Posted on 08/12/2009 1:56:38 PM PDT by Stand Watch Listen
Verbal sparks flew at U.S. Sen. Sherrod Brown’s forum on overhauling the health care system.
The forum, lasting nearly two hours, was held on Wednesday, Aug. 12, in Columbus at Ohio State University’s Biomedical Research Tower.
Mike NeutzLing, 56, a nurse at the Ohio State University Medical Center, blasted plans by President Barack Obama, Brown, D-Ohio, and others to overhaul the system. He said 80 percent of Americans are satisfied with he health care they have now.
Neutzling said “the whole concept of limited government is being tossed out the window.”
The nation’s founders “understood that when you have unlimited government you have unlimited tyranny,” he said.
Jeff Davidson, 58, a retired accountant from Dublin, strongly disagreed, urging Brown and Obama to come up with a plan to provides coverage for uninsured Americans.
“I want you to raise my taxes,” said Davidson. “I can afford it.”
The current system is “immoral,” he said.
Brown for the most part succeeded in keeping the discussion civil and interrupted several times to silence hecklers on both sides of the issue.
“This has been very helpful,” he said to the 150 people in the center. Hundreds more were in overflow rooms, according to event officials.
Brown set the tone for the forum with a blast at the current system.
“…Americans are paying more and more for their insurance and getting less and less,” said Brown, the son of a physician.
After the session, he told reporters he didn’t think the discussion was one-sided.
“If it was stacked, I’m not sure which way it was stacked,” said Brown.
Page 425 Lines 17-19 - Government will instruct and consult regarding living wills, durable powers of attorney. Mandatory! Page 425 Lines 22-25, 426 Lines 1-3 - Government provides approved list of end of life resources, guiding you in death. Page 427 Lines 15-24 - Government mandates program for orders for end of life. The Government has a say in how your life ends. Page 429 Lines 1-9 - An “Advanced Care Planning Consultant” will be used frequently as patients health deteriorates. Page 429 Lines 10-12 - “advanced care consultation” may include an ORDER for end of life plans. AN ORDER from Government! Page 429 Lines 13-25 - The Government will specify which Doctors can write an end of life order. Page 430 Lines 11-15 - The Government will decide what level of treatment you will have at end of life.In response to Roscoe2u about the life expectancy in the US being lower than other countries. There are two main reasons our life expectancy is lower…our murder rates and rate auto fatalities are much higher than those countries. Take those out and our rates are almost identicle. It has nothing to do with health care.
If it is only about paying the doctor for end of life discussion why does it take 10 vague pages to explain it. Get familiar with the people that are guiding the legislation. Emanuel who does believe in not treating the elderly, for example if you have dementia, no money should be spent on you. It’s not in the bill but the bill allows for it. The bill does not say it covers illegals, but it also does not say it covers only citizens. Therefore, illegals are covered. Wake up people. You have decided to let Obama and other politicans especially ones that are not answerable to the people, to make decisions with few resources. It happens in all of the countries that have universal health care. Yes you can have your insurance deny payment or treatment, but you also have choices now. You can pay yourself or you can find other help. Once you have government health care and no private then you have no options.
Interesting article in Friday 7/31 USA TODAY’s letter’s to the editor section. It compared our system to the systems of the countries most like us (Germany,France, Canada,Japan) We pay more than twice as much in taxes and insurance premiums as they do yet the average life expectancy in all of tose countries is at least 2 years longer. So if our system is so superior then why the difference???? Go to the WHO(world health org) and look at the rankings for various healthcare modalities and you will see that in many cases we aren’t even top ten in level of care. I’m not saying Obama’s answer is right but the system obviously needs fixing if we’re paying more and getting less than the rest of the civilized world….
I have managed to “read” some of this bill. My personal opinion is that it is little more than legal jargon. You can make it say whatever you want. Its written that way for confusion. Sure succeeded for me. Until there is a bill that the entire American public can read or at least understand I doubt many are going to say sure I whole heartedly support this. Not me, that’s for sure and I did want to see some improved health care. It is needed but we need the facts.
RJ…what you are not informed of…. President George Bush, funded a pilot home visitation program because, as his administration said, “There is a growing body of evidence that suggest that some home visitation programs can be successful as a child maltreatment prevention strategy.” FACT…Republican governors established home visitation programs in several states. FACT…a senior Republican Senator, this year, introduced home visitation legislation. FACT…Michelle Ridge, former First Lady of Pennsylvania, sent a letter to the House Republican Caucus offering strong support for home visitation programs because they work: “Offering proven and practical solutions to improve critical outcomes for high-risk, first-time mothers and their children is a priority for business and political leaders that transcends ideology and political affiliation. Quite simply, it is cheaper and more sensible to tackle problems before they begin, rather than spend increasing sums on increasing health care costs associated with poor prenatal care, neglect and abuse, and ineffective remedial policies… FACT…home visitation is a bipartisan issue because 30 years of research shows that home visitation programs produce measurable positive benefits for families and children, and saves money by reducing emergency room visits.
And again BS on Barry. That is NOT in there, you haven’t read it and you are lying again. Show me the language…what section? What line? I’ve actually read HR 3200 and that is NOT in there. There is no language that even INSINUATES that old people will just be left to die. Senator Isakson, a Republican from Georgia, actually wrote legislation that says the same thing in the Medicare End of Life Planning Act of 2007 and it say this: (3) For purposes of paragraph (1), the term `end-of-life planning consultation’ means a consultation between the physician and an individual regarding— (A) the importance of preparing advance directives in case an injury or illness causes the individual to be unable to make health care decisions; (B) the situations in which an advance directive is likely to be relied upon; (C) the reasons why the development of a comprehensive end-of-life plan is beneficial and the reasons why such a plan should be updated periodically as the health of the individual changes; (D) the identification of resources that an individual may use to determine the requirements of the State in which such individual resides so that the treatment wishes of that individual will be carried out if the individual is unable to communicate those wishes, including requirements regarding the designation of a surrogate decision maker (health care proxy); and (E) whether or not the physician is willing to follow the individual’s wishes as expressed in an advance directive.’. .
the biggest problem I had with W was his extra constitutional non defense related spending, and I complained about it endlessly. and I complained about the same thing with Clinton (ok maybe moreso after he lied to us about the sex thing). BHO is even more out of control (with spending) then any of his predecessors and his relationship with the truth reminds me a lot of Clinton and Nixon.
It is quite obvious that our health care system is not functioning in the best interests of All Americans. It is also becoming quite clear that specific lobbyist groups within the health care and pharmaceutical industries believe their interests are more important than the American Citizens interest. President Obama and many members of congress support health care reform. But, there are certain members of the Senate and House of Representatives that seem to place their loyalty with the lobbyists instead of their own constituents or the best interest of our country. For them, it is a matter of pleasing those that will finance campaigns or help them get reelected. That would be lobbyists within the health care industry. All members of congress and all Federal employees are covered under the FEHB. (Federal Employees Health Benefit System) It is a system that allows all federal employees to choose an insurance provider from a long list and weigh benefits and costs. There are national plans and state specific plans. And, an “open season” every year, if one chooses to change plans or coverage. Those in the private sector usually only have one or two options for health insurance. They are normally at the mercy of their employer. These plans usually change every year due to the employer changing plans. Usually, the employee is stuck with whatever plan the employer provides. With limited or very few options available. It is time to consider the FEHB system for all Americans. It gives people the option to shop for the health insurance that is best for themselves or their family. It is not socialized medicine by any means. We deserve the same level of health insurance that our elected officials receive. After all, they work for us. We do not work for them! For those that are less fortunate, those that do not have health care coverage. And, those that are unemployed, we have a moral and ethical obligation to provide health care coverage. People that lose their jobs usually lose health care coverage. COBRA insurance is way too expensive for most Americans. Especially for those that find themselves unemployed. It is time to have low cost or no cost health insurance for those that need it. This should be based upon income levels. Everyone deserves health care coverage. Health care reform will eventually happen. Regardless of what certain members of congress and the media say, it will happen.
you are right, the counsoling goes on today, it is part of hospice and other programs. but his bill includes “end of medical services” after the counsoling. they don’t kill you, they let you die. maybe they will give you some pain pills, but pretty much once you stop being a “productive member of society” you are cut off. it’s in there. this bill is a nightmare come to life.
CDA…our veterns have, arguably, the BEST healthcare in the world. Guess what…its ran by the federal government. Our politicians have, arguably, the BEST healthcare in the world. Guess what…its ran by the federal government. Why are these groups any different than you or I? more to the point, why do these groups recieved better coverage than you or I…AND WE PAY FOR IT!!!!
We’ve already got a form of government run healthcare; it’s called the VA hospital. No thanks. Let’s reform the system we have. Have you ever seen the government do anything efficiently?
“I want you to raise my taxes.” Now there is a definition of moron.
I heard on radio they only announced it after 5pm Tuesday evening - less than 24 hrs before the townhall.
So THAT’S why I didn’t hear about this until now...I live quite close to campus.
Awfully nice of you to volunteer for that after your income earning years are done, Jeff.
I bet he doesn’t donate a penny to charity.
They will take as much of our money as they can for it and deliver us the very least amount of services possible. And it will cost 10 times what they say it will.
Yes, WLW-Cincy mentioned on news last evening. Clearly Brown was afraid of the peasants.
Want to know a secret? Since O was elected, neither have I. My response is, “The Messiah has provided.”
Nothing is stopping tasbards like the guy you quoted from paying for someone else’s insurance.
I bet his charitable giving is somewhat less than 10%...
Why don't you just give them all your money and ask them to give you back just what you need to live comfortably.
We'll ask you again after they confiscate your 401(k) and convert it to Social Security.
-PJ
To wit, Limbaugh reminded his listeners that a senator can truthfully deny that such-and-such is in the bill -- even as someone at the town hall meeting reads the House bill aloud.
The Senate has its own multiple versions of a health care "reform" bill. Obviously those bills to not contain the same exact text of HR3200.
Thus the state controlled American media (SCAM) can also deny and they seem to delight in the confusion. They love to unload on the opponents with contempt and contumely.
It seems to me that the Senators involved are in fact deliberately sowing confusion and they and SCAM use the confusion as a weapon against opponents.
May your chains rest lightly, Mr. Davidson.
“It compared our system to the systems of the countries most like us (Germany,France, Canada,Japan) We pay more than twice as much in taxes and insurance premiums as they do yet the average life expectancy in all of those countries is at least 2 years longer. So if our system is so superior then why the difference????”
Michael Savage commented on this yesterday. None of those countries are paying for the healthcare for thousands of illegal aliens crossing their borders....they are comparing apples and oranges.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but there's nothing that says he can't pay extra. Let this fool put his money where his mouth is.
Hey, Idiot....there is NOTHING stopping you from paying more to the IRS.....do it.
The idiot, Jeff Davidson, 58, a RETIRED ACCOUNTANT.....hmmmm...is he retired from the GOVERNMENT?? 58 is young.
None of those countries is a defensive world superpower, either.
Easy to spend domestically when you can count on someone else to do the heavy lifting internationally.
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