Posted on 05/01/2022 5:48:54 AM PDT by FarCenter
...
The apparently monolithic liberal west itself also cannot be understood if we forget how, historically, Europe is also a two-headed beast: one head may be tracked from Charlemagne all the way to the awful Brussels Eurocrat machine; and the other one comes from Athens and Rome, and via Byzantium/Constantinople (the Second Rome) reaches all the way to Moscow (the Third Rome).
Latin Europe, for the Orthodox, is seen as a hybrid usurper, preaching a distorted Christianity which only refers to St. Augustine, practicing absurd rites and neglecting the very important Holy Ghost. The Europe of Christian Popes invented what is considered a historical hydra – Byzantium – where Byzantines were actually Greeks living under the Roman Empire.
Western Europeans for their part see the Orthodox and the Christians from the East (see how they were abandoned by the west in Syria under ISIS and Al Qaeda) as satraps and a bunch of smugglers – while the Orthodox regard the Crusaders, the Teutonic chevaliers and the Jesuits – correctly, we must say – as barbarian usurpers bent on world conquest.
In the Orthodox canon, a major trauma is the fourth Crusade in 1204 which utterly destroyed Constantinople. The Frankish chevaliers happened to eviscerate the most dazzling metropolis in the world, which congregated at the time all the riches from Asia.
That was the definition of cultural genocide. The Frankish also happened to be aligned with some notorious serial plunderers: the Venetians. No wonder, from that historical juncture onwards, a slogan was born: “Better the Sultan’s turban than the Pope’s tiara.”
So since the 8th century, Carolingian and Byzantine Europe were de facto at war across an Iron Curtain from the Baltics to the Mediterranean (compare it with the emerging New Iron Curtain of Cold War 2.0). After the barbarian invasions, they neither spoke the same language nor practiced the same writing, rites or theology.
Many freeper have gone down this road and pointed this part of history out, most here do not grasp its impact. The first world war started over this Catholic/Orthodox conflict. The second world War genocide in the Balkans also. The split of Yugoslavia Croation/Serbian split... This ancient conflict is still going on in modern times.
I think the Crimean War would also fit that pattern. The Turks were oppressing Christians — who should be their protector? Russia? or France? For a variety of reasons, it all spiraled out of control but the clash of Christianities was very important here.
Great article!
very interesting TY - OGINJ
The West (led by the Clinton/Obama/Biden axis of evil) are pushing the militant degenerate homosexual/transsexual/pedophile agenda on the entire world.
Their ultimate goal is total control of the populace (Soros, Schwab, Rothschild, etc.) and want the ability to have sex with children of any age, at any time, any place, any way.
Your welcome. I didn’t understand the last part and was looking it up, then I realized it was your signature. Got a good laugh,... and another cup of coffee.
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Moscow church destroyed in sign of new Russian repression Posted on Sep 26, 2012 | by Jill Nelson
MOSCOW (BP) -- It was in the early hours of the morning on Sept. 6 when Pastor Vasili Romanyuk's phone rang. A group of men backed by local police were demolishing his Holy Trinity Pentecostal Church, housed in a three-story building nestled in a Moscow suburb. As word spread, congregants arrived at the scene hoping to save the building, but their efforts were futile. By dawn the church was in ruins and some of its most valuable contents were missing.
An isolated incident? A misunderstanding? Analysts watching the current climate in the former Cold War country don't think so: "This destruction of the church is about as concrete of evidence as you can get that something very bad and very troubling is taking place," said Katrina Lantos Swett, chair of the U.S. Commission on International Religious Freedom. "This could not have happened without the backing, support, and implicit blessing of the police."
The incident is just one sign of deteriorating freedoms in Russia, and behind the scenes a cozy relationship between the Kremlin and the Russian Orthodox Church has raised more than a few eyebrows. As President Vladimir Putin digs into his third term, a number of Kremlin crackdowns involving vague interpretations of the country's extremism law and other human-rights abuses are troubling signs that the country has slipped into a familiar, repressive era.
"When you have unknown people backed by the police coming out at midnight to begin tearing down a church, you know something doesn't smell right," Lantos Swett said.
Officials evicted Holy Trinity Church from its original building in 1995 and relocated the church to the eastern Moscow suburb. The congregation used its own funds to construct a new building and repeatedly battled officials over permits. The church demolition and its history reflect an emerging pattern: Authorities confiscate land from non-favored religious communities and force the congregation to relocate to a remote suburb, the religious leaders apply for permits that are subsequently denied, and officials confiscate (once again) or demolish the relocated congregation, citing lack of proper documentation.
Pastor Romanyuk and a small group of the church's 550 congregants arrived on site around 3:30 a.m. as about 45 men claiming to be civil volunteers blocked them from the building and threw stones. "When I arrived, I just burst into tears," 25-year-old Natalya Cherevichinik told The Moscow Times as she surveyed the destruction. "I couldn't believe that something that had been built over several years could be destroyed in a few hours."
Russian Evangelicals Leery of Orthodox Church, Friday, December 30, 2011:
class="adjusted">MOSCOW, Russia -- For decades, the Russian Orthodox Church was persecuted under the Soviet Union's Communist Party.
Since the early 1990s, the church has grown in size and influence as its relationship with the Russian government has improved significantly.
However, that cozy relationship worries the country's evangelicals.
Threats Against Evangelicals
For eight years, Yuri Sipko ran one of the largest Baptist organizations in Russia. Now, 20 years after the fall of Communism, he worries about the growing threats against the country's evangelical movement.
"The collapse of Communism was supposed to usher in an era of greater religious freedom, but I'm concerned we are moving in the wrong direction," Sipko said.
What makes the Russian evangelicals very concerned is an emerging relationship between the Russian government and the Russian Orthodox Church.
"For example, the government recently introduced religious classes based on the principals of the Orthodox Church in public schools," Sipko said.
"Then late last year, the Russian president announced an initiative to appoint Orthodox chaplains to all army units," he said. "Our constitution clearly states no religion can be the state religion."
Russia Church-State Relations
Russia watchers credit two men, Prime Minister Vladimir Putin and President Dmitry Medvedev, for elevating the church's prominence. The state media has also played a key role, often showing the leaders attending church services.
Sergey Ryakhovski knows both men well. As head of Russia's Pentecostal Union, he meets regularly with top government and Orthodox Church leaders.
Ryakhovski worries that the Orthodox Church's influence is coming at the expense of religious freedom, especially for minority groups such as Christians, Jews, Muslims, and Buddhists.
"There are so many laws and by-laws that regulate religious life in Russia," Ryakhovski said. "For example, evangelical Christians just can't go out and buy a church building or buy a piece of land to build a church."
"Plus, criticizing or challenging the Orthodox Church is not a task for all," he added.
Orthodox Church Revival
The Russian Orthodox Church on the other hand has had it easy in recent times after decades of state persecution.
Church buildings that were destroyed during the Soviet era have been rebuilt with Russian taxpayer money. In the past 20 years, the government has spent hundreds of millions of dollars restoring some 23,000 churches.
Most Russians say they belong to the Orthodox Church. Yet CBN News found mixed reactions on the streets of Moscow to the growing bond between church and state
At Expense of All Others, Putin Picks a Church
By CLIFFORD J. LEVY Published: April 24, 2008
STARY OSKOL, Russia —
It was not long after a Methodist church put down roots here that the troubles began.
First came visits from agents of the F.S.B., a successor to the K.G.B., who evidently saw a threat in a few dozen searching souls who liked to huddle in cramped apartments to read the Bible and, perhaps, drink a little tea. Local officials then labeled the church a “sect.” Finally, last month, they shut it down.
There was a time after the fall of Communism when small Protestant congregations blossomed here in southwestern Russia, when a church was almost as easy to set up as a general store. Today, this industrial region has become emblematic of the suppression of religious freedom under President Vladimir V. Putin.
Just as the government has tightened control over political life, so, too, has it intruded in matters of faith. The Kremlin’s surrogates in many areas have turned the Russian Orthodox Church into a de facto official religion, warding off other Christian denominations that seem to offer the most significant competition for worshipers. They have all but banned proselytizing by Protestants and discouraged Protestant worship through a variety of harassing measures, according to dozens of interviews with government officials and religious leaders across Russia.
Russia's De-Facto State Religion : Persecution : http://www ... www.persecution.org/?p=9350&upm... International Christian Co... Putin frequently appears with the Orthodox head, Patriarch Aleksei II, ... Baptists, evangelicals, Pentecostals and many others who cut Christ's robes like bandits, ...
Government Returning Land to Religious Organizations to Favor Orthodox Tuesday, March 3rd, 2009: An ambitious draft law on the transfer of property of religious significance to religious organisations may reignite a process begun in 1993.
Pentecostal Seminary Targeted for Liquidation
Pentecostal Church Forced to Meet Outside in Moscow Winter
Russia: Governor Orders Church Land Grab
To understand Putin you must study the Roman Emperor and his Patriarch of Constantinople. Proskynesis to the State the people and to God. Absolute power by divine decree. The Kingdom is God’s kingdom on earth.
1204 is one of the most disgraceful years in history, along with 1453. Arguably, the first contributed mightily to the second.
When Jesus said I bring not peace but a sword, he foresaw Christians slaughtering each other over absurdities and worldly values.
This is a bunch of overheated nonsense. It is filled with stereotypes about the West and Westerners while essentially denouncing the West for having stereotypes about the East.
One person I don't recall hearing from about all this is Condoleezza Rice, an academic specialist in Russian History, possessing vast direct political and diplomatic experience with the country. Whatever you think of her politics and ties to the Bush clan, she'd be one "expert' whose opinion might mean something. And it's possible no one is asking for it because they're afraid to hear it.
“Their ultimate goal is total control of the populace (Soros, Schwab, Rothschild, etc.) “
I often wonder what drives these people.
Wrong friend. The history of the East is poorly understood in the West. It’s not taught. Moscow was the new Constantinople or new Rome. The Czars were Ceasars. Czar Vladimir Putin the first is an heir from Constantinople. The brief foray into humanistic communism was a brief outlier. Just a 50 year Nike riot.
This ancient conflict is still going on in modern times.
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I have the utmost respect for lovers of The Savior Jesus Christ everywhere, but, there are a lot of people who claim to be Christian that have different beliefs from other people who also claim to be Christians. Just a for instance, there are Christian denominations who Ordain homosexual priests and priestesses. Some people who claim to be Christian say, well, it’s about time. While others equally claiming to be Christian call the practice demonic.
I have my views and you have yours and I would that we all agreed to the same doctrines but even that would not necessarily make it right. Only The Lord Jesus Christ can make that judgment. The Roman Church claims to be the remnant of the the Apostles that The Lord Himself chose, but then again so do the Eastern Orthodox and the Russian Orthodox. Then the Protestant churches all say that the Roman church which they came from was dead and needed to be reborn into truth.
It will be interesting to see when The Lord comes who will be His. We are told that He will come to “His”. Will he come to the Mount of Olives? That isn’t Rome is it, it isn’t Constantinople and it certainly isn’t Moscow. Will He come to the Jews? The Jews aren’t even Christian. They are however followers of Jehovah who is Jesus Christ. They didn’t recognize Jesus in the flesh but when He comes in Glory to the Mount of Olives they will recognize Him and will follow. Does that mean that when He comes the Jews will come up and meet Him in the clouds?
There are I think a lot of things of Christianity we do not fully understand. I think sometimes we remember that The Lord and our Savior loves us but the other guy not so much. The Jews and all the descendants of Jacob or Israel are the chosen, the rest of us are just also rans in comparison.
We all have a tendency to put ourselves first, to make us better than all the others. So many people say they know what the Bible says about this or that but it is different than what others say about the same thing. I think we still have a lot to learn. I think a good seminary education is a good thing but probably somewhat over rated. I think The Lord wants us to love Him, what comes after that is not quite as important.
They are two different religions, not two versions of the same thing.
Those who worship Mary, Queen of heaven. The historical reformers understood many truths that we do not.
The answer is in the remainder of the sentence.
I don’t even believe its a “Catholic/Orthodox” split - NATO and Brussels really represent a Protestant/Orthodox split.
Modern Europe and NATO are directly evolved from its Protestant, Northern European outlook. Catholicism is comatose in Europe. Progressivism, post-modernism, the centralized nanny-state, environmentalism - like in the USA - are all evolved, however wrongly, from events launched by people Luther, Calvin and Cromwell.
thus the understanding between Western Europe and now Orthodox Russia is even more fractured.
My many European friends, business contacts and relatives view me - an active Catholic and libertarian who likes to play with guns - as some sort of cute, quaint caveman. They are far more evolved.
They will have even less understanding of the Russians. Up until Feb. 23 not one expected Russia to invade Ukraine, and they are still dumbfounded by it two months later.
RE: Why Europe cannot understand Russia
Understanding goes both ways, NOT just one way. What about Russia not Understanding Europe?
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