Results from nationwide poll (Overwhelming support for teaching both sides of Evolution debate)

Zogby International ^ | February 3, 2009

[GodGunsGuts]

Narrative Summary

4. Would you strongly agree, somewhat agree, somewhat disagree, or strongly disagree that teachers and students should have the academic freedom to discuss both the strengths and weaknesses of evolution as a scientific theory?

(Click excerpt link for responses)

5. Charles Darwin wrote that when considering the evidence for his theory of evolution, “…a fair result can be obtained only by fully stating and balancing the facts and arguments on both sides of each question.” Do you strongly agree, somewhat agree, somewhat disagree, or strongly disagree with Darwin’s statement?

(Click excerpt link for responses)

6. I am going to read you two statements about Biology teachers teaching Darwin’s theory of evolution. Please tell me which statement comes closest to your own point of view—Statement A or Statement B?

Statement A: Biology teachers should teach only Darwin’s theory of evolution and the scientific evidence that supports it.

Statement B: Biology teachers should teach Darwin’s theory of evolution, but also the scientific evidence against it.

(Click excerpt link for responses)

[allmendream]

GGG has made something of a cottage industry in sources that do not back his contentions.

[whattajoke]

We’re waiting.

Waiting for what? For me to teach you 150 years of biology in a blurb on FR? Sorry. Your game here is quite pathetic. "I can destroy evolution easily!" And then when asked to give ONE SINGLE EVIDENCE you shrink away and ask me to do what YOU claimed. Like a child.

Here's an oft-cited link to get you started. Of course, you'll have issue with that link. So just pick one issue you have and we'll go from there - since it's all so flimsy anyway.

[ColdWater]

GGG has made something of a cottage industry in sources that do not back his contentions.

Does he get paid by the thread or by the number of responses to his threads?

[Cedric]

Not acceptable.

[ColdWater]

Cedric: I’m not opposed to destroying the flimsy myth of evolution, first, if that’s where you want to start.

Other: Give us your one single best brightest undisputable evidence

Cedric: You go first.

Nice duck, dear Cedric. You said you would go first and you ducked the first challenge to you.

[tacticalogic]

Didn't the headline distort the results of the survey? I didn't see anything about teaching 'both sides'. I only saw that the surveyed wanted to teach the scientific evidence for and against evolution. That doesn't mean teach another side.

Depends on what you mean by "both sides". For and against the theory of evolution, or for some other theory, and against evolution. But you are correct that the questions asked in the survey and the results don't seem to support the conclusions that are being arrived at.

[whattajoke]

Does he get paid by the thread or by the number of responses to his threads?

I've wondered that. But ICR and AIG get nothing out of his parroting their articles. Articles written by dead guys, fake doctorate guys, and guys who cite fake sources - and that's just in the last 2 days!

[Marie2]

Yes, I know about references to the four corners, and to the sun rising and setting, none of which mean any more than I do when I use those phrases. If I say sunrise is at 6:28 am, that does not mean I am a flat earther. If I talk about visiting the four corners of the globe, it does not mean I am a flat earther. Jesus said He is the vine and we are the branches. That doesn’t mean Jesus is made of wood. You really need to read the whole Bible and be honest about it.

Today is Thursday, and that doesn’t mean I believe in the god Thor, either.

I think those skull represent various species, some of which may be extinct, and some of which may be primates with some sort of birth defect or abnormality or what have you. Just as in human beings, for instance, if we have dwarfism, the head is disproportionately large. The dwarf is not a missing link.

[Cedric]

Go get some real evidence.

And quit misquoting me, you charlatan.

[ColdWater]

Creation science presupposes these incidents to be true. So, Biology, Chemistry, Geology etc. are taught from these presuppositions.

How do you reconcile the pacific 'zebra stripes' (magnetic reversals) with the 6000 year old earth?

[Cedric]

if that’s where you want to start

A helpful hint for the reading impaired: The key word is "you."

[ColdWater]

Yes, I know about references to the four corners, and to the sun rising and setting, none of which mean any more than I do when I use those phrases.

So, as I understand the above, the words in the Bible mean no more than the words we speak similar phrases? Does this apply to all the phrases in the Bible?

[whattajoke]

Go get some real evidence.

My you are a quick reader! Please select ONE SINGLE SENTENCE/EVIDENCE in that link that is "fake."

And quit misquoting me, you charlatan.

I’m not opposed to destroying the flimsy myth of evolution, first, if that’s where you want to start.
I’m not opposed to destroying the flimsy myth of evolution, first, if that’s where you want to start.
I’m not opposed to destroying the flimsy myth of evolution, first, if that’s where you want to start.
I’m not opposed to destroying the flimsy myth of evolution, first, if that’s where you want to start.
I’m not opposed to destroying the flimsy myth of evolution, first, if that’s where you want to start.

[allmendream]

So how would one ever disabuse themselves of the notion that the earth doesn't move if one insists that their interpretation of scripture is superior to actual evidence of the universe?

Psalm 104:5 was often cited as one of the reasons it was ‘impossible’ for the Earth to move by Christian literalists.

What changed?

[Cedric]

Does he get paid by the thread or by the number of responses to his threads?

If he does, that means he has something akin to a job.

Hence, your jealousy.

[ColdWater]

>I’ve wondered that. But ICR and AIG get nothing out of his parroting their articles. <

ICR ...................................................

Tuition
Per quarter hour $150.00
Total cost for 54 quarter hours $8,100.00

Special Fees (Non-Refundable)
Textbooks and supplies (about $150/course) $1,800.00
Application Fee: Must be submitted before
application can be processed $30.00
Supplemental Laboratory or Field Trip costs
(may vary depending on course) $3,500.00
Processing Fee for Graduation $20.00
Transcript Fee (first transcript is free) $2.00

Estimated Cost for the Program $13,450.00

[whattajoke]

Yes, I know about references to the four corners, and to the sun rising and setting, none of which mean any more than I do when I use those phrases.

I agree 100%. Now if we can come to an understanding about the rest of the bible being symbolic and full of metaphors, we'll be getting somewhere.

I think those skull represent various species, some of which may be extinct, and some of which may be primates with some sort of birth defect or abnormality or what have you.

This is indeed interesting. I urge you to do some research into what evidences lie behind these skulls. I think you are insulting the research that has gone into these findings. They are certainly all "extinct." However, if you wish to pursue your ideas, there is some major grant money and possible awards in your future.

[Marie2]

Magnetic reversal is something I have not studied, so, for what it is worth to you, here is the short analysis from creationWiki

“It is believed that the unusual magnetic orientation pattern of sea floor rocks is due to repeated reversals of the Earth’s magnetic field when the rocks were cooling from molten material. According to this model, the magnetite grains in the magma (molten rock) will align themselves with the orientation of the Earth’s magnetic field while in a fluid state. When magma cools, the alignment of the magnetite grains is fixed, effectively recording the Earth’s magnetic orientation or polarity (normal or reversed) at the time of cooling.

If this interpretation of magnetic striping is correct, the striped pattern of sea floor rocks offers support for the theory of continental drift, which many creationists believe occurred as a result of catastrophic plate tectonics during the Biblical flood of Noah. Radiometric dating of sea floor rocks using potassium-argon dating method has also revealed a correlation between the distance of the rocks from the mid-oceanic ridge and the quantity of unstable isotopes in the sample.”

[ColdWater]

If he does, that means he has something akin to a job. Hence, your jealousy.

No jealousy. I have a real job. Not something 'akin' to a job. I design, build and operate nuclear power plants (with a little help from others). And if you really believe all the non-science that the YEC'rs spout you would be deadly afraid of nuclear power since all the physics' theories that allow us to safely operation nuclear power plants are totally trashed by the YEC crowd.

[Marie2]

“Now if we can come to an understanding about the rest of the bible being symbolic and full of metaphors, we’ll be getting somewhere.”

References to the four corners of the earth and sunrise and so forth are in poetic and prophetic books. References to six-day creation are in historical narratives right in there with the genealogies, the troop movements, and all the literal stuff. Further, references to six day creation are referred to as literal by Moses, Jesus, Paul, and others. They are never referred to as being metaphorical.

As for grant money to pursue an investigation of odd skulls whose DNA does not match our own, I doubt I could get a grant. Firstly, I am not a degreed scientist and doubt I ever will be. Secondly, those who believe God created the world don’t get grants from secular or governmental institutions. We are not politically correct.