Posted on 08/20/2014 1:15:30 PM PDT by wagglebee
In a bizarre rant on Twitter earlier today, atheist Richard Dawkins wrote that choosing not to abort a child with Down Syndrome would be "immoral."
The conversation started when Dawkins tweeted that "Ireland is a civilised country except in this 1 area." The area was abortion, which until last year was illegal in all cases.
A Twitter user then asked Dawkins if "994 human beings with Down's Syndrome [having been] deliberately killed before birth in England and Wales in 2012" was "civilised."
Dawkins replied "yes, it is very civilised. These are fetuses, diagnosed before they have human feelings."
Apparently I'm a horrid monster for recommending WHAT ACTUALLY HAPPENS to the great majority of Down Syndrome fetuses. They are aborted. — Richard Dawkins (@RichardDawkins) August 20, 2014
.@AidanMcCourt Yes, it is very civilised. These are fetuses, diagnosed before they have human feelings. — Richard Dawkins (@RichardDawkins) August 20, 2014
Later, Dawkins said that "the question is not ‘is it 'human'?’ but ‘can it SUFFER?’"
In perhaps the most shocking moment, one Twitter user wrote that he or she "honestly [doesn't] know what I would do if I were pregnant with a kid with Down Syndrome. Real ethical dilemma."
Dawkins advised the writer to "abort it and try again. It would be immoral to bring it into the world if you have the choice."
According to Dawkins, the issue of who should be born comes down to a calculation based upon possible suffering. "Yes. Suffering should be avoided. [The abortion] cause[s] no suffering. Reduce suffering wherever you can."
Later, however, he said that people on the autism spectrum "have a great deal to contribute, Maybe even an enhanced ability in some respects. [Down Syndrome] not enhanced."
When Dawkins received some blowback from Twitter followers, he replied: "Apparently I'm a horrid monster for recommending WHAT ACTUALLY HAPPENS to the great majority of Down Syndrome fetuses. They are aborted."
It is estimated that in many Western countries the abortion rate of children diagnosed in utero with Down syndrome is 90%, or even higher. The development of new and more accurate tests for the condition has raised concerns among Down syndrome advocates that that number could rise even higher.
Although it is widely believed that people with Down syndrome are doomed to a life of suffering, in one large survey 99% of respondents with Down syndrome said they were "happy." At the same time, 99% percent of parents said they loved their child with Down syndrome, and 97 percent said they were proud of them.
Only 4 percent of parents who responded said they regretted having their child.
A number of Dawkins' statements in the Twitter thread about fetal development are at odds with scientific realities. For example, it is well-established that 20 weeks into a pregnancy, unborn children can feel pain. Likewise, unborn children have emotional reactions to external stimuli -- such as a mother's stress levels -- months before being born.
Richard Dawkins.
RE: Richard Dawkins: choosing NOT to abort baby with Down syndrome is ‘immoral’
For a man who believes that we are nothing but the result of the random collision of molecules, I find this talk about morality irrational.
Why is for instance, the random collision of atoms called the Nazis destroying the random collision of atoms called the Jews immoral? It’s just nature taking its course...
And that’s why you don’t put atheists in charge of morality.
When an adult falls and skins their knee, it's a momentary inconvenience, when a toddler does it they suffer.
A teenager gets their heart broken, their parents try to comfort them, but the teenager is suffering.
A loved one dies, we suffer.
Each of us has many events in our lives where we were suffering, in nearly all cases we can look back on the event and see that it was nothing, but in the moment we experienced genuine suffering.
If you were to be around any liberals, especially liberal women, in 2008, and ask them about Sarah Palin,
you’d eventually get to one of their primary hatreds of her - “that baby”.
Because, they know, if it were them, they’d have had him murdered.
That is the view of many doctors.
This scumbag calling my cousin and her husband Joe, a wonderful father and Nam vet, immoral is sickening. I’d spit in his eye if I ever came across him.
So, in his view, a country is civilized if it approves of murdering innocents?
The fact that he sees nothing wrong with that proves how soul-sick and blackly evil he is.
Not aborting a baby is immoral.
Satan couldn’t have said it any better.
I have been around adults with Down Syndrome. They are happy. The people I was exposed to had make work jobs that gave them a sense of accomplishment and satisfaction. They had pride in that work. I had pride in them.
They felt friendship being around others like them. They went to movies together, out bowling, out eating. In simple terms, they lived happy fulfilled lives.
These people recognize their limitations. They’re okay with them, accepting is a better word for it.
Why would I deny them access to happiness?
Dawkins is revealing once again that he is ignorant on an issue. This time it involves the life of some of the most delightful people you’ll ever meet.
LOL, so cute
I guess my autism would be a death sentence.
If there is no God, you and I have no eternal souls. We are then nothing more than pieces of meat, to be disposed of as the state sees fit. It’s one reason most statists are atheists, and atheists are statists. They don’t want God getting in their way.
Dawkins clearly sees us as pieces of meat.
:)
I go to noon Mass every Sunday. About 5 or 10 minutes after Mass begins these two old guys, 80 year-old twins actually, saunter up the side aisle and sit about ten rows back form the front. One is very normal and his brother is a bit senile and when he enters the pew just before he sits down he twirls one time.
I wonder if Dawkins would have a problem with an old senile guy twirling in public?
Not all Down Syndrome patients are retarded. I went to college with a victim of Down Syndrome who was certainly not retarded.
If people like this get their way, the fact that a person may someday need eyeglasses and lose their hair could be a death sentence.
Well if “human feelings” is the qualifier for being allowed to live somebody pass Dawkins the hemlock cocktail forthwith.
Me: choosing NOT to abort idiots like Richard Dawkins is criminal.
BTW, I’m pro-choice: Abort Democrats.
Dawkins is obviously not a scientist of any kind. Assumptions don't constitute facts or evidence.
Dawkins ... replied: "Apparently I'm a horrid monster for recommending WHAT ACTUALLY HAPPENS to the great majority of Down Syndrome fetuses. They are aborted."
Not all sociopaths are considered monsters but, yes, when your lack of conscience extends to a callous disregard of life that qualifies, Richard.
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