Posted on 04/22/2009 7:12:17 AM PDT by AmericanHunter
When Texas Gov. Rick Perry floated the idea of secession if the federal government continues to pursue an aggressive tax-and-spend policy, the mainstream media, as well as the political establishment, cringed.
MSNBC’s Chris Matthews called talk of secession “whack-job stuff,” calling Mr. Perry a “bozo” and telling the Texas governor, “You don’t have a choice buddy.” Mr. Matthews’ colleague, Rachael Maddow, said Mr. Perry was “flirting to the point of adultery” by talking about secession, while commentator Thomas Frank reinforced the disconnect between the media and many Americans.
“What you’re seeing … what is one of the surprising things about these tea parties … surprising to people like you and me, is how mainstream extremism is in the Republican Party and the conservative movement,” Mr. Frank, author of Wrecking Crew: How Conservatives Rule, told Ms. Maddow.
But is the idea of secession a foreign concept to the American experience? Is talk of secession automatically treasonous? Is any secessionist movement doomed to be defined by the Civil War and exiled to the political wilderness?
“I think the biggest surprise to me was the outrage expressed by an individual who even thinks ... along these lines,” U.S. Rep. Ron Paul, R-Texas, said yesterday on CNN’s American Morning.
“Because I heard people say, well, ‘this was treason,’ they say, and ‘this was un-American.’ But don’t they remember how we came in to our being? We used secession. We seceded from England. So it’s a very good principle. It’s a principle of a free society. It’s a shame we don’t have it anymore.”
Dr. Paul, who ran a hard fought grassroots campaign for the Republican nomination in 2008, argued the principle of secession is one that protects the union rather than threatens it.
“I argue that if you have the principle of secession, our federal government wouldn’t be as intrusive into state affairs. And to me, that would be very good,” Dr. Paul said. “We as a nation have endorsed secession all along. I mean, think of all the secession of the countries and the Republicans from the Soviet system. We were delighted. We love it. And yet we get hysterical over this.”
Critics of the coverage of the secession comment argue the media is trying to paint the Republican Party as extreme. They say Mr. Perry was not advocating secession, but rather saying the federal government could cause its resurrection.
“We got a great union. There’s absolutely no reason to dissolve it. But if Washington continues to thumb their nose at the American people, you know, who knows what might come out of that?” Mr. Perry asked.
While the notion of secession was floated by Mr. Perry, he was not expressly advocating Texas leave the Union. Rather, the Texas governor used the idea in a manner Dr. Paul believes is historically accurate — to send a warning shot across the bow of a federal government that is encroaching on state’s rights and individual liberties.
Last week’s tea parties exposed a major rift in the country, and some are concerned the Obama administration does not understand the degree of dissent that is fomenting outside the Beltway. And despite panning by the political establishment, the majority of the nation viewed tea party dissent in a favorable light.
Fifty-one percent of Americans had a favorable view of the nationwide rallies, while 32 percent responded their view was very favorable, according to a poll released by Rasmussen Reports. A third of the nation had an unfavorable view with 15 percent unsure.
But among the nation’s “Political Class,” Rasmussen found just 13 percent held a favorable assessment and zero percent held a very favorable view of the nationwide protest. This disconnect, according to Dr. Paul, is a major part of the problem.
“People are angry. And if we don’t sense that, we don’t know it’s actually what’s going on there,” the Texas congressman said. Dr. Paul said the worst is yet to come because secession will achieve a greater legitimacy as the country struggles.
“When the dollar collapses and the federal government can’t fulfill any of its promises, what if they send you dollars and they don’t work,” Dr. Paul said. “People are just going to — they’re not going to have a violent cessation. They’re just going to ignore the federal government because they will be inept.”
In the case of Texas it would not, technically, be secession. They have a unique agreement, as an autonomous Republic, with the United States and can get out anytime they wish.
I don’t expect “experts” and talking head morons to know facts.
Ah, someone who reads the Constitution, DOI and BOR as they should be read... refreshing! ;-)
I think montana has a similar setup and agreement.
The ones I mentioned were due to the original poster... Dangerzone is living by the KENNEDY RULES OF LOGIC... “My Mind is made up... don’t try to confuse me with Facts”
Exactly, an interesting stat I saw the other day... The U.S. Military uses around 1 Billion rounds of ammunition in a year, training and combat... since last November American citizens have bought and horded well over 600 Million rounds of ammunition... gave me pause and then made me smile.
That, Sir, depnds on the particular state. Why we allow a man to become less free depending on what state he resides in concerns me.
When I think of the difference between my Sweet Home Alabama and Massachusetts, for example, I shudder at the thought of ever going North again.
Tyranny needs to be fought everywhere, and Liberty promoted as our National Religion.
gotcha
Could you quote that agreement please? Just curious.
That's why the "moving box" is listed as one of the boxes of liberty. It was viable, before all the onerous laws became federal. The left does this on purpose, so that you cannot escape.
Keep this in mind if you think they'll let seceding states go peacefully.
Do you think that if Texas decided to secede the Federal Government would have the will to try and stop it, especially since they would be fighting Texans which are some of the most most tough minded individuals in the U.S.
But if they did, would American military units engage fellow citizens in combat, I don't think so, But say they do, would the surrounding states and citizens just stand by... I don't think so.
Blacks make up less than 30% of all Alabamians. They can’t have Alabama.
The left would DEMAND that Texas be destroyed for attempting to get out from under their thumb. Zero’s of this mindset, guaranteed.
And look how he’s been acting on the left’s demands to prosecute Bush.
LOL, yep but I don't think Texans would take kindly to that. ;-)
“And you think they could actually defeat us on our soil and keep an occupation force here? And what’s to prevent seceding states from banding together to form a new union based on the original intent of the Constitution?”
The the one and only time this happened it had far reaching consequences that we are still feeling.
From a political economic sense, the Confederacy had not a snowballs chance in hell to survive even if it had not instigated open war. Why? Because even in the best of circumstances, any new government is weak until it can consolidate its governance, form policy and implement it, and establish a reliable revenue stream. In a more realistic sense, there are things like struggles for power, poor reactions to bad situations, conflicting opinions about what that governemnt should look like, with some going off angry and taking advantage of the weakness, etc... When a break up is ugly, it’s kind of like a messy divorce and when there’s 100’s of millions of people involved on both side of the messy divorce, there’s bound to be things happen that no one can forsee or control. That is exactly what happened to them, and war was the inevitable result when they were least ready to handle it.
It was also economically lopsided. One of the arguments for ending slavery was that it was far more economical to hire seasonal workers than it was to take care of slaves on an annual basis, and trouncing on the theories of the Declaration so they can sap the economy with their very bad habits was unjustified.
They had very little support from trading partners because they had no money, their economy was a mess from secession itself and they were fighting a war. This is an aside from other problems such as trade partners not wanting to be found on the wrong side and be punished for it later.
Political unrest of that magnitude makes terrible economic sense, more than likely even worse than than trying to deal with the mess we currently have if we did or said nothing about what our government is doing.
And then we have to worry about what happens if it fails, which it has a very large probability. The fall of the Confederacy started the first death convulsions of Federalism as it was known, and started us on that slippery slope to despotism by rule of law with each new crisis being an excuse to errode it even more. Perhaps at the end of it, what America looks like will be far worse than we could ever imagine.
free dixie,sw
BG Stand Watie was an AMAZING & (largely) SELF-taught leader who did a great deal for THE CAUSE, with almost nothing.(what little funds he had at the beginning of the WBTS was expended to mount/equip/feed his warriors.)
my ancestor was one of those who had LITTLE of material worth at the time of his enlistment, BUT he fought well/proudly/bravely for his family/honor/tribe/the CSA.
to give you some idea of just how LITTLE "the lads in gray rags" had, there is a letter from mid-war to his wife, that says that she should NOT fear for final victory AND that he was "over my sickness as is David", that they had TOGETHER received a half-cup of cornmeal & 4 ACORNS to eat, that day.
he also asked (in another note) if she could send him "some warm thing, that i might sleep dry" = he must NOT have had even one blanket.
i HONOR his memory & that of every other MARTYR/HERO/HEROINE of THE TRUE CAUSE!
free dixie,sw
Goodness!!!!
Thank you so much for sharing that. What a brave and honorable man!
I can see why you are proud.
free dixie,sw
don't you get tired of being laughed AT???
free dixie,sw
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