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Falling Stars, Damnable Heresy, and the Spirit of Evolution
Renew America ^ | Sept. 19, 2013 | Linda Kimball

Posted on 09/20/2013 4:29:03 AM PDT by spirited irish

“Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son” (1 John 2:22).

“And the fifth angel sounded the trumpet, and I saw a star fall from heaven upon the earth, and there was given to him the key of the bottomless pit." (Rev. 9:1)

In his Concise Commentary Matthew Henry identifies falling stars as tepid, indecisive, weak or apostate clergy who,

"Having ceased to be a minister of Christ, he who is represented by this star becomes the minister of the devil; and lets loose the powers of hell against the churches of Christ."

John identifies antichrists, in this case clergy who serve the devil rather than Christ, sequentially. First, like Bultmann, Teilhard de Chardin, Robert Funk, Paul Tillich, and John Shelby Spong, they specifically deny the living, personal Holy Trinity in favor of Gnostic pagan, immanent or Eastern pantheist conceptions. Though God the Father Almighty in three Persons upholds the souls of men and maintains life and creation, His substance is not within nature (space-time dimension) as pantheism maintains, but outside of it. Sinful men live within nature and are burdened by time and mortality; God is not.

Second, the specific denial of the Father logically negates Jesus the Christ, the Word who was in the beginning (John 1), was with God, and is God from the creation of all things (1 John 1). In a pre-incarnate theophany, Jesus is the Angel who spoke “mouth to mouth” to Moses (Num. 12:6-9; John 9:20) and at sundry times and in many ways “spoke in times past to the fathers by the prophets, last of all…” (Hebrews 1:1) Jesus the Christ is the incarnate Son of God who is the life and light of men, who by His shed blood on the Cross died for the remission of all sins and bestowed the privilege of adoption on all who put their faith in Him.

Therefore, to deny the Holy Father is to logically deny the deity of Jesus Christ, the incarnate Son of God, hence,

“…every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist . . . and even now already is it in the world” (1 John 4:3).

According to Peter (2 Peter 2:1), falling stars will work among the faithful, teaching damnable heresies that deny the Lord, cause the fall of men into unbelief, and bring destruction upon themselves:

“The natural parents of modern unbelief turn out to have been the guardians of belief.” Many thinking people came at last “to realize that it was religion, not science or social change that gave birth to unbelief. Having made God more and more like man---intellectually, morally, emotionally---the shapers of religion made it feasible to abandon God, to believe simply in man.” (James Turner of the University of Michigan in “American Babylon,” Richard John Neuhaus, p. 95)

Falling Stars and Damnable Heresy

Almost thirty years ago, two well-respected social science scholars, William Sims Bainbridge and Rodney Stark found themselves alarmed by what they saw as a rising tide of irrationalism, superstition and occultism---channeling cults, spirit familiars, necromancers, Wiccans, Satanists, Luciferians, goddess worshippers, 'gay' shamans, Hermetic magicians and other occult madness at every level of society, particularly within the most influential--- Hollywood, academia and the highest corridors of political power.

Like many scientists, they were equally concerned by Christian opposition to naturalistic evolution. As is common in the science community, they assumed the cause of these social pathologies was somehow due to fundamentalism, their term for authentic Christian theism as opposed to liberalized Christianity. Yet to their credit, the research they undertook to discover the cause was conducted both scientifically and with great integrity. What they found was so startling it caused them to re-evaluate their attitude toward authentic Christian theism. Their findings led them to say:

"It would be a mistake to conclude that fundamentalists oppose all science (when in reality they but oppose) a single theory (that) directly contradicts the bible. But it would be an equally great mistake to conclude that religious liberals and the irreligious possess superior minds of great rationality, to see them as modern personalities who have no need of the supernatural or any propensity to believe unscientific superstitions. On the contrary...they are much more likely to accept the new superstitions. It is the fundamentalists who appear most virtuous according to scientific standards when we examine the cults and pseudo-sciences proliferating in our society today." ("Superstitions, Old and New," The Skeptical Inquirer, Vol. IV, No. 4; summer, 1980)

In more detail they observed that authentic ‘born again’ Christians are far less likely to accept cults and pseudoscientific beliefs while the irreligious and liberalized Christians (i.e., progressive Catholics, Protestant emergent, NAR, word faith, prosperity gospel) are open to unscientific notions. In fact, these two groups are most disposed toward occultism.

As Bainbridge and Stark admitted, evolution directly contradicts the Bible, beginning with the Genesis account of creation ex nihilo. This means that evolution is the antithesis of the Genesis account. For this reason, discerning Christians refuse to submit to the evolutionary thinking that has swept Western and American society. Nor do they accept the evolutionary theism brought into the whole body of the Church by weak, tepid, indecisive, or apostate clergy.

Over eighty years ago, Rev. C. Leopold Clarke wrote that priests who embrace evolution (evolutionary theists) are apostates from the ‘Truth as it is in Jesus.’ (1 John2:2) Rev. Clarke, a lecturer at a London Bible college, discerned that evolution is the antithesis to the Revelation of God in the Deity of Jesus Christ, thus it is the greatest and most active agent of moral and spiritual disintegration:

“It is a battering-ram of unbelief---a sapping and mining operation that intends to blow Religion sky-high. The one thing which the human mind demands in its conception of God, is that, being Almighty, He works sovereignly and miraculously---and this is the thing with which Evolution dispenses….Already a tremendous effect, on a wide scale has been produced by the impact of this teaching---an effect which can only be likened to the…collapse of foundations…” (Evolution and the Break-Up of Christendom, Philip Bell, creation.com, Nov. 27, 2012)

The faith of the Christian Church and of the average Christian has had, and still has, its foundation as much in the literal and historic meaning of Genesis, the book of beginnings revealed ‘mouth to mouth’ by the Angel to Moses, as in that of the person and deity of Jesus Christ. But how horrible a travesty of the sacred office of the Christian Ministry to see church leaders more eager to be abreast of the times, than earnestly contending for the Faith once delivered unto the saints (Jude 1:3). It is high time, said Rev. Clarke, that the Church,

“…. separated herself from the humiliating entanglement attending her desire to be thought up to date…What, after all, have custodians of Divine Revelation to do making terms with speculative Biology, which has….no message of comfort or help to the soul?” (ibid)

The primary tactic employed by priests eager to accommodate themselves and the Church to modern science and evolutionary thinking is predictable. It is the argument that evolution is entirely compatible with the Bible when we see Genesis, especially the first three chapters, in a non-literal, non-historical context. This is the argument embraced and advanced by mega-church pastor Timothy J. Keller.

With a position paper Keller published with the theistic evolutionary organization Bio Logos he joined the ranks of falling stars (Catholic and Protestant priests) stretching back to the Renaissance. Their slippery-slide into apostasy began when they gave into the temptation to embrace a non-literal, non-historical view of Genesis. (A response to Timothy Keller’s ‘Creation, Evolution and Christian Laypeople,” Lita Cosner, Sept. 9, 2010, creation.com)

This is not a heresy unique to modern times. The early Church Fathers dealt with this damnable heresy as well, counting it among the heretical tendencies of the Origenists. Fourth-century Fathers such as John Chrysostom, Basil the Great and Ephraim the Syrian, all of whom wrote commentaries on Genesis, specifically warned against treating Genesis as an unhistorical myth or allegory. John Chrysostom strongly warned against paying heed to these heretics,

“…let us stop up our hearing against them, and let us believe the Divine Scripture, and following what is written in it, let us strive to preserve in our souls sound dogmas.” (Genesis, Creation, and Early Man, Fr. Seraphim Rose, p. 31)

As St. Cyril of Alexandria wrote, higher theological, spiritual meaning is founded upon humble, simple faith in the literal and historic meaning of Genesis and one cannot apprehend rightly the Scriptures without believing in the historical reality of the events and people they describe. (ibid, Seraphim Rose, p. 40)

In the integral worldview teachings of the Fathers, neither the literal nor historical meaning of the Revelations of the pre-incarnate Jesus, the Angel who spoke to Moses, can be regarded as expendable. There are at least four critically important reasons why. First, to reduce the Revelation of God to allegory and myth is to contradict and usurp the authority of God, ultimately deny the deity of Jesus Christ; twist, distort, add to and subtract from the entire Bible and finally, to imperil the salvation of believers.

Scenarios commonly proposed by modern Origenists posit a cleverly disguised pantheist/immanent nature deity subject to the space-time dimension and forces of evolution. But as noted previously, it is sinful man who carries the burden of time, not God. This is a crucial point, for when evolutionary theists add millions and billions of zeros (time) to God they have transferred their own limitations onto Him. They have ‘limited’ God and made Him over in their own image. This is not only idolatrous but satanic.

Additionally, evolution inverts creation. In place of God’s good creation from which men fell there is an evolutionary escalator starting at the bottom with matter, then progressing upward toward life, then up and through the life and death of millions of evolved creatures that preceded humans by millions of years until at long last an apish humanoid emerges into which a deity that is always in a state of becoming (evolving) places a soul.

Evolution amputates the entire historical precedent from the Gospel and makes Jesus Christ unnecessary as the atheist Frank Zindler enthusiastically points out:

“The most devastating thing that biology did to Christianity was the discovery of biological evolution. Now that we know that Adam and Eve never were real people the central myth of Christianity is destroyed. If there never was an Adam and Eve, there never was an original sin. If there never was an original sin there is no need of salvation. If there is no need of salvation there is no need of a saviour. And I submit that puts Jesus…into the ranks of the unemployed. I think evolution absolutely is the death knell of Christianity.” (“Atheism vs. Christianity,” 1996, Lita Cosner, creation.com, June 13, 2013)

None of this was lost on Darwin’s bulldog, Thomas Henry Huxley (1825-1985). Huxley was thoroughly familiar with the Bible, thus he understood that if Genesis is not the authoritative Word of God, is not historical and literal despite its’ symbolic and poetic elements, then the entirety of Scripture becomes a collection of fairytales resulting in tragic downward spiraling consequences as the Catholic Kolbe Center for the Study of Creation makes clear in part:

“By denying the historical truth of the first chapters of Genesis, theistic evolutionism has fostered a preoccupation with natural causes almost to the exclusion of supernatural ones. By denying the several supernatural creative acts of God in Genesis, and by downplaying the importance of the supernatural activity of Satan, theistic evolutionists slip into a naturalistic mentality which seeks to explain everything in terms of natural causes. Once this mentality takes hold, it is easy for men to regard the concept of spiritual warfare as a holdover from the days of primitive superstition. Diabolical activity is reduced to material or psychological causes. The devil and his demons come to be seen as irrelevant. Soon ‘hell’ joins the devil and his demons in the category of antiquated concepts. And the theistic evolutionist easily makes the fatal mistake of thinking that he has nothing more to fear from the devil and his angels. According to Fr. Gabriele Amorth, the chief exorcist of Rome, there is a tremendous increase in diabolical activity and influence in the formerly Christian world. And yet most of the bishops of Europe no longer believe in the existence of evil spirits….To the Fathers of the Church who believed in the truth of Genesis, this would be incredible. But in view of the almost universal acceptance of theistic evolution, it is hardly surprising.” (The Difference it makes: The Importance of the Traditional Doctrine of Creation, Hugh Owen, kolbecenter.org)

Huxley had ‘zero’ respect for modern Origenists and received enormous pleasure from heaping piles of hot coals and burning contempt upon them, thereby exposing their shallow-reasoning, hypocrisy, timidity, fear of non-acceptance, and unfaithfulness. With sarcasm dripping from his words he quipped,

“I am fairly at a loss to comprehend how any one, for a moment, can doubt that Christian theology must stand or fall with the historical trustworthiness of the Jewish Scriptures. The very conception of the Messiah, or Christ, is inextricably interwoven with Jewish history; the identification of Jesus of Nazareth with that Messiah rests upon the interpretation of passages of the Hebrew Scriptures which have no evidential value unless they possess the historical character assigned to them. If the covenant with Abraham was not made; if circumcision and sacrifices were not ordained by Jahveh; if the “ten words” were not written by God’s hand on the stone tables; if Abraham is more or less a mythical hero, such as Theseus; the story of the Deluge a fiction; that of the Fall a legend; and that of the creation the dream of a seer; if all these definite and detailed narratives of apparently real events have no more value as history than have the stories of the regal period of Rome—what is to be said about the Messianic doctrine, which is so much less clearly enunciated? And what about the authority of the writers of the books of the New Testament, who, on this theory, have not merely accepted flimsy fictions for solid truths, but have built the very foundations of Christian dogma upon legendary quicksands?” (Darwin’s Bulldog---Thomas Huxley, Russell Grigg, creation.com, Oct. 14, 2008)

Pouring more contempt on them he asked,

“When Jesus spoke, as of a matter of fact, that "the Flood came and destroyed them all," did he believe that the Deluge really took place, or not? It seems to me that, as the narrative mentions Noah’s wife, and his sons’ wives, there is good scriptural warranty for the statement that the antediluvians married and were given in marriage; and I should have thought that their eating and drinking might be assumed by the firmest believer in the literal truth of the story. Moreover, I venture to ask what sort of value, as an illustration of God’s methods of dealing with sin, has an account of an event that never happened? If no Flood swept the careless people away, how is the warning of more worth than the cry of “Wolf” when there is no wolf? If Jonah’s three days’ residence in the whale is not an “admitted reality,” how could it “warrant belief” in the “coming resurrection?” … Suppose that a Conservative orator warns his hearers to beware of great political and social changes, lest they end, as in France, in the domination of a Robespierre; what becomes, not only of his argument, but of his veracity, if he, personally, does not believe that Robespierre existed and did the deeds attributed to him?” (ibid)

Concerning Matthew 19:5:

“If divine authority is not here claimed for the twenty-fourth verse of the second chapter of Genesis, what is the value of language? And again, I ask, if one may play fast and loose with the story of the Fall as a “type” or “allegory,” what becomes of the foundation of Pauline theology?” (ibid)

And concerning Cor. 15:21-22:

“If Adam may be held to be no more real a personage than Prometheus, and if the story of the Fall is merely an instructive “type,” comparable to the profound Promethean mythus, what value has Paul’s dialectic?” (ibid)

After much thought, C.S. Lewis concluded that evolution is the central, most radical lie at the center of a vast network of lies within which modern Westerners are entangled while Rev. Clarke identifies the central lie as the Gospel of another Spirit. The fiendish aim of this Spirit is to help men lose God, not find Him, and by contradicting the Divine Redeemer, compromising Priests are serving this Spirit and its’ diabolical purposes. To contradict the Divine Redeemer is the very essence of unfaithfulness, and that it should be done while reverence is professed,

“…. is an illustration of the intellectual and moral topsy-turvydom of Modernism…’He whom God hath sent speaketh the Words of God,’ claimed Christ of Himself (John 3:34), and no assumption of error can hold water in the face of that declaration, without blasphemy.” Evolutionary theists are serving the devil, therefore “no considerations of Christian charity, of tolerance, of policy, can exonerate Christian leaders or Churches who fail to condemn and to sever themselves from compromising, cowardly, shilly-shallying priests”---the falling stars who “challenge the Divine Authority of Jesus Christ.” (ibid)

The rebuttals, warnings and counsels of the Fathers against listening to Origenists (and their modern evolutionary counterparts) indicates that the spirit of antichrist operating through modern rationalistic criticism of the Revelation of God is not a heresy unique to our times but was inveighed against by early Church Fathers.

From the scholarly writings of the Eastern Orthodox priest, Fr. Seraphim Rose, to the incisive analysis, rebuttals and warnings of the Catholic Kolbe Center, creation.com, Creation Research Institute, Rev. Clarke, and many other stalwart defenders of the faith once delivered, all are a clear, compelling call to the whole body of the Church to hold fast to the traditional doctrine of creation as it was handed down from the Apostles, for as God spoke and Jesus is the Living Word incarnate, it is incumbent upon the faithful to submit their wills to the Divine Will and Authority of God rather than to the damnable heresy proffered by falling stars eager to embrace naturalistic science and the devil's antithesis--- evolution. But if it seem evil to you to serve the Lord,

“…you have your choice: choose this day that which pleases you, whom you would rather serve….but as for me and my house we will serve the Lord.” Joshua 24:15


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Extended News; Philosophy
KEYWORDS: apologetics; be; crevo; evolution; forum; historicity; historicityofchrist; historicityofjesus; inman; magic; naturalism; pantheism; religion; scientism; should
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To: betty boop
Excellent point, dearest sister in Christ!

Qualia can only be experienced - never conveyed.

541 posted on 10/17/2013 9:04:52 PM PDT by Alamo-Girl
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To: YHAOS
What Jefferson was telling young Carr is that “facts” alone cannot guide human action, but must be contemplated in a much wider cultural context tempered by value judgments derived from religious and other Western cultural influences. This seems to have been an inspiration grasped particularly well by our Founding Fathers. It can be found permeating the writings of them all. It escapes only the comprehension of the willfully blind.

Well and truly said, dear YHAOS, thank you so much for your insights!
542 posted on 10/17/2013 9:06:44 PM PDT by Alamo-Girl
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To: Alamo-Girl
Qualia can only be experienced - never conveyed.

How would you posit a theory based on what you cannot convey?

543 posted on 10/18/2013 5:30:25 AM PDT by tacticalogic ("Oh, bother!" said Pooh, as he chambered his last round.)
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To: YHAOS; betty boop; Alamo-Girl; BroJoeK; tacticalogic; MHGinTN

““Because you categorically separate them (Natural Science and Theology) does not mean they are factually “separate” in Reality, let alone mutually opposed.”

Spirited: As Ellis Washington points out in his brief overview of dialectical materialism, “Secular Humanism is Evolution Atheism,” unless we peer through the worldview lens of dialectical materialism it is impossible for us to understand it. Nor is it possible to understand its’ devastating effects, such as the cognitive dissonance of BroJoeK.

What we must understand is that dialectical materialism is a syncretic mixture of ancient pagan systems updated, revamped and made palatable for modern Westerners and Americans. It’s major ingredients are Hermetic magic, Greek Atomism (physical materialism) and its Eastern pantheist counterparts, Buddhism/Hinduism (spiritualized matter: prakriti), plus alchemical scientism (magic).

All pagan systems have in common some form of evolution plus transmigration or evolution plus reincarnation. This is because pagan systems are monist, which means that there is just one Ultimate Substance consisting of void, matter and mechanical energies (evolution) working on matter pregnant with the possibility of life, spirit, and conscious awareness.

The One Substance is the impersonal, unconscious mind or Reality of which all life and nonlife are aspects in continuity with the One Substance. Thus Hermes taught: As above, so below.

What this means with respect to man is that as he is really just an aspect of the One Substance (unconscious thinking matter in motion)he has no individual soul/spirit (mind). Man is not an individual thinker as the historically unique Biblical worldview teaches. At best he is an aspect of a Collective Communal Consciousness.

For about 80 years now, unsuspecting Americans have been undergoing a stealthy transformation of consciousness to supplant our identity as individual image-bearers of Jehovah God with the Collective Communal Consciousness of dialectical materialism. This is why Darwinism has been forced on us in the name of ‘science’ and why creation ex nihilo is forbidden. And this is why evolutionary theism is an abomination.

In ‘1984’ George Orwell tells us that as Big Brother (the ‘new’ Brahmin caste) is in the business of eradicating individual thinkers it has criminalized ‘thought:’

“Thought crime was not a thing that could be concealed forever. You might dodge successfully for awhile....but sooner or later they were bound to get you.” George Orwell, 1984

After analyzing dialectical materialism, Vishal Mangalwadi, India’s highly respected Christian intellectual, concludes that Marxist dialectical materialism, or scientific socialism, is Eastern pantheist nihilism dressed in ‘scientific’ clothing.

After seizing control of Russia, Marxist ‘mind-conditioners’ utilized propaganda of the lie, re-education tactics with major emphasis on Darwinism, revision of history, and other confusion-inducing, mind-and-thought-control techniques in connection with brain-altering drugs, electro-shock therapy, terror, and other brutal measures to,

“...liquidate all expressions of individual identity in favor of an impersonal collective, communal consciousness.” (The Book that Made Your World, Vishal Mangalwadi, p. 74)

Examples of pantheist nihilism disguised as ‘science’:

With B.F. Skinners’ behaviorism there is neither living Jehovah God nor soul/spirit. Human beings are chemicals turned into psychochemical machines determined by environment, chemistry, chance, and cultural conditioning.

With Richard Dawkins, mystical “thinking” memes plant thoughts in the grey matter of psychochemical organisms that are fatalistically determined by DNA.

Cognitive scientist Daniel Dennett claims there really is no you, that soul, spirit and will are illusions caused by chemical interactions in the brain while his partner in nihilism, naturalist Tom Wolfe proclaims,

“Sorry, but your soul just died.” (The Spiritual Brain: A Neuroscientist’s Case for the Existence of the Soul, Beauregard and O’Leary, p. 4)

For more than eighty years dialectical materialist pantheists have been waging war on Jehovah God, creation ex nihilo, and Imago Dei in furtherance of their agenda to transform the consciousness of Americans.

Mangalwadi argues that it is already the case that for increasing numbers of contemporary Americans the death of God has made it impossible for them to affirm the existence of the human self (reason for BroJoek’s cognitive dissonance) thus those who have converted to Zen Buddhism or similar natural philosophies actively seek the annihilation of their souls through drugs, Tantric sex, yoga, and meditation. As with contemporary Hindu gurus some initiates (i.e., Paul Tillich) are trying to merge their individual consciousness with the void.

Western and American evolutionary materialists took Jehovah Creator away and replaced Him with nihilist Darwinian materialism. Then they conceptually reduced His spiritual image-bearers to less than nothing, taught monstrous lies as scientific fact, morally corrupted Westerners and Americans, and brutally ridiculed and demonized anyone who dared speak truth to their lies. By these means they set Western and American civilization adrift in infinite nothingness.


544 posted on 10/18/2013 7:00:05 AM PDT by spirited irish
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To: tacticalogic

I urge you to look at your own bigger picture... you have a “dogma” framing in what you consider to be “falsification.” Your world view does not stand alone.


545 posted on 10/18/2013 7:21:57 AM PDT by HiTech RedNeck (The Lion of Judah will roar again if you give him a big hug and a cheer and mean it. See my page.)
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To: spirited irish

They can wage war all they want, and the Lord God is still right there as always, truckin’ along. It really helps to take a chill pill. He’s not going to walk out on you no matter what the philosophically-trapped scientists say, or even if they temporarily manage to fool you into believing some of it. Count the battles as trials for your sake. Keep your faith and you’ll come out more powerful on the other side, with a clearer view of the issues.


546 posted on 10/18/2013 7:24:41 AM PDT by HiTech RedNeck (The Lion of Judah will roar again if you give him a big hug and a cheer and mean it. See my page.)
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To: spirited irish

But the solution is not to remove metaphysics from the equation, but to demand that it be included and then fight over who gets to control what it’s going to be?


547 posted on 10/18/2013 7:27:32 AM PDT by tacticalogic ("Oh, bother!" said Pooh, as he chambered his last round.)
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To: Alamo-Girl

Such revelation is ubiquitous and yet, being temporarily hobbled in consciousness, we forget it, a bit like the proverbial fish forgetting about water.

The idea of a duty or of good or of beauty or of love, are all things that transcend the “natural physical” order, that speak of something placed atop it. Our dear slyentists, historically ignorant most of them, then come along and try to collapse all this into their own narrow world view, as if the tail could wag the dog, or as if the branch could claim the tree springs from it. They forget why we ever bothered with the physical sciences — to pan the entire endeavor as irredeemably evil is an overreaction. But these sciences can’t subsume the entire picture.


548 posted on 10/18/2013 7:31:55 AM PDT by HiTech RedNeck (The Lion of Judah will roar again if you give him a big hug and a cheer and mean it. See my page.)
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To: tacticalogic

Well ultimately there’s a God whether we want Him or not. We crazy Christians are willing to let you go off into folly if you insist. Love has to be chosen, or it isn’t love. But to just blatantly proclaim there is no divine love out there — now, we will tell you you are wrong.


549 posted on 10/18/2013 7:33:17 AM PDT by HiTech RedNeck (The Lion of Judah will roar again if you give him a big hug and a cheer and mean it. See my page.)
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To: HiTech RedNeck
I urge you to look at your own bigger picture... you have a “dogma” framing in what you consider to be “falsification.”

I didn't decide that science demands empirical evidennce. That decision was made long ago. I simply acknowlege that those are the rules of engagement, and that I cannot unilaterally change them because they don't suit my theology.

550 posted on 10/18/2013 7:34:49 AM PDT by tacticalogic ("Oh, bother!" said Pooh, as he chambered his last round.)
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To: tacticalogic

Why don’t you ask about them the same question you’ve been peppering us with? Like “WHO” has the right to say they spoke for all eternity when “the rules were set long ago”?

The Lord is really peeved at such inanity as you have been spouting. He wants to bless, believe it or not. Not curse. But you curse yourself by cutting off your blessings.


551 posted on 10/18/2013 7:37:26 AM PDT by HiTech RedNeck (The Lion of Judah will roar again if you give him a big hug and a cheer and mean it. See my page.)
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To: HiTech RedNeck
We crazy Christians are willing to let you go off into folly if you insist. Love has to be chosen, or it isn’t love. But to just blatantly proclaim there is no divine love out there — now, we will tell you you are wrong.

Is that an accusation of heresy?

552 posted on 10/18/2013 7:38:11 AM PDT by tacticalogic ("Oh, bother!" said Pooh, as he chambered his last round.)
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To: tacticalogic

And anyhow, why are you asking that something BIGGER than the sciences, fit within the little box of the sciences?

That something bigger, in fact, has ultimate claim over the use of the sciences.


553 posted on 10/18/2013 7:39:20 AM PDT by HiTech RedNeck (The Lion of Judah will roar again if you give him a big hug and a cheer and mean it. See my page.)
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To: tacticalogic

We just tell you that you are wrong. We don’t argue about words, at least not if we are obeying the bible. Heresy applies within a spiritual context and it’s talking about pollutions of Christianity.


554 posted on 10/18/2013 7:40:16 AM PDT by HiTech RedNeck (The Lion of Judah will roar again if you give him a big hug and a cheer and mean it. See my page.)
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To: HiTech RedNeck
Why don’t you ask about them the same question you’ve been peppering us with? Like “WHO” has the right to say they spoke for all eternity when “the rules were set long ago”?

Because I don't think I have the right to demand that they adopt my religions beliefs in order to do scientific research.

555 posted on 10/18/2013 7:41:20 AM PDT by tacticalogic ("Oh, bother!" said Pooh, as he chambered his last round.)
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To: tacticalogic

The problem is that you then go on to assume “scientific research” is king over all reality. It isn’t. Shouldn’t that be obvious?


556 posted on 10/18/2013 7:42:45 AM PDT by HiTech RedNeck (The Lion of Judah will roar again if you give him a big hug and a cheer and mean it. See my page.)
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To: HiTech RedNeck
We just tell you that you are wrong. We don’t argue about words, at least not if we are obeying the bible. Heresy applies within a spiritual context and it’s talking about pollutions of Christianity.

So, you want to make the accusation, and then deny having done it.

557 posted on 10/18/2013 7:52:53 AM PDT by tacticalogic ("Oh, bother!" said Pooh, as he chambered his last round.)
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To: HiTech RedNeck
The problem is that you then go on to assume “scientific research” is king over all reality.

Your powers of telepathy are not working properly.

558 posted on 10/18/2013 7:56:30 AM PDT by tacticalogic ("Oh, bother!" said Pooh, as he chambered his last round.)
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To: tacticalogic; betty boop
How would you posit a theory based on what you cannot convey?

I suspect theorizing on qualia and obtaining grants to research the same happens all the time in the soft sciences (soft as compared to physics and chemistry) such as sociology, psychology and medical arts like psychiatry and pain management.

Indeed, qualia prevent the dream even of artificial intelligence mathematicians. Because they cannot convey qualia in the logic they cannot fabricate a 'machine' that can experience a full range of emotions, e.g. love/hate, pain/pleasure.

559 posted on 10/18/2013 9:30:12 AM PDT by Alamo-Girl
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To: HiTech RedNeck
Such revelation is ubiquitous and yet, being temporarily hobbled in consciousness, we forget it, a bit like the proverbial fish forgetting about water.

Very well said, dear HiTech RedNeck, thank you for sharing your insights!

560 posted on 10/18/2013 9:31:47 AM PDT by Alamo-Girl
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