btw- anybody know what is going on over on the other side of the river up the hillside?
Posted on 02/12/2017 4:26:47 PM PST by janetjanet998
Edited on 02/12/2017 9:33:58 PM PST by Admin Moderator. [history]
The Oroville Dam is the highest in the nation.
I've used crawler "walk beside" Ditch Witch trenchers for burying heavy electrical power cable runs. Ran into mixed "pit run" rock as the trench was aside a gravel road. You had to be quick on "tuning" the boom to balance the irregular pulses of hitting this base layer. Worked fine if you learned how to balance the depth & cut rate speed. If you didn't the machine would turn into a monster jumping jack unit where you were dancing swiftly not to get stomped by the treads.
I guess I’m getting to cynical in my old age. Big cranes like that cost BIG bucks. Every time I bid a job with big equipment, I made sure my guys had their stuff ready to go, so as to minimize time on the job. And I’d try to find a cheaper way to place whatever it was we had to pick. ‘Cause if the job didn’t make money, the bosses came right to me.
I hope this isn’t a deal where the contractor is padding his billing.
Good point on the crane. If it isn’t there for some big lifts, then maybe it doesn’t need to be there. I’m guessing maybe to place the rebar pieces or something like that? Don’t know. I do know that that Ditch Witch has a trailer hitch and could have been towed into place.
A unique formulation is that they hire local union workers or workers under union contracts. These workers interface with the Kiewit foremen & bosses. So this interface layer travels from project to project as they leverage local worker resources for the project needs.
Of course, there is always the subcontracted specialty resources that are engaged. I don't know if this is specified to be union only.
The crane is there in that size as much for reach and stability as for capacity. If this was a firm prepared flat site, a crawler crane with less boom could get closer to the lift — both in pick and in placement. Out there with the variable slope it will be of use in swinging gang forms for the future sidewalls, swinging those pre-tied rebar mats and possibly swinging buckets of mix to spots that they don’t want to set a pump for later.
Kiewitt has lots of this big equipment and it is always best on this size job to bring the big stuff that you might need rather than have had the mobilization cost for a medium and a big on each side.
Anytime you have an area where you have to swing in equipment into a lowered area, you don’t want to mess with near-capacity picks.
The way that Kiewitt and other bigs look at this is that the equipment is all already owned and paid for from past work. It justifies itself being available and if you run over in labor somewhere, you are making money on how you charge your own in-house equipment into your job cost. I would estimate that Kiewitt has about 0.8 to 1.3 billion in such equipment — although on the books it might be less due to depreciation.
Kiewitt is one of the most soundly run outfits in the business. They always make money. The Surety Bonding industry holds them up to everyone in the business at that level as one of the companies to pattern operations after as they are rock solid.
Guys like Perini, Clark, Dick and others don’t begin to have the success pattern that Kiewitt does. (Disclaimer — I never worked for them. I have worked for others of that size)
btw- anybody know what is going on over on the other side of the river up the hillside?
There are interesting features in the slabs that are being drilled. The wet area under the red "tank" trailer may be from drilling fluids saturation. The horizontal "splitting" of the slab is also of note. There is also an area of large rebar that is unusual in the ground. This material may be from some of the re-inforcements done on the original seams found in the upper spillway. I'll provide a zoom of this pic later.
Original April New Spillway plan - excavation and removal of the upper spillway is near the 800 foot mark so far.
File for reference
http://www.water.ca.gov/news/newsreleases/2017/041717_oro_contract_award.pdf
April 17, 2017
DWR Awards Contract for Oroville Spillways Repair
SACRAMENTO
–
Details of the three bids will not be made public, as they contain design information that is considered Critical Energy/Electric Infrastructure Information by federal regulators and could cause a security risk if released.
http://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/article/Oroville-Dam-repair-is-huge-but-so-is-11227869.php
Oroville Dam repair is huge, but so is residents’ mistrust
By Kurtis Alexander
June 18, 2017 Updated: June 18, 2017 9:50pm
snip
The 3,000-foot-long main chute — where the crisis began Feb. 7 when a crater opened up amid heavy releases from the lake — didn’t have water stops to seal joints and prevent leaks from weakening it. Also, there is too little steel reinforcement in the structure, and the pipes that drain water beneath it are made of clay instead of superior PVC.
“You can’t even find clay pipes anymore,” Gutierrez said, as he looked down from the top of the 770-foot earthen dam that was completed in 1968.
snip
Critics of the Department of Water Resources say deficiencies in the spillways should have been addressed — if not when the dam was built in the 1960s, then in ensuing decades as dam safety science evolved.
While state officials insist they’ve done all they can to keep the dam safe, the team investigating the spillways said it’s looking into the possibility of poor management.
“I’m not sure that we’re going to be pointing blame on any particular person or organization,” said John France, an independent engineering consultant who is leading the investigation. “We’re more trying to focus on what lessons we can learn on how the process may have let us down in terms of not having the proper training or not responding to things the way they should have.”
“State consultant and former Department of Water Resources manager Dave Gutierrez, who is advising on the project, said many of the shortcomings are the result of the dam’s age.”
““You can’t even find clay pipes anymore,” Gutierrez said, as he looked down from the top of the 770-foot earthen dam that was completed in 1968.”
Why would Gutierrez tell such an obvious untruth?
http://www.ncpi.org/
National Clay Pipe Institute
http://www.loganclaypipe.com/pipeprods_b.html
Logan Clay Pipe Products
http://missionclay.com/
Mission Clay Products
http://www.canclay.com/
Can Clay Corp.
http://www.loganclaypipe.com/
Logan Clay Pipe
I just emailed the reporter and pointed out Gutierrez’ lie. We’ll see if he responds.
Is PVC actually more durable, over time, than clay pipe, provided it’s properly installed? There are a LOT of houses that have clay pipe for drain tile, and they’ve been around for 40, 50, 60+ years.
VCP’s claim to fame is it’s resistance to corrosion from acid often found in sewers. It will last a long time. The downsides are its fragility and numerous joints that can allow root intrusion.
PVC is lighter, and more nearly leakproof. I asked our city’s water/sewer manager a couple of months ago about it, and he said NY City was just about the last major municipality to specify VCP in construction.
Hereabouts, when they retrofit an old sewer, they clean out roots, and then line it with an epoxy inner coating.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cured-in-place_pipe
Walter, thanks for sharing. I’ve had several point this out.
Kurtis Alexander
Staff Writer
(415) 777-6063
kalexander@sfchronicle.com
From: Walter Abbott
Date: Sunday, June 25, 2017 at 9:41 AM
To: “Alexander, Kurtis”
Subject: Oroville Spillway Repair
Kurtis,
Interesting interview you had with former Department of Water Resources manager Dave Gutierrez. Taxpayer mistrust of government factotums as your title implies is very well founded.
You quoted him thus: “You can’t even find clay pipes anymore,” Gutierrez said, as he looked down from the top of the 770-foot earthen dam that was completed in 1968.
Why would he tell such an obvious mistruth? It took me but a few seconds to Google up several current domestic manufacturers of Vitrified Clay Pipe (VCP), of the exact same type that was used for drainage beneath the original Oroville Dam spillway.
It he told that lie, what else did he lie about?
http://www.ncpi.org/
National Clay Pipe Institute
http://www.loganclaypipe.com/pipeprods_b.html
Logan Clay Pipe Products
http://missionclay.com/
Mission Clay Products
http://www.canclay.com/
Can Clay Corp.
http://www.loganclaypipe.com/
Logan Clay Pipe
Walter Abbott
Ruston, LA
http://www.eastbaytimes.com/2017/06/24/editorial-oroville-public-safety-plans-should-be-well-public/
Editorial: Oroville public safety plans should be, well, public
By East Bay Times editorial |
June 24, 2017 at 8:30 am
The state agency in charge of Lake Oroville prefers secrecy and Gov. Jerry Brown has become its enabler. Now Democrats in the Legislature are on board, voting to keep the public in the dark.
We had hoped elected officials would have kept endangered citizens in mind. Sadly, we were wrong.
The bill is an insult. Emergency safety plans are made for the public, but the public can’t see them? The state says the plans are being kept secret because terrorists could use the plans to do harm. It defies common sense.
snip
“So we’re going to improve them but we’re just not going to let you see them. And again they’re going to say, ‘Maybe somebody might be able to use this to commit a terrorist act,’ ” Gallagher said. “I can tell you my constituents are more scared of the people operating and maintaining that dam than they are of terrorists right now.”
I think criminal negligence and/or possible criminal recklessness or intentional disregard may also be in play here, but since the State of CA would be the defendant, it’s hard to image CA going after CA in a criminal case.
So as you say, it would probably be a civil case if anything.
CA does have constitutional state sovereignty and if they screw themselves up, they, not the feds, are responsible to clean up their mess. It’s up to the people of CA to elect the right representatives or pay the price if they don’t.
State sovereignty and a republican form of state government isn’t perfect, but it’s way ahead of unconstitutional federal bailouts and resulting federal tyranny.
Mr Gutierrez, is representing technical subject matter regarding DWR and the dam to the press. If he is lacking in engineering knowledge, he shouldn't be speaking as if these issues are fact. If he does have the engineering knowledge, it could be claimed that there is an intentional mis-representation of fact. Either case, for a high level spokesperson to be representing critical engineering subject matter for DWR, all this does is generate further public mistrust (via lack of honesty in information).
This is not the first time "issues" with "information" have occurred regarding Mr. Gutierrez. (i.e. DSOD inspection reports clearly contradict the testimony given below).
At a Legislative Hearing in Sacramento Mr Gutierrez was seemingly dodging questions when it came to specifics when grilled by Representative Gallagher:
-- clip from article from May 11, 2017 testimony: (emphasis mine)
Holding up a sheaf of papers with many stick on dividers, Gallagher states that “tree roots” were “plugging up the drainage pipes,” and that each of the dividers marked a place in the reports where the problem of trees growing too close to the Main Spillway had been listed. When asked if there was a process for cutting the trees, and specifically trees that were growing nearest to the drains, in areas where the inspectors had reported blockage, Gutierez answered that he was unfamiliar with the reports. He stated that inspectors would require that trees be removed, especially if they were growing near the drains. Gutierez denied that any large trees were growing near the drains, and he asked that the Committee wait for the forensic report. Gallagher asks, “Did we ever go check the drains?” Gutierez answers, “Not that I know of,” and he repeated his denial that any trees were growing near the drains. Gallagher tells him there are documents and photos showing the trees, and that “trees take a long time to grow,” implying that neglect of standard inspection and maintenance have been ongoing for years.
Gallagher refers to “patchwork that was done in 2009” along the “herringbone” lines of the Main Spillway floor, and he asks if anyone noticed that “there were issues with the drains,” that they were cracked, or whether voids were observed. DWR refused to answer, saying they would not answer until the forensic report was released. Gallagher directs DWR to answer “to this Committee,” but Gutierez again refuses, insisting they wait for the forensic report.
---- end clip
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