Posted on 09/24/2002 2:09:34 PM PDT by BlessingInDisguise
Colorado Libertarians amused and irritated at secret ‘spy file’ kept by Denver police
Colorado LP leaders say they are more amused than angry that a newly released Denver Police Department "spy file" describes the Libertarian Party as a "militia" type organization.
"A political party as a militia group? How ridiculous!" said John Berntson, State Chair of the Colorado LP. "Is this the quality of the law enforcement in Denver? Is Barney Fife running the shop?"
According to news reports, the Denver Police Department maintained files on approximately 3,200 Colorado citizens and 208 organizations from across the political spectrum.
The files, which were released to the public in early September, listed the Libertarian Party as a "Militia type organization, pro gun rights."
Former Colorado LP Publications Director Ari Armstrong said the analysis of the party as a militia-style group is flat out wrong.
"The Libertarian Party does not conduct or participate in military-style training," he noted. Instead, it runs candidates for public office, engages in political lobbying efforts, and "participates in peaceable demonstrations in support of individual rights.
"Why the Denver Police Department targeted for investigation the Libertarian Party for peaceably advocating the Bill of Rights remains a mystery," he said.
Overall, the revelation of a Libertarian Party police file was "not a surprise, but it's an outrage," said Armstrong. "Apparently, peaceably advocating the Bill of Rights warrants a police investigation."
The mischaracterization of the Libertarian Party's political nature does raise profound doubts about the intelligence of the Denver Police, said Berntson.
"The files themselves are laughable to the extent that they illustrate just how pathetically ill-informed the Denver P.D. is," he said. "They are also scary for the same reason.
"This is nothing more than government inefficiency and stupidity. This is Denver's tax dollars at their worst, and Denver's citizens should be appalled at their police."
The files became public knowledge this spring, and set off a firestorm of controversy throughout Colorado. Civil libertarians said the files were a worrisome invasion of privacy, similar to the surveillance files kept by former FBI Director J. Edgar Hoover.
In response, Denver Mayor Wellington E. Webb instructed the police department to destroy the files -- but only after giving copies to the individuals and organizations that had been monitored.
"It was very clear that something went wrong here," said Andrew Hudson, a spokesman for the mayor. "[Police] intelligence work is necessary, but has to be done right and in a way in which civil liberties aren't trampled."
Began in 1999, the spy files were in the form of a computer database. Records were kept on community activists, "social justice" organizations, and individuals who had attended political meetings and rallies.
The American Civil Liberties Union (ACLU) has filed a federal civil rights lawsuit against the Denver Police Department over the files.
The release of the files began in early September. About 300 people and representative of about 70 groups crowded into police headquarters to review their files.
Walter Schlomer, the Colorado LP's fundraising director, picked up a copy of the Libertarian Party's file on September 5.
"It's an outrage," said Schlomer. "In spite of no record of violence or illegal activity of any kind, the Denver P.D. felt it neessary to secretly spy on the LP and keep track of our activities."
In addition to describing the Libertarian Party as a "Militia type organization," and noting it was "pro gun rights," the brief file gave the LP a "Law Enforcement" classification. Police did not explain what that meant.
The file also listed the Libertarian Party's "AKA Name" as the "Denver Metro Libertarian Party," which is a local affiliate of the state LP. In a section labeled "Person Associations," five listings were blacked out.
"There are words and lines blacked out by what looks to be a black marker," said Schlomer. "These represent names in the first two lines and I'm not sure what in the next lines."
Responding to criticism about the files, the Denver Police Department acknowledged that some groups were improperly characterized as "criminal extremists." A police spokesman said untrained clerks mistakenly shoehorned every organization into the few options available in the software's limited menu.
The spokesman also said the department will continue to maintain "intelligence files" only on people who are suspected or convicted of criminal activity, and will have an outside consultant review the files for appropriateness.
Every day adds to your level of ignorance. Restoration of the BOR is the Prime goal of just about every libertarian I've ever met. Not just heard of second hand, but face-to-face. Your deliberate idiocy is getting tiresome.
Gramsci-Marxist .
You are such a wanna-be fascist. You know damn well that libertarian principles center around a free market, anarcho-capitalism style.
The only ones I see fighting against freedom here are you and your pack of Brownshirts.
Don't flatter yourself. My life revolves around my family, my faith, and my business. If I spend a total of six hours a week at FR shoveling libertarian agit-prop bull manure back into the faces that spew it, that's a lot.
I spend more time weeding my garden.
Bulsh1t. The man has no sense of what a free-market society is. Central government controls over the means of production seem to be just fine from his POV. Anathema to a libertarian.
From a quick Google search on Chomsky, he's a liberal. I know the difference between a liberal and a libertarian may be beyond your mental capabilities to understand, but let's give it a shot.
Liberal:
No individual Rights.
No free market.
Government social programs at the expense of the successful.
No personal responsibility or suffering of consequences of your actions.
No Right to self defense.
Socialist.
Libertarian:
Free Market.
Small government whose sole purpose is to protect our equal human Rights.
Government has no Right to rob Paul to pay off Peters lazy ass.
If you are dumb enough to screw up your life, then you WILL suffer the consequences.
Individual Rights are paramount and cannot be infringed. Just because some of them are on a list somewhere, doesn't mean that list is all inclusive. No, this does not mean you have a Right to a free lunch and a big screen TV.
Providing for your own safety starts with you. Arm yourself.
Get the idea? I know you won't. You wouldn't DARE speak the truth about the Libertarians and what we believe as it would undermine your little empire of hate and deceit. You are a FRAUD and you damn well know it.
If the founders had followed your train of thought, we'd still be a part of the British Empire.
Backwards.
A cult philosophy built on fantasy has very little truth at its disposal.
Answer this one question:
Do we have indiviual Rights? Or are they collective Rights?
Spitting isn't a refutation.
If you are too dim witted to see the difference, then there is no hope for you at all. The root of the word "liberal" is that same as in "liberty", but no one would mistake them for anything other than "socialists". Do not do the same here. It only makes you look like an idiot.
And McCain is supposed to be a Republican? All parties have their embarrassing members.
Anarchy, like its close cousin Communism, is destructive of property rights.
"It is agreed by those who have seriously considered the subject, that no individual has, of natural right, a separate property in an acre of land, for instance. By an universal law, indeed, whatever, whether fixed or movable, belongs to all men equally and in common, is the property for the moment of him who occupies it, but when he relinquishes the occupation, the property goes with it. Stable ownership is the gift of social law, and is given late in the progress of society."
--Thomas Jefferson"Let this be the distinctive mark of an American that in cases of commotion, he enlists himself under no man's banner, inquires for no man's name, but repairs to the standard of the laws. Do this, and you need never fear anarchy or tyranny. Your government will be perpetual."
--Thomas Jefferson"Our falling into anarchy would decide forever the destinies of mankind, and seal the political heresy that man is incapable of self-government."
--Thomas Jefferson
Do your close friends (as such may be defined) know of your fedophiliac tendencies?
A Libertarian Socialist hates our American governments because they initiate societal force to establish and protect systems of private property.
A Libertarian Party members hates our American governments because they initiate societal force to establish and protect systems of public property.
The two differ from each other like Swift's big-endians and little-endians.
This is well stated.
Meanwhile the Libertarian Party--which IS a front for many people dedicated to the Gramsci-Marxist destruction of this nation, will continue its anti-America activities under the cloak of "patriotism."
This, however, is not.
I have some serious departures from the national Libertarian Party, and while I would agree that they are open to some serious criticism, it is totally unfair to characterize libertarians as followers of Marxism in general, or Noam Chomsky in particular.
Now, if you really think that I am your enemy, then don't hide how you really feel. If you think libertarians ought to be brought before the house comittee on unamerican activities, fine. But don't try to hide your hatred of me behind a false patriot front of your own.
You obviously haven't been paying attention again. The LP is all about property Rights. Starting with your body is your property. The products of your labor are your property. You have a Right to keep others from forcibly TAKING your property. Ect... The ONLY just purpose for a government is protection of those Rights from force or fraud. Anarchists don't even believe in that much and are NOT representitive of libertarian thought.
Once again, you display an incredible amount of ignorance. This from a so-called conservative who believe's that it's OK to strip our Rights away as long as the guy doing it has an (R) next to his name.
P.S. That first Jefferson qoute, as has already been pointed out, is WAY out of context. He was decribing the Native Indian view of land-ownership. Not our model for property. If you are going to qoute him, make sure you aren't mangaling the context.
There is no such thing as a left libertarian. Leftist philosophy requires govm't control of economic operations by directing those operations, govm't distribution of wealth according to some govm't scheme and govm't control of property as in wealth.
Libertarian philosophy holds that govm'ts only justification for existence is to protect rights and sanction violations against those rights. That means that such activities as regulation of the Free market can only go sofar as to provide fairness. Fairness is judged on whether, or not, fraud and coericon are present. Govm't control and direction for any other reason is not allowed. Friedman and Heyak would fit here, that's why they don't appear on the anarchist's site. That site only promotes hard core leftists.
The site you provided is an anarchist site, that's it. There's no truth to what they say. They have usurped the word libertarian, in a fashion similar to the way the socialists usurped the word liberal from it's prior meaning. The reason they did that is for obfuscation purposes. ie. War is peace and liberty is domination. The correct word for the "left libertarian" described on that site is liberal.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.