Posted on 12/24/2001 8:50:21 PM PST by Bobby777
what ever your views are FReep this poll!!! let's keep this thing bumped ... the score is terrible ... c'mon Christians ... it's on the left ... a little bit down ...
You comments require a more lengthy explanation, so bear with me here. God created us with a free will and with the ability to think and reason. We are not his puppets to be controlled. As free-thinking individuals, with unique backgrounds, we will not all have the identical understanding when reading God's Word. Hence, the different interpretations of some words, the different translations written, the different doctrines preached in many churches. They are the result of disagreement among human beings. Martin Luther separated himself from the Catholics by stating that to man was given the ability to have direct access to God, through Jesus Christ, and the Holy Spirit who provides to us guidance and understanding, directly, when we individually read God's Word. The Catholic doctrine was that only the priests could provide meaning of God's Word and access to God, Himself. This caused a split in the Roman Catholic church. Some translations of the Bible (i.e., the Living Bible) were written so that the text was written in contemporary English. These, however, should not be used as a serious study Bible. Strong's Concordance brings the serious student back to the original text (Aramaic, Hebrew, whatever) and provides several different possible translations for the word or phrase.
In areas that appear gray in scripture, our different viewpoints, when shared, adds to a deeper understanding (much like when you mix different ingredients into a soup mixture, the end result is much more pleasant and fulfilling than if the single ingredients are enjoyed separately).
Nevertheless, scripture is clear about many things, but even on those issues some people, rather than seeking God's will, have an agenda to fulfill, and God warns us of these folks:
1 Tim. 1: (6) For some men, straying from these things, have turned aside to fruitless discussion, (7) wanting to be teachers of the Law, even though they do not understand either what they are saying or the matters about which they make confident assertions. . . . (9) realizing the fact that law is not made for a righteous man, but for those who are lawless and rebellious, for the ungodly and sinners, for the unholy and profane, for those who kill their fathers or mothers, for murderers (10) and immoral men and homosexuals and kidnappers and liars and perjurers, and whatever else is contrary to sound teaching . . .;God is constantly telling us to look to Him for how to live our lives, what to think and believe, and for guidance, not to put our ultimate trust on men, who will fail us (in word and deed) because they are not perfect and do not have, therefore, a perfect understanding of God:1 Tim. 6: (3)"If anyone advocates a different doctrine, and does not agree with sound words, those of our Lord Jesus Christ, and with the doctrine conforming to godliness, (4) he is conceited and understands nothing; but he has a morbid interest in controversial questions and disputes about the words, out of which arise envy, strife, abusive language, evil suspicions, (5) and constant friction between men of depraved mind and deprived of the truth . . . (11) But flee from these things, you man of God, and pursue righteousness, godliness, faith, love, perseverance and gentleness . . .
1 Thess. 4:11: . . . make it your ambition to lead a quiet life and attend to your own business and work with your hands, just as we commanded you; (12) so that you may behave properly toward outsiders and not be in any need.Verse 8 of Philippians is the perfect description of Christ. He is: true, honorable, right, pure, lovely, of good repute, excellent, and worthy of praise. He is the One whom we should dwell on, not what other men are saying and doing. If we spent our mind and time trying to imitate these things of Christ, we would become more like Him and people would begin to resemble each other more in their thoughts, deeds, characteristics. For example, if all Christians spent more time in the Word, applying it to themselves, patterning themselves after Christ, you would find more Christians who are loving, empathetic, of like mind regarding scripture, humble, kind, generous, wise, not busy-bodies, etc. But, not many Christians do what God wants, therefore, you see self and selfish agendas being imposed in church doctrines, church leadership, etc.Philippians 3: (6) Be anxious for nothing, but in everything by prayer and supplication with thanksgiving let your requests be made known to God. (7) And the peace of God, which surpasses all comprehension, shall guard your hearts and your minds in Christ Jesus. (8) Finally, bretheren, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is of good repute, if there is any excellence and if anything worthy of praise, let your mind dwell on these things.
KJV 2 Peter 1:1-3 1. Simon Peter, a servant and an apostle of Jesus Christ, to them that have obtained like precious faith with us through the righteousness of God and our Saviour Jesus Christ: 2. Grace and peace be multiplied unto you through the knowledge of God, and of Jesus our Lord. ||
I do not see the contradiction you cite..I might say My husband and my lover XXX(regarding my husband)..He might say my wife and the mother of my children and mean me..you are just looking for a reason to doubt the divinity of Christ..
We have been pretty snowed in here..so I have not had an opportunity to parse the Matthew Henry quote..( a Calvinist that believed in the divinity of Christ :>)
You have a right to be! RNMOM said it best.....
I started to read the Bible for the first time in my life.
Amen MOMMA!!!!!
May I suggest you read the Gospel of John, all the way through, and when you're done, read it again; and when you've finished it a second time, read it once more. The Holy Spirit will speak to you as you read, showing you what He wants you to see. You can also, after the third time through, read the references to different verses back and forward from the Old Testament to New Testament. My humble opinion and advice.
The teachings of churches are the imperfect interpretations of other men. Only the Word of God is perfect, and you can never hear it from his lips. Best then, that you should interpret his words for yourself rather than trust others to do so for you.
IMHO...
PS That the misled use the Bible as an excuse for evil is merely a perversion, and casts no light onto the Bible itself. Just as those who use a rock to murder do not make the rock a thing of evil. Again, IMHO...
FReegards...
Do you or do you take it on "faith"
I took an Anthropology course a few years ago..the young professor told us that it would be taught from an evolutionary perspective. That we were free to disagree,but we would have to prove what we said
I then sat through a class devoid of any proof at all.
Every evolutionary premises was preceded with "We believe that " NO proof at all!
I would be interested in your "first cause" proof of evolution..
You asked me why would G_d go through the complexity of evolution. My question to you is, why did G_d go through the complexity of giving us a vestigal tailbone, an appendix, nipples on men, dinosaurs, remains of proto-humans and Neanderthals, Universal expansion that indicates 15 billion years of existence, bacteria on Mars, trillions and trillions of stars and planets when only one set would be required, Children with genetic disorders, and so on.
I'm not some snake in the garden trying to lead you astray.... evolution and the bible are not in conflict. I'm not sure why some ministers try to say otherwise.... maybe its a power thing.
Some light reading material....
So why did evolved man need Jesus? When did God promise a savior and why?
Today there are 'denominations' that were once good, bible preaching, soul winning organizations, but they have lost their light. The gospel has been watered down, sins are tolerated, growth is overlooked. Membership is steadily declining as people hunger for the truth and look elsewhere.
But, there are individual churches within the group that are alive and vibrant. It GREATLY depends on the main man, the guy in the pulpit, whether he is lead by God or his own heart. On the flip side, there are expanding denominations today that can have some poor churches in them.
Do not confuse style with content. Many fine OLD churches have a style that is more formal. Big stone buildings, powerful pipe organs, fixed wooden (maybe even padded!) pews, an established tradition, a more ritual type of music and worship time, with an offertory song being played as the ushers pass among the aisles, taking up the Sunday offering.
Many fine young churches look like a shopping mall. In fact, may MEET in a rented store front. They may have a sanctuary of moveable chairs, music with guitars, drums, cymbals and the worshipers may clap their hands and tap their feet and may not even take up a collection, but have a box for folks to drop their tithes and offerings into as they enter or leave.
People are different and the way they are comfortable with worshiping are different. Some like a small church; one where it feels like a large family. Others prefer a large church; one that may have more variety of ministries in it.
My own church is a small to medium size, with a desire to reach more people. We are also adding an extra service to try to reach younger folks. Now they've grown up in a different culture than us old fogies and they worship different too.
While the WAY we present the Message may be different for them, it is STILL the Message. There is still power in the blood!
Some of the most charming and charismatic preachers and teachers can deliver a milktoast message. And, some of the most BORING guys can have lessons that are just jammed full of good stuff. You must discriminate and judge the message separate from the man.
Above all, learn to hear that still, small voice of God. He is a gentleman - does not shout (well, not TOO often) <- that's a joke.... but sometimes we DO need shouted at!
James Chapter One
5. If any of you lacks wisdom, he should ask God, who gives generously to all without finding fault, and it will be given to him.
You'll wonder, "What?? where did THAT come from??"
This happens to me often. And when it does, it pierces my heart greatly--at those times I especially feel His love and concern for my welfare and His presence. God uses the same Words for different reasons, sometimes as encouragement through a present trouble, yet another time the same passage He uses as a promise for future blessings, one I overlooked when I needed only encouragement, still another time I feel God's forgiveness when I've done a wrong, to Him or within my life--God speaks to me through His Word, in whatever circumstance, using the same Words but yet again, not. The Word of God lives and breathes; I change, yet He does not. No other text I read affects me the way God's Word does. Our God is an awesome God.
Thanks for the history lesson GW
Nope. I know of many individuals to whom it also happens. (Of course, that would only be with people who read their Bibles more than once, lol.) And the other thing, usually when I speak with someone with whom it's happened, it's usually been scripture applied to them, personally, not for finger-pointing, if you know what I mean.
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