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Eclipse: First Flight (Revolutionary Jet, First Flight!!)
Aero-News.net ^ | 08/26/2002 | Jim "Zoom" Campbell

Posted on 08/26/2002 11:23:02 AM PDT by taildragger

We have just received word that the Eclipse 500 micro-jet has made its first flight.

The world's newest jet was just taxiing back to the hangar, as we spoke to Eclipse spokeswoman Cory Canada, who said that the test pilot, Bill Bubb, wasn't out of the plane yet; and, by the way, how did we know? [Thank you, News-Spy! --ed.]

Details of the (roughly) 45-minute Monday morning flight are sketchy; we have calls in to the company, and expect to be updating this spot throughout the day. Stay tuned!

Additional Details... Well after we posted the first announcement of the flight, we received the following official statement. Please note that we are working up several other details and stories for you all for this evening.

"Eclipse Aviation Corporation today announced the successful first flight of its flagship aircraft, the next-generation Eclipse 500 jet. Piloted by Bill Bubb, Eclipse Aviation's chief test pilot, the Eclipse 500 jet took to the air at 9:18 a.m. MST, flying as planned for approximately 60 minutes.

'I applaud the Eclipse team, our investors, suppliers and partners for their steadfast dedication to realizing our dream of changing the way people travel,' said Vern Raburn, president and CEO of Eclipse Aviation. 'What we accomplished today is now part of aviation history. Today we stand together, more certain than ever that the Eclipse 500 will forever change the landscape of transportation.'

The Eclipse 500 offers performance characteristics and economics that are enabling the creation of alternatives to today's commercial air travel system. The Eclipse 500 will allow travelers to fly point-to-point to more than 10,000 airports in the U.S. alone, ushering in an age where point-to-point private jet travel will be available to everyone at affordable prices. This will be a dramatic departure from today's commercial airline system, which forces 70 percent of all air travelers to pass through 29 increasingly crowded "hub" airports.

Flight-testing was conducted in a designated test zone located south of Albuquerque, New Mexico.

The first test flight was designed to investigate basic maneuverability and allow for initial aircraft systems checking. The first tests occurred at 9,000 feet (2,743.2 m) where the flight crew successfully evaluated engine handling, aircraft stability and control, general flying qualities and systems performance.

The first flight of the Eclipse 500 marks the start of a 16-month testing program, involving eight test airframes. The flight-test program will culminate with FAA certification, scheduled to occur in December 2003.

'We completed all test conditions as planned and were very pleased with the results,' said Bubb. 'The Eclipse team did an excellent job of building the aircraft. The quality is remarkable and the workmanship is outstanding.'

The Eclipse 500 is a six-person jet aircraft that sells for $837,500 (in June 2000 dollars). At this price, it costs approximately a quarter of today's small jet aircraft and will be significantly safer, easier and less expensive to fly. The Eclipse 500 flies 355 knots and can travel 1,300 nautical miles (about the distance between Boston and Miami) at a cost of approximately 56 cents a mile to operate. First customer deliveries of the Eclipse 500 are scheduled to occur in January 2004.


TOPICS: Breaking News; Business/Economy
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To: taildragger
Couple of interesting questions.
How long until they stick a REALLY good autopilot in one ?
Can they make one adapted for arctic cold. That seattle / alaksa hunt could get a lot cheaper and more secure for clients and their rifles.

Final question : Aerobatic rated Eclipses could be the executive/yuppie jet fighter toys of this century.

41 posted on 08/26/2002 12:23:27 PM PDT by Centurion2000
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Comment #42 Removed by Moderator

To: Ditto
I'll tell you who needs MagLev.

All those folks trying to go from Los Angeles to Las Vegas and back every weekend.

Put a MagLev alongside I-15 and it would do wonders. That drive is the pits.

Cheers.

43 posted on 08/26/2002 12:26:28 PM PDT by Sundog
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To: taildragger
Bump for my always in flight husband to read...
44 posted on 08/26/2002 12:27:24 PM PDT by dubyagee
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To: euthanation
I wonder what makes this jet--which costs 1/4th of today's jet--significantly safer to fly than existing jets.

The engine technology, basically the same as the cruise missle. A lot less complex, a very high thrust to weight ratio (the engine only weighs 85 lbs.) that has proven to be super reliable.

45 posted on 08/26/2002 12:29:02 PM PDT by Ditto
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To: Sundog
Put a MagLev alongside I-15 and it would do wonders. That drive is the pits.

Sounds great --- as long as I don't have to pay for it with my tax dollars.

46 posted on 08/26/2002 12:30:51 PM PDT by Ditto
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To: Gritty
That's bad news for the major carriers.

You got that right. Business travellers will abandon the commercial cattle cars in droves and will gladly pay a premium, just to avoid the hassles of major airports and the traffic in and out of the major cities. Not to mention the "ego-trip" that comes with chartering your own plane (even if you might share it with four or five others).

The airlines will lose their best paying customers and will be left with planeloads of screaming babies and harried parents headed to grandmas or Disneyland. They will be the "Greyhound" buses of tomorrow (and it could be argued they already are.) As a result, look for there to be only one or two major airlines left in the business when this all shakes out. Mostly likely Delta and Southwest.

47 posted on 08/26/2002 12:35:36 PM PDT by SamAdams76
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To: Ditto
"It has significantly lower Operating Costs than a piston engine and even lower then a conventional jet engine. The engines are not like conventional jet engines. They are derived from cruise missile technology." Ditto, Sorta. The Fuel system uses the same type of systems as the "expendables" i.e fuel up the centershaft and slung via centrifugal force into the combustion chamber. They are working on 2 other technologies that will make this engine even more revolutionary and they are to be incorperated when they mature. All I tell you can be found on the web. I do not work for them.

The other technolgy is a combination Starter/Generator intergral one of the main shafts. this will help eliminate gearboxes.

The 3rd Technology is "Foil" Bearings, bearings that need no oil, hence no lubrication system. NASA has a bunch of PHD Wonks in Up-State New York working on these, these will be revolutionary in many industries.

I wonder when Eclipse will go public with an IPO, Man oh Man.....

48 posted on 08/26/2002 12:36:46 PM PDT by taildragger
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To: Willie Green
LOL. It looks like magnets on the bottom of that pork barrel to me.
49 posted on 08/26/2002 12:37:50 PM PDT by Ditto
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To: Ditto
Hey ditto, you working on this program?
50 posted on 08/26/2002 12:38:27 PM PDT by taildragger
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To: taildragger
No -- I wish. I am just anxious for the day I can call the air taxi to meet me at an airport a few miles from my house and take me to an airport a few miles from my destination so I can forget about the big airport/connecting flight hell I have been through far too many times.
51 posted on 08/26/2002 12:45:59 PM PDT by Ditto
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To: SamAdams76; Criminal Number 18F; All
This six-seater that flys for 56 cents a mile will revolutionize air travel. Consider the following scenario:

There is a small airport in Bedford, MA which is about 15 minutes from where I live and I often travel to Edison, NJ on business, which is also by a small airport about 15 minutes away. It normally takes me close to five hours to drive there and I have to deal with NYC traffic.

These two points are 210 miles apart as the crow flies. At 56 cents a mile, the cost of the trip is $117. Divide that by six passengers and the cost drops under $20 per person. Not bad for what used to be a four or five hour drive! Not to mention the fact that I can now get from my house to my company's office in Edison, NJ in just over an hour (assuming a 40 minute flight time at about 400mph)!

Expect to see thousands of these aircraft flooding our skies and a lot less 737s. Hopefully these planes are quietier!

Everyone seems to have forgotten something: where are we going to get all the pilots to fly the "thousands" of new Eclipses? Even Eclipse hasn't figured that out yet.

Also, while we're at it, is the 56 cent per mile figure figuring in the overhead cost of keeping a couple of full time pilots on staff and having a dedicated corporate flight department? Also, has maintenance, and the inevitable ADs, been figured into the cost?

Make no mistake about it, I think Eclipse, and SATS, are the future, but let's not forget that flying is still an unnatural act in a hostile environment for homo sapien.

52 posted on 08/26/2002 12:47:50 PM PDT by SBeck
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To: Ditto
The 1900D and similar have turboprop engines: in essence, they're jets with propellers. There's an active market for prop planes because they are more efficient than jets for these sorts of routes.

Note that there's nothing particularly special about cruise missile engines, either. Cruise missile engines are nothing more than small jet engines, designed to fit in a compact case. There's a tradeoff between performance and size.

And, because they were designed for cruise missiles, I predict that these things are going to take a lot of robustifying: there's a big difference between an engine designed for a single 12-hour flight, and an engine designed for thousands of hours of flight time. That 56 cents/mile is interesting, but probably incomplete because it seems not to include the likely replacement/repair costs.

As to the "air taxi" business case, it's full of holes. The Eclipse offers nothing that current planes do not already offer. They can get to the same airports, in the same amount of time, for just about the same price.

Note, BTW, that a significant part of the price is not mentioned here: you have to pay for the pilot as well as the plane. If you're flying 1300 miles for golf, you've bought one or two pilots for the day. Each pilot costs the company something on the order of $150/hr, and you and your golfing buddies get to split that up, too. And don't forget airport fees.

Finally, be careful of your bias here: you're still assuming that the alternative is to fly a Boeing to a hub, but it's not. Instead, it's a choice between flying and Eclipse or a Beechcraft to your destination.

And in that regard the "newness" of the air taxi idea should be cause for suspicion: one might reasonably conclude that there's no market for it beyond what the current charter companies already serve.

53 posted on 08/26/2002 12:51:10 PM PDT by r9etb
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To: Ditto
...at a cost of approximately 56 cents a mile to operate.

Still, significantly more than two pennies a mile...oh wait.
That was 30 years ago. Inflation.

54 posted on 08/26/2002 12:53:39 PM PDT by Calvin Locke
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To: Sundog
All those folks trying to go from Los Angeles to Las Vegas and back every weekend.

I was making the trip from San Diego, CA to Pocatello, ID along I-15. The segment from San Diego to Las Vegas was about 5 1/2 hours. It's more pleasant to drive that desert segment in the dead of night. Cool temperatures and limited traffic.

55 posted on 08/26/2002 1:01:55 PM PDT by Myrddin
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To: SBeck
Everyone seems to have forgotten something: where are we going to get all the pilots to fly the "thousands" of new Eclipses? Even Eclipse hasn't figured that out yet.

Create the demand and a way will be found to supply it. Sounds like a great career opportunity for people who want to get into the piloting business. Correct me if I'm wrong but I believe that a person off the street could be trained to fly this aircraft in 3-6 months. Just make the training rigorous to weed out the unsuitable candidates and give the trainees enough experience so that clients would feel comfortable flying with them. Flight school might be a little expensive but then, so is college and technical schools.

Also, while we're at it, is the 56 cent per mile figure figuring in the overhead cost of keeping a couple of full time pilots on staff and having a dedicated corporate flight department? Also, has maintenance, and the inevitable ADs, been figured into the cost?

I did not mention that when I gave the example of how it would cost $19 a person to fly six people from Massachusetts to New Jersey. Obviously there is more overhead than just flying the plane and you have to pay the pilots too. So I didn't meant to suggest that people would be paying $19 for a ticket. More likely, the ticket would approach $100 once the pilot and mechanic (and others) takes their cut. But considering the conveniences and the time saved, business travellers will find it a bargain.

56 posted on 08/26/2002 1:02:02 PM PDT by SamAdams76
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To: TomB
Good question. But I think in a "private" jet, you would know who your fellow passengers are.

On the other hand, if a commercial fleet of Eclipses purports to charter passengers to 10,000 different airports, you have in effect a mini-airline that is competing on the basis of better fares and more selection in airports.

But the security aspect is left unresolved. I wish it were resolved.
57 posted on 08/26/2002 1:07:05 PM PDT by Hostage
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To: Ditto
I am just anxious for the day I can call the air taxi to meet me at an airport a few miles from my house and take me to an airport a few miles from my destination so I can forget about the big airport/connecting flight hell I have been through far too many times.

Never happen. The weather in the 'Burgh is too variable and inclement, resulting in unreliable service and delays.
You'd be much better off catching an all-weather trolley to the Magport.

58 posted on 08/26/2002 1:08:22 PM PDT by Willie Green
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To: Willie Green
You'd be much better off catching an all-weather trolley to the Magport.

LOL. And go to Philly or Cleveland even if I don't have to? Say I needed to go to Morristown, New Jersey or Bristol, Tennessee or Rockford, Illinois, or Glenn Rose, Texas instead. (all trips I have made recently) How many Magports would I need to endure to make those trips?

59 posted on 08/26/2002 1:37:39 PM PDT by Ditto
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To: SamAdams76
Create the demand and a way will be found to supply it.

There's already a supply, in the form of cheap-to-buy-and-operate propeller planes. What seems to be missing is the demand. The mere fact that Eclipse has come out with a tiny jet won't do much to make people pay for the taxi service's large investment. There's a reason why the market isn't there -- most likely because it's a expensive sort of taxi.

I did not mention that when I gave the example of how it would cost $19 a person to fly six people from Massachusetts to New Jersey. Obviously there is more overhead than just flying the plane and you have to pay the pilots too. So I didn't meant to suggest that people would be paying $19 for a ticket.

The pilot alone probably costs $150/hour -- so your 12-hour business trip costs $1800 for his day, per pilot. (One presumes you want to fly home, too, so he has to wait around for you to finish.) Maintenance and infrastructure will add more to it. Profit, overhead, etc. raise the cost even more.

Finally, let's take a look at that cost: $900K per plane. How might a taxi service pay for the price of the plane in a reasonable amount of time? The business model here is essentially one, and probably almost never more than two, trips per plane, per day. Let's assume that the plane flies 320 days/year. That's got to pay for the plane, its maintenance, pilots, overhead, etc., not to mention providing a profit.

If I want to break even in 4 years, then I have to clear something like $700/day, over and above pilots, fuel, maintenance, etc.

For a 1,000 mile one-way flight, that plane will bring in one "fare" per day. At $0.56/mile, two-way operating expense is $1120. The price of one pilot is $1800. Company overhead is (say) $300. Desired profit for the day is $100.

Total cost for the day: $3320.

(I've left out a number of costs like airport fees, stadium taxes, etc.)

You and your 5 friends have to pony up about $550 apiece for the flight, just for the air taxi firm to stay in business. Starts to sound like something less than a great deal -- which is why there's no bustling air-taxi industry out there now.

60 posted on 08/26/2002 1:38:28 PM PDT by r9etb
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