the feds think the guy just profiled them as Hispanics from law enforcement experience and that the two could easily be Middle Eastern. My buddy did not know if the deputy saw the perps himself or took a description from witnesses. The original vehicle was described as a white delivery van and today the suspect vehicle was a white Chevy Astro Van (but if these guys are pros like everyone thinks, neither vehicle will be showing up again).

A few more interesting insights from my friend:

The killer (or killers) must have felt secure in his surroundings. Most of the killings happened on or near busy main avenues during rush hour.

To say nothing of the fact that the region is crawling with law enforcement of every kind, being so close to the nation's capital.

Obviously it's someone who has murdered before or has been trained and conditioned to kill people. My buddy doubts many first-time killers, to say nothing of social outcasts or sickos, would have the nerve to kill with a single shot, then drive to another location within a half-hour, then kill again with another single shot.

Notably, all the areas of the killings are highly integrated racially. Had the killings been two miles west or south, they would have been in practically all-white or all-black neighborhoods, respectively, so a non-white/non-black killer (i.e., Middle Eastern) would not have been noticed in the areas in question.

Finally, the coincidental timing of these two incidents is another reason to suspect al Qaeda terrorism. Blow up a ship at the same time they're plinking away at innocent civilians...

If they haven't already done so, the cops and Feds need to bring in some guys from the Scout-Sniper School in Quantico to analyze this thing. Most law enforcement snipers don't think like the guys who did these horrible acts. And street cops certainly do not. The best way to get a sniper is with another sniper. The Marine snipers are the best in the world.


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Foreign Affairs; Miscellaneous; News/Current Events; US: District of Columbia; US: Maryland; US: Virginia; Your Opinion/Questions
KEYWORDS: alqaeda; copernicus2; sniper; terrorism
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To: livius
Grampa Dave is cool.
221 posted on 10/11/2002 4:12:02 PM PDT by DBtoo
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To: RAT Patrol
How does the Tarot card fit into this theory?

I did hear that Muslims and Tarot cards had some connection, but I can't recall where or what I heard. I hope someone here does recall and will or already has posted it.

222 posted on 10/11/2002 4:12:44 PM PDT by ladyinred
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To: section9
Your image of doughnut eating LEO's is the very reason there needs to be a Home Land Security with a new image of crime fighters.

223 posted on 10/11/2002 4:13:39 PM PDT by swheats
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To: LSUfan
Why could (they) not be Calypso Louies troops, or connected in some way. They are muslims and no doubt could use a little respect from someone. Especially a REAL Mullah from Mullahland to legitimize them as being relevant and of course, putting a coupla sheckles Riyals into the pot (hair weaving,Cadillacs, other expenses etc)

You can take the muslim off the camel but its hard to remove the camel from the muslim(look at yassir) . And those that have never seen a camel, long for tea-totaling pigless nights in Aytolla-ville(pilgrimage). Something tells me that American or foreign muslims don't get off on the 4th of July. If the FBI, BATF, CIA are looking for foreign'ers, IMO, their pissing up a tree. Just a feeling.....

224 posted on 10/11/2002 4:14:19 PM PDT by hosepipe
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To: aristeides
You'd think Moslem terrorists would be reluctant to shoot a cab driver in the D.C. area, where so many of the cab drivers are Moslem

If they shoot a moslime it only means that the victim goes to paradise sooner and becomes a martyr himself.
225 posted on 10/11/2002 4:17:19 PM PDT by johnb838
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To: DBtoo
If this were an AQ member he/she would NOT ever, ever, ever say they were ALLAH, like "I AM ALLAH." They might say they are GOD because to them that is not ALLAH but, they would not say "I AM ALLAH."

Also, it would be a dead give away.

If this were a person trying to make people think they were a muslim or AQ member they would HAVE used the term "I AM ALLAH" on the Tarot card instead of "I AM GOD."

226 posted on 10/11/2002 4:17:23 PM PDT by zeaal
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To: ladyinred
It's always the Angry White Male by default.
227 posted on 10/11/2002 4:17:26 PM PDT by DBtoo
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To: Lokibob
You have hit on the one line that has not yet been crossed, either on 9/11 or since. I hope it never is, although I suspect that the anthrax attacks last year were intended to cross that line. What is it? Multiple big hits continuing over multiple days across the nation. To take your point, what if such shootings were going on in Los Angeles, Denver, Chicago, St. Louis, the DC metro area, and Boston all at the same time? Or imagine of the anthrax attacks had continued, were perpetrated in cities across the country, and took more lives? Or if more than four planes were hijacked on 9/11, on the West Coast, in the central part of the country, and the East Coast nearly simultaneously, before anyone had a chance to realize what was happening. In other words, true warfare rather than the occasional guerrilla-style attack, (which the sniper shootings are, by the way). Terrorism is just sting-and-run guerrilla warfare by another name.
228 posted on 10/11/2002 4:17:34 PM PDT by Wolfstar
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To: Joe Hadenuf
I don't know why the don't send up a high altitude reconnaissance aircraft with wide angle, high resolution camera's and have it orbit for a few days. When the next shooting occurs, look at the images....

Brilliant! Why didn't the cops think of that, they could have had them by now. I think you ought to go volunteer to help out the ATF, they won't know how they got along without you.
229 posted on 10/11/2002 4:19:52 PM PDT by johnb838
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To: Joe Hadenuf
I hope our law enforcement agencies have enough sense to think of that! It seems easy enough to do, and they have a small enough area to work with.
230 posted on 10/11/2002 4:22:32 PM PDT by DBtoo
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To: Lokibob
All the signs in the basic post point to a terrorist cell. The only thing I questioned was not moving around the country.

OK, Sir, perhaps I was a bit quick to drop the Moron-bomb. I apologize. I do think that if they had them ready they probably would (or will) activate in other locales. As far as this team if they leave the area they give up their infrastructure. I also expect they have reconoitered this area extensively and would lose that advantage. And the metro area is big enough to move to a different quadrant each time and elude the heat.
231 posted on 10/11/2002 4:23:57 PM PDT by johnb838
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To: Joe Hadenuf
I am curious as to how long in advance the sniper(s, selected the targets.

As the number of hits increase, the chances that this person accidentally wasn't recorded on any surveillance tape becomes more of a joke. The shooter knows exactly where surveillance cameras are pointing at in the areas near the gas stations where he has done those hits.

If their is a surveillance camera pointing directly out the door, with enhancement technology, if the shooter was 200 yards out directly from that door, a fuzzy capture of them could occur.

I have this feeling that maybe 3 months ago, 6 months ago, all of these places were visited by the shooter. Once the shooter is captured, I bet you will get a bunch of vague recollections from folks who work near these businesses where the shots have been fired.

Just my hunch though.

232 posted on 10/11/2002 4:24:00 PM PDT by dogbyte12
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To: DBtoo
The Angry White Man Theory comes from past experience. Blacks and Hispanics tend to be more family-oriented than whites in my noticings. Whites tend to be more independent or smaller families. There's less connection, less love, more "opportunities" not to care, or, hate others. And throw in the "keeping up with the 'jones'es'" a good percentage of white baby-boomers and silent generation wanted to participate in, and you get a lot of "hurt" or "not good enough", nutjobs not knowing what to do next, so usually marrying and breeding. Granted, this is a very small percentage of the population... but that's my analysis.
233 posted on 10/11/2002 4:25:05 PM PDT by Little Bush
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To: Godebert
No, I didn't get this information from watching Enemy at the Gates. What piqued my interest was a documentary about the duel I watched on the History Channel.

But you're right, his name wasn't Koenig. He was an SS Colonel named Heinz Thorwald. He was still head of the Sniper School.

The funny thing is, I distinctly recall the documentary stating that the guy's name was Koenig! That's quite strange. It is possible that there was another German in the theater who was a sniper named Koenig and the producers of the documentary made a mistake.

Now that is strange! Anyhoo, here's a link for you....

http://216.198.255.120/russianpart/russnipers.html

Thanks for the correction. It's not often I make a complete boner like that. However, same story, different name. Wonder why the movie people changed the name to Zaitsev, as well.

Be Seeing You,

Chris

234 posted on 10/11/2002 4:26:05 PM PDT by section9
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To: swheats
Your image of doughnut eating LEO's is the very reason there needs to be a Home Land Security with a new image of crime fighters.

I'm using a blunt instrument, but trying to make a point. Too much of our domestic counterterrorism doctrine in law enforcement still seems to be reactive, when we need to be actively hunting these people to the point that they make mistakes.

Be Seeing You,

Chris

235 posted on 10/11/2002 4:28:20 PM PDT by section9
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To: johnb838
The ATF has a tendency to screw up a lot, along with the FBI.
236 posted on 10/11/2002 4:30:02 PM PDT by DBtoo
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To: johnb838
Brilliant! Why didn't the cops think of that, they could have had them by now. I think you ought to go volunteer to help out the ATF, they won't know how they got along without you.

Thanks, but I work alone.....

237 posted on 10/11/2002 4:31:20 PM PDT by Joe Hadenuf
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To: shattered
The murdered taxicab driver (male) was East Indian. He happened to be an inlaw of my wife's best friend from school days. The friend has, unfortunately, has had other difficult issues to deal with recently, as well.
238 posted on 10/11/2002 4:32:10 PM PDT by steve86
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To: RAT Patrol
Would an Islamic say "I am god" or "I am Allah?"

You know, they never mentioned the language that the message was written in. Also, I heard on a news report that there were "three dozen" additional words in the message that they are not letting out.

239 posted on 10/11/2002 4:35:12 PM PDT by adaven
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Comment #240 Removed by Moderator


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