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Keep Darwin's 'lies' out of Polish schools: education official
AFP via Yahoo! News ^ | October 14, 2006

Posted on 10/14/2006 11:16:50 AM PDT by lizol

Keep Darwin's 'lies' out of Polish schools: education official 2 hours.

WARSAW (AFP) - Poland's deputy education minister called for the influential evolutionary theories of Charles Darwin not to be taught in the country's schools, branding them "lies."

"The theory of evolution is a lie, an error that we have legalised as a common truth," Miroslaw Orzechowski, the deputy minister in the country's right-wing coalition government, was quoted as saying by the Gazeta Wyborcza daily Saturday.

Orzechowski said the theory was "a feeble idea of an aged non-believer," who had come up with it "perhaps because he was a vegetarian and lacked fire inside him."

The evolution theory of the 19th-century British naturalist holds that existing animals and plants are the result of natural selection which eliminated inferior species gradually over time. This conflicts with the "creationist" theory that God created all life on the planet in a finite number.

Orzechowski called for a debate on whether Darwin's theory should be taught in schools.

"We should not teach lies, just as we should not teach bad instead of good, or ugliness instead of beauty," he said. "We are not going to withdraw (Darwin's theory) from the school books, but we should start to discuss it."

The deputy minister is a member of a Catholic far-right political group, the League of Polish Families. The league's head, Roman Giertych, is education minister in the conservative coalition government of Prime Minister Jaroslaw Kaczynski.

Giertych's father Maciej, who represents the league in the European Parliament, organised a discussion there last week on Darwinism. He described the theory as "not supported by proof" and called for it be removed from school books.

The far-right joined the government in May when Kaczynski's ruling conservative Law and Justice (PiS) party, after months of ineffective minority government, formed a coalition including LPR and the populist Sambroon party.

Roman Giertych has not spoken out on Darwinism, but the far-right politician's stance on other issues has stirred protest in Poland since he joined the government.

A school pupils' association was expected to demonstrate in front of the education ministry on Saturday to call for his resignation.


TOPICS: Foreign Affairs; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: creationism; crevolist; darwin; education; enoughalready; evolution; faith; keywordwars; moralabsolutes; poland; preacher; religion; seethingnaturalists; skullporn
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To: Elsie
...Peter's school of surf ...

Chuckle...

Perhaps worth one more chuckle....
Now lay me down to sleep,
to dream of skiing on bare-feet.
Faster than a shooting star,
I swing out on the footing bar.
Skimming across the glass I burn,
to execute a tumble turn.
Now on one foot, I fail to note,
the approaching wake of a fishing boat.
....
.... needs line here describing crash @ 38-40 mph...
....
With water spurting up my nose,
I remember how the story goes.
To barefoot is so very nice,
but all who try must pay the price.


I don't have a source, it was from memory...memorized from a similar poem published in water ski magazine a number of years ago....
1,041 posted on 10/20/2006 11:48:47 AM PDT by FreedomProtector
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To: SoldierDad

The May 19 issue of Molecular Cell.


1,042 posted on 10/20/2006 11:56:32 AM PDT by js1138 (The absolute seriousness of someone who is terminally deluded.)
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To: FreedomProtector
Thanks for the picture! It brings back some great memories.

I've been there too. That's why I posted that pic. It's a beautiful place.

On probability, it's a bit more confusing than you may think. For example, are you stating the argument that us being here today is highly improbable?

1,043 posted on 10/20/2006 12:02:14 PM PDT by antiRepublicrat
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To: FreedomProtector
but he never disproves it or provides a mathematical proof that invalidates it

He admits that he is not a mathematician, as honest academics do. Sewell tried to apply his discipline to other disciplines.

I really dislike the 747/junkyard analogy or Sewell's computers/scrap metal analogy. The natural universe as it exists lends itself to the creation of certain forms through natural processes, some of which appear very ordered, such as snowflakes, spheres and cells, and some which don't, such as turbulence in fluid dynamics. But as it exists, it does not naturally result in 747s or computers. That might be so in some freaky alternate universe, but not this one. The analogies just fall apart.

1,044 posted on 10/20/2006 12:45:42 PM PDT by antiRepublicrat
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To: js1138

Great. Do you have a title, author, page number?


1,045 posted on 10/20/2006 1:08:03 PM PDT by SoldierDad (Proud Father of a 10th Mountain Division 2nd BCT Soldier fighting in Mahmudiyah)
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To: SoldierDad

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science?_ob=ArticleURL&_udi=B6WSR-4K06CJR-6&_coverDate=05%2F19%2F2006&_alid=471771755&_rdoc=1&_fmt=&_orig=search&_qd=1&_cdi=7053&_sort=d&view=c&_acct=C000050221&_version=1&_urlVersion=0&_userid=10&md5=0b1b8df0d42e0400eeb4554159a8dfff


1,046 posted on 10/20/2006 1:20:11 PM PDT by js1138 (The absolute seriousness of someone who is terminally deluded.)
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To: Dimensio

Dimensio, I don't give a crap whether you believe it or not. I'm not on my way out. I just don't recall details. By bye.


1,047 posted on 10/20/2006 1:45:46 PM PDT by Marysecretary (Thank you, Lord, for FOUR MORE YEARS!!!)
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To: FreedomProtector
I appreciate your efforts in adding material to the discussion. I will try to use last edition if I quote Colin Patterson from now on....

As long as you pledge to include this part of Patterson's quote:

In terms of mechanism, or causes of evolutionary change, the neutral theory of molecular evolution is a scientific theory; it can be put in law-like form: changes in DNA that are less likely to be subject to natural selection occur more rapidly. This law is tested every time homologous DNA sequences are compared, and explains observations (summarized in Chapters 9 and 10) that are otherwise inexplicable. But neutral theory assumes (or includes) truth of the general theory - common ancestry or Darwin's 'descent with modification' - and 'misprints' shared between species, like the psuedogenes or reversed Alu sequences are (to me) incontrovertible evidence of common descent. I see the general historical theory, common descent, as being as firmly established as just about anything else in history.

1,048 posted on 10/20/2006 2:23:04 PM PDT by jennyp (There's ALWAYS time for jibber jabber!)
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To: jennyp
Look out for the flying pigs placemarker.
1,049 posted on 10/20/2006 2:39:36 PM PDT by VadeRetro (A systematic investigation of nature does not negotiate with crackpots.)
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"Given sufficient thrust, pigs fly just fine. ..." placemark


1,050 posted on 10/20/2006 2:45:55 PM PDT by dread78645 (Evolution. A doomed theory since 1859.)
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To: lizol
1,051? Dude, this thread is ee-volving! Modern science at work!
1,051 posted on 10/20/2006 2:52:35 PM PDT by Revolting cat! (We all need someone we can bleed on...)
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To: js1138

Thanks. I will look forward to researching this more in depth the next chance I have of obtaining the journal article. From the summary, though, I would suggests this is not really a measure of an organism's "evolution", but of it's short-term adaptability to a controlled change in it's environment. It will be interesting to read whether they demonstrated any long term changes, or if the organism reverted back after the environment equalized back to normal.


1,052 posted on 10/20/2006 2:55:31 PM PDT by SoldierDad (Proud Father of a 10th Mountain Division 2nd BCT Soldier fighting in Mahmudiyah)
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To: Elsie
Matthew 20:16
So the last will be first, and the first will be last.

But who will be the 999th?
1,053 posted on 10/20/2006 3:17:38 PM PDT by flipper999 (vote early, vote often, vote republican even if it hurts.)
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To: Revolting cat!

This is my biggest thread so far, I think :-)))


1,054 posted on 10/20/2006 3:56:12 PM PDT by lizol (Liberal - a man with his mind open ... at both ends)
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To: SoldierDad

What on earth do you think evolution is?

This is what evolution is. There is no other definition used by biologists.


1,055 posted on 10/20/2006 4:50:47 PM PDT by js1138 (The absolute seriousness of someone who is terminally deluded.)
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"Quote-mining the bible" placemark


1,056 posted on 10/20/2006 6:46:07 PM PDT by dread78645 (Evolution. A doomed theory since 1859.)
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To: js1138

Oh, I see. Then it is not about one animal species morphing into some other previoulsy never existing animal species. It is just about an animal species making changes to the environment so that they can continue to live in that environment. Sort of like when a dog's coat changes when the season changes from either hot or cold. I get it now.


1,057 posted on 10/20/2006 8:24:52 PM PDT by SoldierDad (Proud Father of a 10th Mountain Division 2nd BCT Soldier fighting in Mahmudiyah)
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To: Marysecretary
Dimensio, I don't give a crap whether you believe it or not.

If you are unwilling to give important and significant details regarding an alleged occurence, then why do you expect to have any credibility when making statements?

I'm not on my way out.

As I never suggested that you were "on your way out", this reply is a non-sequitur.

I just don't recall details

How is it that you are able to recall that an acquaintence of yours taught creationism in a public school, but you are unable to state whether he taught Norse creationism, Genesis creationism, Hindu creationism or the creation story of another religion? If you do not know what variant of creationism was taught, how do you know that creationism was taught at all?
1,058 posted on 10/21/2006 12:03:55 AM PDT by Dimensio (http://angryflower.com/bobsqu.gif <-- required reading before you use your next apostrophe!)
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To: SoldierDad
Oh, I see. Then it is not about one animal species morphing into some other previoulsy never existing animal species. It is just about an animal species making changes to the environment so that they can continue to live in that environment.

Yes, it's about changes in the population over generations.

Sort of like when a dog's coat changes when the season changes from either hot or cold. I get it now.

No, it's not about that at all.

1,059 posted on 10/21/2006 5:17:16 AM PDT by js1138 (The absolute seriousness of someone who is terminally deluded.)
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To: Dimensio; Fester Chugabrew
If you cannot explain this, then your claim that chaos is a falsification criteria is a lie

That is false, your assertions unsubstantiated, your claims (whatever they may be dimesnio) are worthless.

For all that is demonstrated by you here in your post (and all that you ever demonstrate) is that you reject all explanations that do not conform to your core beliefs. The only place that extrapolates into a belief that Fester or anyone else you declare a liar (as you do on a regular basi) is is in that tight circular little mass of neurons and bio-chemical processes, and the very few who share the results of such a distorted and twisted belief-logic system.

In other words its all in your head.

W.
1,060 posted on 10/21/2006 6:46:56 AM PDT by RunningWolf (2-1 Cav 1975)
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