Posted on 04/03/2016 1:46:59 PM PDT by Olog-hai
Gardaí arrested one person after scuffles broke out between protesters and the Public Order Unit outside Dublin’s Glasnevin Cemetery.
Efforts were made to burn a Union Jack and bangers were exploded, one of which was thrown at lines of gardaí and led to the brief altercation. […]
A group of about 100 people, mostly men, gathered to protest at the unveiling ceremony in the cemetery of a “Remembrance Wall” listing the names of all those who died in the 1916 Easter Rising, including British soldiers.
Many of those present carried banners and placards bearing the logo of the 32 County Sovereignty Movement.
One of them read: “British soldiers with our patriot dead? Not in my name.” …
(Excerpt) Read more at irishtimes.com ...
They may as well commemorate the Battle of Vinegar Hill. They’re just as much a vassal of “Europe” no matter what they commemorate.
“They’re just as much a vassal of “Europe” no matter what they commemorate.”
You think so? Last time I checked, when the British were in charge in Ireland the Black and Tans were running around shooting the Irish. How many Irish people are getting shot in Ireland by the EU? Oh, that’s right, none. Maybe you should rethink your conclusion.
The Irish are freer now than under the English. That’s just a fact. They can break away from the EU any time they like - without having to fire a single shot or suffer a single death too. Again, maybe you should rethink your conclusion. I don’t think you put much effort into it first time around.
Many Irish, and Americans, viewed the 1916 Easter rebellion as justified since the British were foreign invaders.
The killing of British troops and retaliatory executions of Irish rebels and civilians caused much hard feeling which lasts to this day.
I would call that vassalage.
- Any Member State may decide to withdraw from the Union in accordance with its own constitutional requirements.
- 2. A Member State which decides to withdraw shall notify the European Council of its intention.
In the light of the guidelines provided by the European Council, the Union shall negotiate and conclude an agreement with that State, setting out the arrangements for its withdrawal, taking account of the framework for its future relationship with the Union. That agreement shall be negotiated in accordance with Article 218(3) of the Treaty on the Functioning of the European Union. It shall be concluded on behalf of the Union by the Council, acting by a qualified majority, after obtaining the consent of the European Parliament.
- The Treaties shall cease to apply to the State in question from the date of entry into force of the withdrawal agreement or, failing that, two years after the notification referred to in paragraph 2, unless the European Council, in agreement with the Member State concerned, unanimously decides to extend this period.
- For the purposes of paragraphs 2 and 3, the member of the European Council or of the Council representing the withdrawing Member State shall not participate in the discussions of the European Council or Council or in decisions concerning it. …
They were “foreign invaders” with the blessing of Popes Adrian IV and Alexander III, who established English King Henry II as Lord of Ireland. And with the assistance of Leinster’s king Dermot Mac Murrough.
I would not say that EU elites, who accepted both the UK and Ireland into the EU in the same year, even regard the two as separate.
As you probably well know in the song Richard Harris sings "MacArthur'S" Park instead of MacArthur Park....which is the name of the park and the way Jim Webb wrote the lyrics.
Webb was at the recording of the song with Harris, and every time Harris sang it with the possessive, Webb stopped him and tried to correct him. To no avail. Harris simply couldn't sing the lyric without singing MacArthur'S Park.
So eventually an exasperated Webb gave up, and that's the way the record came out.
FWIW some years ago on a tour of Ireland the wife and I visited Kilmainham jail were most of the rebels were imprisoned and shot.
I would like to mention from Canada I have twice visited Kings Mountain battlefield in South Carolina. A force of primarily militia from Canada and indeed some loyalists from New York State engaged "The Mountain Men" from Kentucky, North and South Carolina.
There were about a 1000 a side in 1781. The Americans won the day. Their losses were 28 killed and 64 wounded. All these names carefully inscribed on one of the monuments there. A very special monument, it is for Colonel Patrick Ferguson. He was the British commander, shot six times when rallying his men. Inscribed "A soldier of military distinction and honor" . It is his burial place. A tribute from the United States of America.
Different times, respect amongst foes.
I am a direct descendant on mother's side of one of the Overmountain Men who marched from Sycamore Shoals (present Carter County, Tennessee) to deal with the Redcoats.
They captured a lot of prisoners and on the way back home, there were some who took it upon themselves to begin hanging some of their prisoners. It happened that one of the prisoners was a loyalist from back home, and Capt. John seems to have thought it wrong to hang him. So he pled his case and the man was spared.
This rough justice seems to have been instigated w/o knowledge of the commanding officers, who did put an end to it; but only after around nine had been hanged.
The history of how the Park came to be is interesting. It took a long time.
“I would not say that EU elites, who accepted both the UK and Ireland into the EU in the same year, even regard the two as separate.”
Every time they convert Euros into British pounds they have to regard them as separate.
Yes, you certainly have the facts on the prisoners taken by the victorious American forces. Some were even local farmers who were 40 in number. Hanging was demanded and indeed nine were hanged. I understand women folk pleaded with the would be executioners and a commander intervened.
A journal exists on line by one of the British prisoners who was marched to captivity. To my surprise he was from Up State New York. He and his comrades were treated variously by persons along the route. Some kindly, some not. Ironically, one of the wounded Americans William Giles who is honored on the monument, bears my own last name. (chuckle).
If that is the battle I’m thinking of, the British commander said they’d never move him from his position alive - and he was right. I watched a documentary, with input from a descendant of the colonist who shot him dead.
They’re as unconcerned with that as with Denmark’s Krone or Sweden’s Krona, probably. Unless it comes to taking that “ever-closer union” slogan more seriously, of course.
Unlike Scotland or Wales (or the occupied north of Ireland), England has no sway in the Republic of Ireland. Those peoples have to look at that English pig on their currency; Irish people don’t.
Ireland’s revenge came 25 years later when England asked them to black out to prevent German pilots from using their lights for navigation; naturally Ireland refused. A little “thank you” to the Germans who supplied rifles for 1916...
Speaking of swine.
Ireland has to look to Frankfurt and the European Central Bank.
Also, the pound sterling of Scotland and Northern Ireland is not issued by the Bank of England. That money cannot be used in England nor vice versa.
As for “occupied”, all of the above are occupied by the EU.
“Well, thanks for showing that you have no understanding of the European Union.”
I clearly understand it much better than you do. The EU is killing exactly NO ONE IN IRELAND but the British killed many. Britain invaded Ireland. The EU didn’t. Britain banned the Irish language in official proceedings. The EU didn’t. The British seized land from the Irish. The EU didn’t. The Irish can leave the EU any time the want and they can do it without firing a shot. It took centuries of armed resistance for the British to get the message.
“As for “Black and Tans”, if that’s a dig at Churchill,”
It’s a factual statement about the BRITISH. Do you know ANYTHING about Irish history???
“then I want to know why a Faustian pact was made with communists at the IRB when there is not supposed to be fellowship between light and darkness.”
We made “a Faustian pact was made with communists” in order to defeat Fascists in World War II. SO DID CHURCHILL, or didn’t you know that??? The simple fact is a nation fearing it’s destruction will align itself with the enemy of its enemy even if that second party is just as bad as the first. Or is that news to you?
“Ireland can no more “break away from the EU any time they like” than any Soviet Republic could break away from the USSR in spite of the “freely secede” clause in the Soviet Constitution.”
Completely false. The EU will not be sending tanks to London if Brexit happens. What EU army will occupy Dublin if Ireland leaves the EU? How will that army get there? What ships will it use? What aircraft? Who will pay for it?
“I would call that vassalage.”
If it’s vassalage it’s FREELY chosen and can be abandoned at any time. Not a single shot would need to be fired. It took 700 years to get rid of the British and IT LITERALLY STARTED WITH VASSALAGE and not your phony version of it. Britain had an occupying army in Ireland and killed huge numbers of people over the centuries. The EU will do nothing of the sort in Ireland and couldn’t do it even if it wanted to. The EU doesn’t have the energy, the manpower, the equipment, the money, or the balls. The British did.
There is no such thing as freely-chosen vassalage; one gets duped into it. Never mind “freer” (which they’re not) when the goal was to be free in the full sense of the word, which Ireland was between 1948 and 1972 and then threw it away, just like with the Treaty of Lisbon re-vote (they had to vote again because the EU elites determined they had voted the wrong way).
Never mind your equivocation. The EU has caused many in Ireland to be homeless of late, never mind jobless; as soon as the EU gets the military it has been craving for decades, the deaths will follow. And any deaths that England committed in Ireland were not unprovoked; go study the history.
And no, the USA came to Russia’s aid in WWII, because a Russia controlled by the Nazis thanks to Stalin’s own Faustian pact with Adolf (resulting in being caught off guard) would have been an incredible geopolitical disaster. Not the same as the Fenians collaborating with communists at all.
Got any more excusings of statism?
“There is no such thing as freely-chosen vassalage”
You’re wrong again. The very medieval idea of vassalage is built on choice. That’s why the vassalage ceremony is an exchange between Lord and Vassal. I realized you were using the word in your own way, but if you’re going to make an erroneous claim, I’m going to point it out. You might want to read Susan Reynolds’ 1994 book called Fiefs and Vassals (Oxford University Press) because you apparently know even less about that topic than you do about modern Ireland or the EU.
“And no, the USA came to Russia’s aid in WWII, because a Russia controlled by the Nazis thanks to Stalin’s own Faustian pact with Adolf (resulting in being caught off guard) would have been an incredible geopolitical disaster.”
How does what you just said change anything that I said??? You said “then I want to know why a Faustian pact was made with communists at the IRB when there is not supposed to be fellowship between light and darkness.” We sided with godless, murderous communists to defeat murderous fascists in WWII. It was a necessary thing to do. We sided with the empire building colonizing French to defeat the empire building colonizing British in the Revolutionary War. And we would do all of that all over again - and much more - if we really felt the need.
“Not the same as the Fenians collaborating with communists at all.”
Actually, it’s EXACTLY the same. The Irish were willing to side with anyone who could help them. So were we. The United States, in her short history, has sided with the French, the English, the Germans, the Austro-Hungarians, the Russians, Spanish Francists (many would call them fascists), communists, dictators of every stripe, monarchs, business interests, etc. whenever we believed it suited our needs.
“Got any more excusings of statism?”
I never made any. Care to lie about anything else? Everything I have said is absolutely and irrefutably correct. We made a pact with communists (just like some Irish revolutionaries did) - and we chose to ignore what those commies were doing to their own people because we were interested in winning a war against the Nazis. Pull your head out of your ass if you can find it.
And here you really show your ignorance:
“And any deaths that England committed in Ireland were not unprovoked;”
Not according to the King of England, George V, who angrily asked the Prime Minister if he was going to shoot all of the people of Ireland. I guess you would also say that “And any deaths that England committed in [America] were not unprovoked”? And there is no justification for this: http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/culprit-who-led-burning-of-cork-finally-identified-139188.html
“go study the history.”
Did. Got a PhD in it. That’s why you’re the only one between the two of us making any mistakes here. You’ll continue to do so too.
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