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Four People Shot Outside Colorado Springs New Life Church
Fox News ^ | 09 DEC 07 | Fox News

Posted on 12/09/2007 12:49:26 PM PST by aomagrat

Edited on 12/09/2007 12:59:09 PM PST by Admin Moderator. [history]

[I waited 45 seconds and actually posted something substantial--Ed.]

COLORADO SPRINGS, Colo. — At least four people were shot outside of a Colorado Springs church on Sunday, but it was not immediately known whether the shootings were related to an earlier shooting about 70 miles away, authorities said.


TOPICS: Breaking News; US: Colorado
KEYWORDS: antichristian; assam; banglist; bombs; christian; christianpersecution; church; churchshooting; colorado; coloradosprings; enemedia; goldencompasskiller; hatecrime; hometown; ieds; newlifechurch; persecution; tedhaggard; thegoldencompass; wonderwoman
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To: Aliska

Good points . . .

maybe I should have said

RELATIVELY A LOT LESS vs RELATIVELY minor.

Thanks.


2,461 posted on 12/12/2007 9:11:01 AM PST by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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To: the808bass

presuppositions showing.

= = =

NAWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW.

That’s IMPOSSIBLE!

PRESUPPOSITIONS are UNscientific!

And . . . worshipping at the altar of the god of science . . . makes presuppositions entirely IMPOSSIBLE.

/sar


2,462 posted on 12/12/2007 9:12:28 AM PST by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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To: the808bass

I suspect those were the . . . outer edges.

And, those TO THE DEGREE HE DESCRIBED THEM

WOULD be ABUSIVE.

IF one trains a child and aids a child in making wise choices etc. . . . and shelters them in the process of preparing them for the world at large and gradually introduces them to the world at large . . . that’s different.


2,463 posted on 12/12/2007 9:14:05 AM PST by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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To: the808bass

That’s true.

And IF

IF
IF
IF

There was even “merely” emotional incestuousness as seems quite reasonably likely that there was that . . . he’d have had somewhat of a hard time offing her—depending on what mood he was in etc. He could have gotten in a space where it might have been easIER and maybe done it . . . but it had to be a lot easier to stab her in the heart with what he did. Besides . . . those hypocrite Christian leaders were such easy targets in a lot of psychodynamic respects.


2,464 posted on 12/12/2007 9:16:20 AM PST by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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To: GoLightly

When mom is too scary of a target, go after the thing(s) you believe made her the way she is. Project her faults on to her husband, her parents or.... her church.

= =

You are right. Quite right.


2,465 posted on 12/12/2007 9:17:07 AM PST by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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To: GoLightly

AYE AYE.

Thanks again.

Will redouble my efforts.


2,466 posted on 12/12/2007 9:17:51 AM PST by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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To: Girlene

Sorry it took so long to write ya back. I’ve read almost the entire left behind series, and saw the first movie. (I still have 3 books to read). I agree, if he was serious in all of those postings ....whatever was wrong with his mind, the story of the rapture made it worse. Especially if he indeed thought he could lose his salvation. Such a terrible terrible plight, and a tragic ending.


2,467 posted on 12/12/2007 10:16:40 AM PST by Freedom2specul8 (Please pray for our troops.... http://anyservicemember.navy.mil/)
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To: ~Kim4VRWC's~

I had similar fears and traumas in my teens over The Rapture etc.

Occasionally teens would joke about such thoughts and feelings. But it was rarely a joking matter, to me.


2,468 posted on 12/12/2007 10:18:32 AM PST by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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To: LibertyRocks
"...I have seen families who do take some of these things too far, IMHO..."

ME TOO!

"...run the risk of them completely disregarding those teachings when they have a chance to make their own choices ..."

That's the truth IMHO. I've not heard about 'the golden compass' ...but will need to check into it.

2,469 posted on 12/12/2007 10:22:13 AM PST by Freedom2specul8 (Please pray for our troops.... http://anyservicemember.navy.mil/)
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To: Quix

I finally got back online to read some more postings. Organized religion is walking a fine line between what man wants and what God wants IMHO. With all the denominations out there, and the different interpretations of the bible, one has to be VERY careful with regard to how one learns from the bible, how to utilize its teachings the way God wants us to etc.. I feel for those folks who are mixed up....too many denominations, and not enough true bible teaching. Would I desire one denomination, no...


2,470 posted on 12/12/2007 10:26:50 AM PST by Freedom2specul8 (Please pray for our troops.... http://anyservicemember.navy.mil/)
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To: Quix

I took comfort in the fact that salvation is forever, and knowing that sin will always happen, even as a Christian..that’s how I got through it. I realize that not everyone believes that way, but that’s how I interpreted it as a teen and now. After numerous bible studies, my interpretation has not wavered.


2,471 posted on 12/12/2007 10:29:51 AM PST by Freedom2specul8 (Please pray for our troops.... http://anyservicemember.navy.mil/)
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To: Quix

By the way, I’m not suggesting that by not losing one’s salvation, one has a free ride to do whatever they want. :-p That’s another aspect of one’s relationship with the Lord...a lot of facets, etc..


2,472 posted on 12/12/2007 10:31:59 AM PST by Freedom2specul8 (Please pray for our troops.... http://anyservicemember.navy.mil/)
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To: ~Kim4VRWC's~

An interesting point.

Each individual is responsible for taking The Bible and working out their own Salvation with God in awe and caution . . . or in fear and trembling as the KJV puts it.


2,473 posted on 12/12/2007 10:37:06 AM PST by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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To: ~Kim4VRWC's~

I appreciate your perspective.

Armenians have different struggles.

I finallllllllllly came to the conclusion that frowning when the Rapture occurred would not send one to hell.


2,474 posted on 12/12/2007 10:39:51 AM PST by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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To: ~Kim4VRWC's~

I understand . . . though my Calvinist boss used to tell about Calvinists who went to their preacher and asked him to soft peddle such things when speaking to the teens and all their raging hormones. LOL.


2,475 posted on 12/12/2007 10:41:08 AM PST by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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To: Quix

That’s funny...I would have to ask those folks...”Ah, but what about adults (both male and female) with raging hormones”. LOL Menopause is an example of needing the Lord very much. Free will, predestination vs menopause.... That could make an interesting discussion. :D


2,476 posted on 12/12/2007 10:52:44 AM PST by Freedom2specul8 (Please pray for our troops.... http://anyservicemember.navy.mil/)
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To: Quix
In other words, I do NOT believe that 100% of his assertions about his mom are 100% false.

Neither do I. On the other hand, I see little in his accusations that would make me think she was a bad mother. Banning of violent video games and offensive music lyrics in the home does not equal child abuse.

Have you ever raised teens in a toxic culture (such as America in the last 10 years)? I am in the middle of that process myself.

It seems inescapable . . . that there must have been SOME level of craziness . . . and quite likely a great lot of it

Do you have anything to back up this assertion? You are welcome to post it. And no, I will not consider "had a Pentecostal mother" as definitive proof of parental "craziness" as you put it.

2,477 posted on 12/12/2007 11:35:41 AM PST by CardCarryingMember.VastRightWC
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To: ~Kim4VRWC's~

Welllll given mother’s 20+ years of menopause . . . I’d best keep my trap shut. LOL.


2,478 posted on 12/12/2007 11:44:13 AM PST by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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To: Quix
on the other hand .... he did not spring forth from the womb like that.

Given the genetic component of many mental conditions, you do not know what was nature and what was nurture.

Lots of conditioning etc. went into exacerbating whatever human evils lurked in his soul.

Yes, I do believe that listening to depressing, suicidal lyrics, when combined with the genetic markers for clinical depression or other mental illnesses, can do that to you.

But again, I see no evidence as of yet that the parents were significant "exacerbators" of evil. From the perp's own unstable rantings, it appears to me his mother was a strong influence in the opposite direction, in that she tried to remove these violent videogames and Death Rock music and so on, from the house.

And . . . sadly . . . some very good, very well intentioned Christians . . . didn’t do all they might have done. And, no doubt, some of them did dreadfully in handling him.

I don't mean any offense here, but this really takes the cake! You don't know how hard any of these people tried! You don't know who behaved "dreadfully"! There is plenty in Matthew "Marilyn Manson" Murray's own words that shows many people have long tried to help him. What gives you the right to make such highly critical, sweeping accusations towards a large group of people?

2,479 posted on 12/12/2007 11:51:33 AM PST by CardCarryingMember.VastRightWC
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To: CardCarryingMember.VastRightWC

No, you may take some glee in the fact that I’ve only helped others raise their kids better. I’ve lived in homes where I shared nurturing and discipline duties of kids of various ages. But I was very careful to avoid having my own as I’ve stated many times hereon.

It does not sound like you have read much of his postings, rantings etc. He had a LOT to say about his home life with mommy dearest. I don’t believe 100% of it was exaggeration.

again . . . EVEN 10% OF WHAT HE WROTE would be plenty evidence of seriouis emotional and likely far worse abuse.

Several lines SEEM FAIRLY BRAZENLY but cryptically to be writing about seductive physical contact that SOUNDS LIKE went well beyond petting. I reread those lines several times to be sure I wasn’t misconstruing things.

It would not be the first time an isolated mother/wife of a detached workaholic hubby [conjecture, hypothesis from limited available evidence] got wrapped up inappropriately with youngest son . . . by a long shot.

IT also SEEMS LIKE her obsessiveness was focused on him as opposed to her other kids—also very common.

It also SEEMS LIKE her censoring of his music etc. was way off the scale. It wasn’t merely guidance with fitting consequences—it was EVIDENTLY CONSTANTLY SEARCHING THROUGH ALL his stuff with great distress and punishment when any contraband was found—EVIDENTLY FOR YEARS.

On top of that—it sounds like pastors were routinely brought into the home—perhaps after such repeated mom/son confrontations—to try and coerce, persuade, demand from lofty spiritual heights that he shape up.

I do not think he would necessarily have been an easy child to raise for anyone.

But he did NOT come out of the womb as mangled as his postings clearly show he was.


2,480 posted on 12/12/2007 11:52:51 AM PST by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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