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New York Times Op-Ed: Stop Revering the Magna Carta
New York Times ^ | 06/15/2015 | By TOM GINSBURG

Posted on 06/15/2015 11:46:38 AM PDT by SeekAndFind

MAGNA CARTA, on which King John placed his seal 800 years ago today, is synonymous in the English-speaking world with fundamental rights and the rule of law. It’s been celebrated, and appropriated, by everyone from Tea Party members to Jay Z, who called his latest album “Magna Carta Holy Grail.”

But its fame rests on several myths. First, it wasn’t effective. In fact, it was a failure. John was a weak king who had squandered the royal fortune on a fruitless war with France. Continually raising taxes to pay for his European adventures, he provoked a revolt by his barons, who forced him to sign the charter. But John repudiated the document immediately, and the barons sought to replace him. John avoided that fate by dying.

The next year, his young son reissued Magna Carta, without some of the clauses. It was reissued several times more in the 13th century — the 1297 version is the one on display in the National Archives and embodied in English law. But the original version hardly constrained the monarch.

A second myth is that it was the first document of its type. Writing in 1908, Woodrow Wilson called it the beginning of constitutional government. But in fact, it was only one of many documents from the period, in England and elsewhere, codifying limitations on government power.

A third myth is that the document was a ringing endorsement of liberty. Even a cursory reading reveals a number of oddities. One clause prevents Jews from charging interest on a debt held by an underage heir. Another limits women’s ability to bear witness to certain homicides. A third requires the removal of fish traps from the Thames.

Why, then, is Magna Carta so revered?

(Excerpt) Read more at nytimes.com ...


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: constitution; godsgravesglyphs; kingjohn; magnacarta; newyork; newyorkcity; newyorkslimes; newyorktimes; steelydan; unitedkingdom
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To: SeekAndFind

Tom Ginsburg focuses on comparative and international law from an interdisciplinary perspective. He holds BA, JD, and PhD degrees from the University of California at Berkeley. His books include Judicial Review in New Democracies (2003), which won the C. Herman Pritchett Award from the American Political Science Association; The Endurance of National Constitutions (2009), which also won a best book prize from APSA; Constitutions in Authoritarian Regimes (2014); and Law and Development in Middle-Income Countries (2014). He currently co-directs the Comparative Constitutions Project, an effort funded by the National Science Foundation to gather and analyze the constitutions of all independent nation-states since 1789. Before entering law teaching, he served as a legal adviser at the Iran-U.S. Claims Tribunal, The Hague, Netherlands, and he continues to work with numerous international development agencies and foreign governments on legal and constitutional reform. He is a member of the American Academy of Arts and Sciences.


21 posted on 06/15/2015 12:11:49 PM PDT by spodefly (This is my tag line. There are many like it, but this one is mine.)
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To: SeekAndFind

Jeese.... it’s only time before someone decides to start blowing up NYT facilities..

Other NYC media outlets are not far behind....
The HATE for the United States there must be intense..


22 posted on 06/15/2015 12:12:16 PM PDT by hosepipe (This propaganda has been edited (specifically) to include some fully orbed hyperbole..)
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To: OttawaFreeper
Gee, the fact that the New York Times itself is controlled by a feudal patriarchy wouldn't color their view of history, would it?
23 posted on 06/15/2015 12:17:16 PM PDT by Mr. Lucky
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To: SeekAndFind

Well, that does it then! If Tom Ginsburg and the New York Times dismiss the Magna Carta as a discredited document based on flawed principles, hey, who’s to say otherwise?

As Gerald Celente has often said (referred to the NYT): ‘The toilet paper of record’.


24 posted on 06/15/2015 12:21:00 PM PDT by Paulie (America without Christianity is like a Chemistry book without the periodic table.)
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To: SeekAndFind

Why is the Magna Carta so revered? Because during the 18th Century, many referred to the Magna Carta as the prototype of the changes needed to finally get away from the feudal system that in the end so hamstrung Europe.


25 posted on 06/15/2015 12:24:33 PM PDT by RayChuang88 (FairTax: America's economic cure)
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To: SeekAndFind

Magna Carta sent a shockwave through British history. While King John failed to live up to its requirements British subjects never forgot it and used it repeatedly later in British history for various purposes. Further, our Constitution might be very different without the influence of MC.

This author is a typical Liberal... completely unaware of the fact that he lives in a country heavily influenced by Magana Carta while he urinates on it yelling it isn’t very important at all. Total imbecile.


26 posted on 06/15/2015 12:27:47 PM PDT by navyguy (The National Reset Button is pushed with the trigger finger.)
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To: circlecity
"John was a weak king..”

"King John was not a good man —
He had his little ways."
27 posted on 06/15/2015 12:32:04 PM PDT by Hiddigeigei ("Talk sense to a fool and he calls you foolish," said Dionysus - Euripides)
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To: SeekAndFind

While the NYT worships at the alter of Das Capital....


28 posted on 06/15/2015 12:37:10 PM PDT by G Larry (Obama Hates America, Israel, Capitalism, Freedom, and Christianity.)
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To: BenLurkin

Don’t sweat it. Until Christ comes back, it will be ever thus.

Stares are going to start peeling away. The South will go first. They’ve most certainly had it. California and NE will scream and cry.

The flyover states will say, “You know, its too bad you moved all the federal military stuff out of your states and into ours. Cry all you want, but there won’t be much you can do about it.”


29 posted on 06/15/2015 12:38:39 PM PDT by RinaseaofDs
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To: SeekAndFind

If the Magna Carta is/was a failure, why is it after 800 years we still celebrate it? Please name something else from 1215 we should better celebrate or from any year a century each way? Please JD Berkeley Law Degree, give us something better!


30 posted on 06/15/2015 12:39:07 PM PDT by SES1066 (Quality, Speed or Economical - Any 2 of 3 except in government - 1 at best but never #3!)
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To: KC_Conspirator

If you can read it. Have you actually seen this thing? You need a microscope to read it. I have no idea how anyone wrote so small.


31 posted on 06/15/2015 1:03:11 PM PDT by LS ('Castles made of sand, fall in the sea . . . eventually.' Hendrix)
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This is an old topic. Just adding to the catalog.


32 posted on 06/15/2015 1:04:00 PM PDT by SunkenCiv (What do we want? REGIME CHANGE! When do we want it? NOW)
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To: SeekAndFind
Yes it's astonishing how stupid these 13th Century nobles were, they couldn't enact a fully fledged 21st Century Constitutional document that would satisfy the rigorous scrutiny of a 21st Century law professor.

The idea that Constitutional Government took centuries to develop and that Magna Carta was a great step forward in that developement appears to escape this doyen of constitutional law.

33 posted on 06/15/2015 1:10:51 PM PDT by Timocrat (Ingnorantia non excusat)
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To: SeekAndFind
But the original version hardly constrained the monarch.

Much like our own constitution and monarch.

34 posted on 06/15/2015 1:33:02 PM PDT by Know et al (Keep on Freepin'!!!)
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To: SeekAndFind
Oddly an accompanying, but similarly flavored, article in the new york times has this quote:
The renowned English judge Lord Denning called Magna Carta “the greatest constitutional document of all times — the foundation of the freedom of the individual against the arbitrary authority of the despot.”

Hmmm, who you gonna believe, old Tom Denning OM, PC, DL, QC or this univ of chicago hack?

35 posted on 06/15/2015 1:34:49 PM PDT by Riflema
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To: SeekAndFind
Born, Raised, Berkley CA..

Graduated University of California at Berkeley.

Nuff Said.

36 posted on 06/15/2015 1:45:24 PM PDT by TexasCajun (Hillary: Ethically Sleazy & Politically Stupid)
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To: Lazamataz

Why is the NYT still in existence?

Because good men did nothing.
............................................

Great answer . . . and they will continue to do nothing but watch their favorite sports and reality shows.


37 posted on 06/15/2015 1:49:16 PM PDT by Mollypitcher1 (I have not yet begun to fight....John Paul Jones)
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To: circlecity

or even during the Bush dynasty


38 posted on 06/15/2015 2:01:46 PM PDT by silverleaf (Age takes a toll: Please have exact change)
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To: SeekAndFind
An idiot with no sense of History.

For example, we still talk about The Code of Hammurabi which is regarded as significant. Do we still live under rules anything like The Code of Hammurabi ? No, those rules are lunacy by today's standards. It is regarded as significant because it was the first (known) time that it was thought that Laws should be WRITTEN DOWN, so EVERYONE subject to them would KNOW WHAT THEY WERE. This was a HUGE leap.
39 posted on 06/15/2015 2:04:44 PM PDT by Rebel_Ace (HITLER! There, Zero to Godwin in 5.2 seconds.)
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To: SeekAndFind

Our global governance bosses demand we write this article. We now demand you buy our content. /s


40 posted on 06/15/2015 2:08:28 PM PDT by Secret Agent Man (Gone Galt; Not averse to Going Bronson.)
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