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No matter what the outcome will be after the GOP Convention is the "GOP" as we have known it...
17 Jan 2012 | US Navy Vet

Posted on 01/17/2012 11:00:16 AM PST by US Navy Vet

..toast? And if so what(if any) organization(s) will replace it?


TOPICS: Government; Politics/Elections; Your Opinion/Questions
KEYWORDS: gop; republican
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To: TennesseeProfessor

Perhaps founding the party with specific guidelines that will insure it remains a representative party for conservatives?

Perhaps pointing out that its purpose is to replace the GOP?

Perhaps pointing out that reasons it is replacing the GOP?

Perhaps reminding Americans that if we are stuck in a two party system, maybe it’s time to actually have a second party as the democrats and republicans are the establishment party (ruling class) that only cares about themselves?

Perhaps reminding Americans that it has happened before (replacing one of our two major parties)?

I see a lot of possibilities here, but first and foremost, take it directly to the public, bypass the MSM so they will not be given the opportunity to shape this party in any way, otherwise we are back to square one.

Perhaps having town hall meetings that shut out the media and any current political party?


61 posted on 01/17/2012 12:37:39 PM PST by Pox (Good Night. I expect more respect tomorrow.)
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To: All; US Navy Vet
Nope. Idiots might try to go form yet another "3rd Party" but it'll be a failure with even less impact than Perot's Reform Party.

Where would this new party draw candidates from? The "Tea Party" has already crumbled (if not self-destructed) and those so inclined never coalesced behind one GOP primary candidate nor attracted someone that movement might've preferred like Sarah Palin. As impotent and short lived as it's shown to be after the 2010 success, how would it attract viable national candidates in 2016? Not gonna happen; it's not even a 2012 factor.

Early in the primary season, Bachmann well described the Republican party as a coalition of three legs: fiscal, social and foreign policy but even those areas of focus split among the libertarians, conservatives and moderates.

If Republican Corbett hadn't just assumed office in 2011, Santorum could've run for PA governor for some executive experience and it might be "his turn" in 2016. I've ready many say Santorum lives in VA so maybe he can run in 2013 to succeed Bob McDonnell. Of the current slate, he's most likely to run again.

Perry will be just 65 so he might run again (and probably should).

Mitt, Newt, Cain and Ron Paul won't be back for a 2016 part-out-of-power primary.

62 posted on 01/17/2012 12:39:36 PM PST by newzjunkey (Imbecilic early voters doom us all.)
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To: SENTINEL

Agreed. Romney is the most successful socialist governer the US has ever seen. Socialism under any banner is still socialism. I refuse to waste my vote on liberal just because he has an R behind his name. Im not that stupid.


63 posted on 01/17/2012 12:39:36 PM PST by vmivol00
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To: US Navy Vet

The “GOP” as we have known it will be safe, unfortunately.

We can safely count on more BIG Government, more deficeit spending, more Nanny-State laws, more sweetheart Crony Capitalism, more special laws and treatment for politicians and government employees, more pandering and more loss of individual freedoms.

That is, unless a miracle occurs and a true conservative appears out of nowhere and steals the nomination.


64 posted on 01/17/2012 1:04:35 PM PST by Iron Munro ("Don't pick a fight with an old man. If he is too old to fight he'll just kill you." John Steinbeck)
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To: Rashputin; Antoninus

I promise you that if Romney succeeds in pushing every challenger to Obama off the field I too will not be voting for a Mutt and I will work actively against him.

I will write in a candidate for President, add my vote to help a Republican/Conservative Congress attain Super Majority.

We will gain a majority in the Senate as well but it’s a toss up as to whether or not we will gain Super Majority.

Romney is a Futher Mucker and he won’t do squat once he living at 1600 Pennsylvania.


65 posted on 01/17/2012 1:37:44 PM PST by Vendome (Don't take life so seriously, you won't live through it anyway)
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To: tcrlaf; wagglebee; little jeremiah; Dr. Sivana; Antoninus
trclaf:

If the GOP does not want to cause mass defections of pro-life conservatives, pro-family conservatives, interventionist conservatives, pro-gun conservatives, anti-bailout conservatives, Tea Party conservatives, then the bozos who run the GOP had better find a way to dump the Mittwit once and for all. It is not my ambition to be an enabler of the trust fund American community any longer. McCain was the last straw.

AND a replacement party will be no joy to the Ron Paul surrender mongers, conspiracy theorists, earmarkers, and two-faced phonies who CLAIM to be pro-life and pro-family but whose records show them to be bald-faced liars. We are quite unlikely to adopt Paul's strange brew of McGovern's peacecreepism, and the desire of GOP money obsessives to be nice to our enemies, kiss their backsides, genuflect before them and make the world safe for "free trade" which means destroying American jobs for people not born to the class of the Romneys so as to increase those protected corporate dividends and capital gains while destroying the lives of ordinary Americans. "Just learn to be an investment banker" after we send your factory job to Bangladesh (where the anti-American investment bankers pay their wage slaves 7 cents an hour and no benefits: oooooh, yummy profits) is not a prescription for economic recovery for our country.

We may not have Sarah Palin as our nominee (although it would be a very good idea) but I, for one, am not going to put up with voting for the Mittwit, a man with neither a heart nor a brain nor a soul. If this country simply MUST be ruined, it will be ruined by Demonrats and the plutocrats can pay for it. Posing as Republicans, they want to surrender to the Demonrats on every issue that counts. They need to be punished too and Obozo will take care of that. Sarah or no Sarah, we WILL have red meat and we will NOT have an elitist GOP POTUS too cowardly to bash Obozo as he needs to be bashed.

Alternatively the trust fund babies who are in bed with the lamestream media to tout the "inevitability" of the Mittwit with the LSM salivating over how Mittwit will be absolute roadkill in November and in any debate with even Obozo and will probably prevent a GOP takeover of the Senate and restore Pelosi's rule as Speaker of the House.

Does any actual conservative shiv a git what Muffy down at the Junior League and Skipper at the Snobbington Polo Club think should be our nominee. They would share a nervous breakdown in front of their leftist and equally brainless pals if once again, the GOP has nominated a pro-baby, pro-family, pro-gun, military interventionist, etc., social conservative. They would be sooooo humiliated. And a good thing, too. It is about time they realized that the GOP is not and long has not been the party of their legendary great, great, great-grandaddy Ebenezer Q. Pennypincher and his Unitarian soulmates down at the Abolition Club and, if it tries to be, then it will be destroyed like the Whigs and Federalists before it.

It is purely up to the spoiled and privileged and their paid political lackeys like Tokyo Rove to get off this despicable drive to nominate Romney by mountains of money and connivance with the LSM for shameless propaganda's sake. If they don't, he, they and the GOP (and maybe the nation) will be destroyed this November. Conservatives and other patriots will then go back to the drawing board and do to the elitist establishmentarian spaghetti spines what Aaron Burr did to Hamilton (figuratively speaking), what Jefferson did to the Federalist money obsessive ancestors of the Romneybots and Andrew Jackson and others did to the Whig money obsessive ancestors of the Romneybots. Note that Mr. Newt favorably cited Andrew Jackson in last night's Fox Debate.

AND, you have the gilt-edged nerve in support of the spineless and brainless spoiled child of privilege Mittwit to call Antoninus stupid??? I don't think anyone planning to defect (as I certainly will if he is nominated) from Romney on actually conservative grounds will EVER have anything whatever to do with the social issue dishonesty and foreign policy of Ron Paul or with anything involved with Alan Simpson, an enthusiastic supporter of baby-killing when serving in the Senate. The alternative is voting for Senate, Governor, Congress and state legislature, for conservative positions on ballot questions and letting the Mittwit swing by the neck in the wind for lack of votes. The other alternative is for the GOP to man up and dump the Mittwit.

Mitt Romney, devoid of brain, spine and heart is the personal embodiment of the Cowardly Lion, the Tin Man and the Scarecrow in Wizard of Oz. We don't need to be responsible for putting this worthless putz in the White House. He is also a soulless cannibal trying to feed off the GOP carcass. It is said that Reagan got a lot of votes because he was the one candidate whom you would gladly have as a dinner or barbeque guest, that he had many qualities that made you as comfortable with him as you were with the guy next to you at work, and no resemblance to the boss who fired you. Romney is the anti-Reagan in all of those respects and he has never had a shred of actual principle in his entire worthless life.

How many votes of social conservatives being withheld from Romney will render him toast. Care to find out the hard way? Nominate the Mittwit and you will.

66 posted on 01/17/2012 1:40:48 PM PST by BlackElk ( Dean of Discipline ,Tomas de Torquemada Gentlemen's Society. Burn 'em Bright!)
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To: Lazlo in PA; Dr. Sivana; wagglebee; little jeremiah; narses
I never much cared for Thomas Nast's elephant and jackass as party symbols. I think you have the winner. That dragon symbolizes what we seek to be. The flame he breathes and the scorched earth are also nice touches.

Party slogan: Rule or ruin.

67 posted on 01/17/2012 1:52:06 PM PST by BlackElk ( Dean of Discipline ,Tomas de Torquemada Gentlemen's Society. Burn 'em Bright!)
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To: WayneS

PS - Did you even READ the rest of my post?

Yes I sure did, and I am going to repeat your entire post again, and again,and again to you. It’s funny how you keep denying your own words. It’s even more funny how you can never answer anything asked to you.

“The GOP is not going to BE toast, it already IS toast, and it has been for some time.

It’s been more than 20 years since “the GOP as we have known it” has actualy been “the GOP as we have known it”...”

That was post #8, written by WayneS, so what’s your name, is it WayneS? just say Y/N

And if you’re asking about 20 years ago, well, people don’t know how to be a player like Reagan, who was pretty much an anomaly compared to other Republicans, partially due to the fact that he was assertive in his beliefs while he was governor, and he defied plenty of conventional GOP in his day. I don’t regard the GOP as toast yet, at least for the sake of Congress, where we could at least try and organize if tea party could grab more congressional seats.


68 posted on 01/17/2012 2:00:54 PM PST by Morpheus2009
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To: Wuli

“If the GOP grass roots wants, it can hold it’s nose when pulling the lever for POTUS, while meanwhile have been working vigourously for a GOP Congressional majority that is more theirs and not a rubber stanp for ANY POTUS, even one wearing a GOP label.”

It’s about time someone had some sense. If we can get some seats, then perhaps we can have a means to contend with whomever’s in the oval office. Again, that’s the important part, especially when even among the GOP presidential contenders, conservativism isn’t so strong. I have my primary vote for Santorum, but will go for whomever gets the nomination, and hope that the nomination process gives a good idea what fire their feet will be held to by conservatives.


69 posted on 01/17/2012 2:08:56 PM PST by Morpheus2009
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70 posted on 01/17/2012 2:12:54 PM PST by TheOldLady (FReepmail me to get ON or OFF the ZOT LIGHTNING ping list)
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To: campaignPete R-CT
Pete, this is the moment when the creation of a new party on the political corpses of Romney and Tokyo Rove is possible. Just as Tommy ran credibly for governor years ago as an independent, we can create a more permanent vehicle that will bring together every voter worth having. I will try to ping you to the long form of this argument on another thread. I am sorry to fail to ping you more often but I can never remember the precise form of your screen name. What are Wayne and Carol Howard doing? Can Lenny be re-elected? What is Tommy doing? And Joe M. Be sure to involve Race Bannon in whatever you are doing that will not offend his stubborn fundamentalism.

God bless you and yours.

Ping me when you post so I can follow what you are doing even though I am living on the plains in the wilderness. A small herd of eleven deer were having a good old time yesterday dancing around in my yard. There will be pheasants come spring. I'm getting older but I guess it sure beats the alternative. At least I get to post jeremiads on FR.

71 posted on 01/17/2012 2:15:58 PM PST by BlackElk ( Dean of Discipline ,Tomas de Torquemada Gentlemen's Society. Burn 'em Bright!)
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To: tcrlaf
“If Romney is the nominee, I’m going rogue. I don’t vote for liberals.”

So, you’ll be electing OBAMA, then?? EXACTLY LIKE HE WANTS YOU TO?

I don't know why some conservatives cannot wrap their minds around the fact that the real Mitt Romney bears no significant difference to Barack Obama, and that electing him will just take us down the same path, while giving the enemies of the republic the ability to pin the blame for our nation's downfall on the political right.

If you're sick to death of the wanton destruction the Obama regime has rained down upon us, why would you cast your vote for more of the same from a stealth liberal with an R behind his name? Can your thinking honestly be that shallow, or have you bought into the lie that Romney really will govern as a Republican?

Obama and his agenda will be gone this year, UNLESS we stupidly hand the Republican nomination to his fellow traveler, Romney. He and Ron Paul are the ONLY candidates Obama can beat.

72 posted on 01/17/2012 2:15:59 PM PST by Windflier (To anger a conservative, tell him a lie. To anger a liberal, tell him the truth.)
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To: BlackElk

I understand that THE PRIMARIES are the vetting process of who will be the nominee.

Sarah Palin decided not to run.
Jesus Christ decided not to run.
Conservatives are divided between three different candidates, so Mitt is likely going to win, by default.

That’s not my fault, it’s not my CHILDREN’S FAULT, but I’ll be damned if I’m going to allow Obama wreck my children’s future through some kind of pathetic temper tantrum.

Are you?


73 posted on 01/17/2012 2:24:04 PM PST by tcrlaf (Election 2012: THE RAPTURE OF THE DEMOCRATS)
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To: Digger
Pls don't do the 3rd party thing. Do you want Big Ears stacking the Supreme Court? I assure you that will be the final nail in the coffin.

And you trust Mitt Romney to appoint solid conservative patriots (or even moderates) to the Supreme Court?

Check his record of appointments to the bench while he was Governor. Liberals, through and through.

It may be a moot point, though. If Romney is the nominee, Obama's chances of being re-elected increase exponentially, because the country will be made painfully aware of his true liberalism by November. The conservative vote will be catastrophically depressed, because people like me will choose to write in an alternate candidate, only vote the down-ticket, or stay home altogether - thus handing the win to Obama.

But it'll all be ok with the establishment GOP, because Romney got 'his turn.'

74 posted on 01/17/2012 2:25:23 PM PST by Windflier (To anger a conservative, tell him a lie. To anger a liberal, tell him the truth.)
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To: Responsibility2nd
We thought the Tea Party could set conservatives in place, but no...

You didn't seriously think that one flush was going to clear the drain, did you? We did a bang up job in the 2010 midterms, but still have LOTS of work to do.

75 posted on 01/17/2012 2:28:35 PM PST by Windflier (To anger a conservative, tell him a lie. To anger a liberal, tell him the truth.)
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To: Morpheus2009

“If we can get some seats, then perhaps we can have a means to contend with whomever’s in the oval office.”

In addition to GOP grass roots activism, we need sitting CONSERVATIVE GOP legislators, to do as Jim Demint has done, and not rely on the official party apparatus to support “our guy”, but to go out and work on support for Conservative GOP candidates without asking what the GOP official apparatus wants to do.

We also need GOP grass roots activists to support the Conservatyive PAC’s like the one Demint set up. They are the best Conservative hedge against the RNC.


76 posted on 01/17/2012 2:31:35 PM PST by Wuli (ffic)
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To: US Navy Vet

What a fantastic idea.

President William J. Bryan, 1896
President Theodoes Roosevelt, 1912
President Robert M. LaFollette, 1924
President Strom Thurmond, 1948
President George Wallace, 1968
President John Anderson, 1980
President Ross Perot, 1992
President Pat Buchanan, 2000
President Ralph Nader, forever

All want to commend the well thought out response to not getting your way in primaries.

No 3rd party has won, in over 100 years.

But the winning candidate appreciated the impact of the 3rd parties, splitting the vote.

Insanity, “doing the same thing over and over, expecting different results.”

So what is the beneficial result of 3rd parties?

People here want one of Santorum, Perry or Gingrich to drop out, to avoid aplitting the vote.

See any similarities? Clue, you don’t win with more candidates, you win with fewer candidates.


77 posted on 01/17/2012 2:46:41 PM PST by truth_seeker
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To: Digger; campaignPete R-CT; Dr. Sivana; wagglebee; little jeremiah; Antoninus; Lazlo in PA; ...
Based upon the track record of the Mittwit in appointing militant pro-aborts to judicial vacancies, I don't want him choosing SCOTUS or lower court nominees. You must not have gotten the memo. Conservatives (the actual ones) are committed to a long overdue policy of rule or ruin. We are not voting for the brainless Mittwit. As to judicial nominees, spineless sort of Republicans appointed: (Eisenhower) William Brennan, Potter Stewart, Earl Warren, (Nixon) appointed Herod Blackmun, Warren Burger, G. Harold Carswell (whose appointment was derailed even before he was arrested in flagrante in a country club men's room, ummmm, "loving" and being "loved" by his fellow man, Lewis Powell (chosen for being pro-business (of course) and utterly clueless and worthless on most social issues, (George Herbert Walker New World Order Bush) gave us Swish Souter who was just about as bad as Brennan and recommended by John Sununu the Elder (Romney's NH campaign manager). Even Ronaldus Maximus named Sandra Day O'Connor and Sandra Day O'Kennedy who is now the occupant of the "centrist" seat on SCOTUS soliciting an ardent ass kissing from all sides before he votes, just like O'Connor before him.

Now it is true that Dubya named two solid judges in Roberts and Alito (although he had to be battered into submission to dump Harriet Myers) and that Nixon named Rehnquist. It is also true that Reagan unsuccessfully nominated Robert Bork and then dope-smoking Douglas Ginzberg before appointing Kennedy and he actually got Scalia onto the SCOTUS. We knew Ronald Reagan. He was a friend and participant in our movement. The Mittwit is no Ronaldus Maximus, not even close. You are shameless to advocate Mittwit's election on the basis of judicial nominations. He is no better than Obozo.

Wanna find out how many social conservatives refusing to vote for Romney are necessary to defeat him? Nominate him and you will find out.

78 posted on 01/17/2012 2:48:28 PM PST by BlackElk ( Dean of Discipline ,Tomas de Torquemada Gentlemen's Society. Burn 'em Bright!)
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To: US Navy Vet

I base my thoughts on Tennessee. Tennessee is considered conservative and where I live, very conservative.

Free Republic approved type conservatives lose however. Our Governor, both our Senators and a host of representatives are more moderate. Our local Republican representative lost in a primary but the next primary election, he handily beat the very conservative incumbent. He will be reelected till he gets tired and quits. The conservative considered running again but did not........ no money

Across the country this is also true. The conservative movement just doesn’t seem to have the strength to prevail in adequate numbers to gain control.

The only conservative hope is not a third party. The disgrunteled who espouse a third party are suicidal


79 posted on 01/17/2012 3:02:56 PM PST by bert (K.E. N.P. +12 ..... Crucifixion is coming)
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To: jpsb; shibumi; Dr. Sivana; wagglebee; little jeremiah; Old Sarge; US Navy Vet; Lazlo in PA; ...
Well, the GOP CAN be an effective vehicle for conservative politics.

Under Mitt Romney or Ron Paul, the GOP would, for differing reasons, refuse to DO anything about abortion. Either of them would set new world records (even among politicians) for lying to us to get what THEY want.

Paul would be examining his navel over whether potential court nominees would be able to declare lighthouses unconstitutional or would order flowers to be inserted in the barrels of our soldiers' guns with proper Islamofascist prayers and that the Marines be known as the severed necks rather than leathernecks. He would also pose for holy pictures as pro-life and pro-family and as fiscally conservative (whatever that may mean when baby-killing is just peachy with the Tenth Amendment set) while doing NOTHING as to each issue while philosophizing on how he just can' do anything because of the Tenth Almighty. Babies dying by the millions? Toooo bad, sooooo sad but, hey, what do we want out of paleoPaulie? He will make friendsof our enemies by paying them off, letting them nuke Israel, and naming PLO terrorists as Secretaries of State and Defense. Today or last night, he was pleading for a mighty policy of diployak so he can smooch their posteriors behind closed doors. That sure should scare the hell out of them until they smell blood in the water and go after te Pentagon and civilian office buildings again.

As to Mittwit, he can be trusted..... to obsess on the interests that he cares most about: Muffy's and Skipper's trust funds, to destroy any vestige of conservative ideology in the GOP and to permanently destroy the brand name, to revert to cheerleading baby-killing and rump-ranging posing as "marriage" and gun grabbing as soon as he lowers his hand after being sworn in.

Newt Gingrich recalled the valiant American general and POTUS, Andrew Jackson, reminding us that he had a policy about enemies of our nation: KILL THEM ALL. Sounded good to me. That policy is soooo unsophisticated, soooo not nuanced, soooo Neanderthal, so utterly alien to Manhattan, San Fransicko, and Harvard, Yale and Georgetown and Norre Shame and so, so, so manly and therefore so verrrrry effective and worthwhile. I don't trust the Mittwit to emulate Andrew Jackson. I don't have to repeat what heresies the Paulistinian has in that regard.

When, as usual, Ron Paul is playing for the Islamofascist team of enemies of America, that is a difference in direction and not merely of degree. What we need to do is change degree and incinerate them and leave their lands flat, black and glowing in the dark. Not kissing their backsides or engaging in useless diployak.

I used to think that Bill Cunningham, radio talk-jock of Cincinnati, had turned war wimp or even peace creep from his desire to withdraw troops from Iraq and Afghanistan. On his nationally syndicated three hour show on 1/15/12. he disabused me of that notion with the greatest rant I have ever heard on radio. In summary: If we decide to attack Iran, we should give them about two or three days' warning and, if they do not comply with our demands, we attack by submarine and air force only: No boots on the ground and no long-term commitments. No IED's. No outraging our troops or theirs by beheading on camera or pissing on the corpses. Make a list of their twenty largest cities and bomb each into the stone Age and beyond, making each and their populations only a bad memory. No UN resolutions or sanctions; no UN anything (withdraw altogether from the useless POS); if the UN has a problem, remove it just as forcibly from Manhattan and any other site it occupies in the USA (that one is mine and not Cunningham's); massive death from the sky only and repeat as necessary wherever and whenever necessary with no diployak and no negotiations. Take as much oil as necessary to reimburse us for the cost of any such war and for the cost of the wrongly fought Iraq and Afghan wars. If that makes them not love us, we will just have to learn to live with that. No problem! We wil probably be amazed after one of those (preferably Iran) at how seldom it will be necessary for us to fight wars, lose men and women, spend money on stomping Islamofascism or anyone else foolish enough to offend us. As Machiavelli wisely observed in The Prince, it is better to be feared than to be loved. They aren't going to love us in any event.

You are correct to observe that there is not much difference between Rats and RINOs but you have to accept that Ron Paul is a RINO and that's why he craves and encourages the votes of the radical peace creep. pro-abort, dope-smoking wing of the Rat Party to be cast for him disrupting the GOP nominating process. We don't need his or their input as to what conservatism is in any post-Romney and Paul defeat discussions.

I will never vote for Ron Paul or for Mittwit no matter who is running against either one. Rule or ruin!

80 posted on 01/17/2012 3:48:42 PM PST by BlackElk ( Dean of Discipline ,Tomas de Torquemada Gentlemen's Society. Burn 'em Bright!)
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