Posted on 01/04/2020 3:50:22 PM PST by rintintin
Otto von Bismarck famously declared the Balkans weren't worth the bones of a single Pomeranian grenadier. He knew that fractious, feuding part of Europe would soak up as much blood as the Germans cared to spill. Because Bismarck's successors forgot his wisdom, the Balkans ended up claiming the bones of millions, in what was naively called the Great War before it was eclipsed in bloodshed and horror twenty years later. Neither Germany nor her European adversaries have ever recovered.
The same could be said of the Middle East. The whole wretched place isn't worth the bones of a single Alabamian Marine. America has no vital interest there except oil. And, regarding the oil, whichever nation sits atop it has no choice but to sell it on the global market, since there is no other way for the backward economies of the region to generate sufficient revenue.
It is long past time for a definitive American withdrawal from that fractious, feuding part of the world. The attack on our embassy in Baghdad came about because we are contesting the Iranians for influence in Iraq. Invading and occupying Iraq has brought the U.S. nothing except flag-draped coffins, burgeoning VA wards, and fiscal ruin. Let someone else claim that so-called prize, and let us instead devote American lives and American treasure to promoting America’s interests.
Imagine how much better off we would be if the Americans killed and maimed in Iraq and Afghanistan were instead alive and vigorous, and if the hundreds of billions, even trillions, spent as a result of our Mideast misadventures had instead been devoted to productive economic activity, improving America's infrastructure, and solving American problems.
(Excerpt) Read more at chroniclesmagazine.org ...
Yeah but they have India next door, that area would become a very hot spot if India wasn’t there.
You seem to be very mixed-up and confused in this thread; and living in and dwelling upon the past.
Come up into the current world, and deal with things as they are today.
I don't think Chronicles is bullish on Israel.
Some of us have long memories, and have been here on FR a long time.
“Are you a complete isolationist,”
“Isolationist” is a politician’s handy term of abuse against somebody who doesn’t support a war that the politician favors. LBJ called Vietnam war opponents, “isolationists.”
If you, Jamestown1630, don’t favor sending US troops into, say, Cuba or Venezuala, does that make you an “isolationist”?
Some commentators who want to invade those countries would call you an isolationist for not agreeing with their plans.
“I think supporting a tiny nation that shares our ideals IS a military issue, when they’re within firing range of so many crazies who want to see them all dead.”
I remember there was a Virginia Democrat congressman who charged that we were fighting in Iraq on behalf of Israel. He rightly had to apologize. But Jamestown, you sound just like him.
Right. On the other hand, India’s nuclear arms pretty much forced the Pakistanis to pursue their own nuclear weapons program.
“Some conservatives are sounding as naive as Dems in their reasoning: if we leave, they’ll never bother us or our allies ever. Hmmm...yeah, ok. Right.”
Ronald Reagan pulled us out of Lebanon after our Marines were attacked. He did the right thing - even though a lot of hawks blasted him. Reagan had a successful presidency. George W Bush, who did the opposite of Reagan and got us involved in MidEast wars, is to this day considered a failed president who can’t even show his face at GOP national conventions, he’s so unpopular.
If Trump follows the George Bush example instead of Reagan’s, he’ll end up a failed president too. And I say that as a Trump supporter from the start - I was debating Cruziacs on Freerepublic for months as they continued to oppose Trump.
What exactly is your deal?
What is YOUR POSITION?
Do you support Trump or not?\
From some of your posts from yesterday (replies unanswered), I am wondering...
“Do you support Trump or not?\”
Look back on my posts from 2015 and 2016, you’ll see I was supporting Trump from the beginning, while so many Freepers were in Cruz’s corner, or even Rubio’s.
One reason I supported Trump was his promise to get us out of Mideast wars. He called Bush’s Iraq war one of the most disastrous foreign policy decisions in US history.
Well since you joined in 2017 according to your profile, I can’t look back.
So you are not supporting Trump NOW?
“So you are not supporting Trump NOW?”
If he gets us into a war with Iran, I won’t support him. I’m sure he doesn’t want such a war personally, but he has surrounded himself with advisors who DO seem to want such a war. Bolton certainly did. So I’m concerned.
“Well since you joined in 2017 according to your profile”
I guess I’ve been lurking longer, and signed up later than I remembered. Anyway, I supported Trump from the moment he came down the escalator and complained about illegal immigration.
You make some mention about Reagan (who I adored and got to see in person BTW) Reagan was a strong advocate of deterrence thru strength...Just like Trump is trying to do...
Yet your posts seem to be 1...All over the map but basically wanting to draft any and everyone...
And 2. Not supportive of Trump’s objectives...
So again, like before, I am asking you to clarify...again...What is your position?
These are some of your choice posts from yesterday...I asked you to clarify then but you did not...
~~That’s why we need to draft women and men, from ages 17 through 64, and send them to the Middle East. Now. The Iraq War showed us how to do it. Let’s do it again, but with a draft this time!
~~America First means forget about defending America’s borders, but spend limitless resources and lives defending borders in the Middle East. We’ll need to reinstitute the draft if we’re going to finally get the job done.
~~Older people should be drafted for the middle east war too. Top out at age 64 or 65. That will be sure to put America First, if we send our boomers to Middle East killing fields
If he gets us into a war with Iran, I won’t support him.
I sure hope there are not other Freepers with your position...
Hope you are prepared for a socialist in WH and a totalitarian government if you won’t support him...
He is the best we have...and I will crawl over broken glass to vote for him (even if I don’t necessarily agree on every one of his positions).
BTW, I supported him before he came down the escalator BTW...call it intuition—I knew he was running waay before
that.
Loved Reagan, but Trump won’t allow us to be bullied either. And that’s to our advantage. Appeasement doesn’t work. And no one has declared war at this point. Much can happen before that ever becomes necessary. As I said, we need to protect ourselves where we are. The convo about whether or not to stay there is for another time.
“Loved Reagan, but Trump won’t allow us to be bullied either.”
If Trump pulls a W Bush and gets us into a war with Iran, he will lose. Reagan kept us out of wars - and still defeated the Soviet Union. Remember when the Soviets shot down the airliner? Did Reagan go to war with them in order to show “we won’t be bullied”? Nope. And he still won the Cold War.
I meant Trump will lose the election (if he goes to war against Iran), not that he’d lose the war with Iran itself - although our track record in Middle East wars suggests he might lose that too.
“He is the best we have...and I will crawl over broken glass to vote for him (even if I don’t necessarily agree on every one of his positions).”
You and me both.
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