Posted on 12/15/2005 6:57:56 PM PST by freedom44
CHICAGO (Reuters) - U.S. Jewish leaders say they are increasingly worried that Christian conservatives want to turn America politically and culturally into a country that tolerates only their brand of Christianity.
"There is a feeling on all sides that something is changing," said Abraham Foxman, director of the New York-based Anti-Defamation League.
"The polls indicate a very serious thing -- that over 60 percent of the American people feel that religion and Christianity are under attack," he said on Thursday in an interview.
"Some are saying we are attacking (Christianity). This whole movement is not anti-Semitic or motivated by anti-Semitism. But sometimes unintended consequences are much more serious than intended" he added.
Foxman recently arranged a meeting in New York involving six Jewish organizations to discuss the problem. He said that while participants did not agree on the exact level of the problem, they felt a strategy was needed.
"It's not a war room strategy," he added. "It's to understand what's out there."
He said Jews are a people of faith but are opposed to anyone who would say only they know the truth and want to impose it on everyone else.
While every December brings disputes over what to call the "holiday season" and its trappings, the level of lobbying by those who fear Christmas is becoming something generic has been particularly high this year.
But the issues raised by Foxman and others goes much deeper into American society, ranging from challenges to teaching evolution to bans on abortion and same-sex marriage or deciding
what kind of people who should serve on the U.S. Supreme Court.
"Every room (from bedroom to classroom) in the American mansion is under assault to impose either de facto or de jure a Christian theocracy -- I call them Christocrats," said Rabbi James Rudin, former head of interreligious activities for the American Jewish Committee.
"They are people who believe there should be a legally mandated Christian nation, where the concept of separation of church and state is weakened or abandoned," he added.
Rudin said he has met pastors "who say that Jesus Christ is the ultimate leader of America and that God's law trumps the Constitution ... I'm very concerned."
While far from all evangelical Christians hold those views, he said, the influence of those who do is strong.
Rudin, whose book "The Baptizing of America: The Religious Right's Plans for the Rest of Us" will be published in January by Avalon, said those with a theocratic agenda are not anti-Semites, and in fact some of them are among the strongest supporters of the state of Israel.
But he said they are Christians who see secular humanists and globalists as their enemies and who feel they are being attacked.
Mathew (cq) Staver, general counsel of the Florida-based Liberty Counsel, a group which backs conservative Christian causes in court and which has been particularly active in Christmas-related issues, says "there is absolutely no effort that I'm aware of to theocratize America or put down other faiths to expand Christianity."
He credits the increased activity surrounding Christmas issues this year to three years of building an organization over the matter.
"People have said enough is enough," he said, citing such incidents as naming Boston's Christmas tree a "holiday tree" and the publication of a sales catalog by a major retailer which featured Kwanza and Hanukkah gifts but made no mention of Christmas.
President George W. Bush, who describes himself as a born-again Christian, also faced criticism recently for sending out cards wishing people a happy "holiday" season.
"This clearly demonstrates that the Bush administration has suffered a loss of will and that they have capitulated to the worst elements in our culture," William A. Donohue, president of the Catholic League for Religious and Civil Rights told the Washington Post.
I'm Jewish and I don't feel threatened.
Thank you for your answer. This world just gets too confusing for me at times. Alice in Wonderland - what should be isn't and what isn't should be. Ah well.
Sounds good.
So, which Creation story do we teach in schools?
Christian?
Norse?
Wiccan?
Hindu?
Native American?
Every culture has their own creation story- not just Christians and Jews.
"And Odin and his brothers slew their father, the frost giant Ymir. And they made the oceans from his blood, the earth from his flesh, the forests from his hair, the mountains from his bones, and the vault of the sky from his skull."
-from a version of the Norse creation myth
IMHO God didn't try to explain the workings of the universe and billions of years of history to bronze age sheep herders, any more than I'd try explaining macroeconomics to a five year old.
God created heaven and earth. And now that we humans are a bit older, he's letting us have glimpses into how he went about it.
What you said. Ditto. What idiots. ;-(
Evolution, specifically the common ancestry of primates such as humans and chimps has been proved beyond any reasonable doubt by identical ERV virus sequences found in several species. These demonstrate that a specific individual was infected with a faulty ERV virus DNA sequence millions of years ago that was spread to the entire species which then evolved into other species. Several thousand of these sequences have been found in the last few years, and since these viruses very rarely end up being inherited, and are inserted randomly into each cell's DNA strands during normal infections, such identical insertions in two separate species is against any reasonable odds.
You're correct that the Torah contains Genesis verses as well, but most Jews aren't taught that these are literally true, as Christian fundamentalists are.
By the way. A scientific "theory" does not mean "guess", as you have used above. A scientific "theory" is the end game in science, it doesn't get any higher than that. Theories do not become facts when they become more accepted, they are supported by facts. Scientific theories describe how things operate, and can be used to predict what will be found. They can, however, be falsified, if the predictions are invalid, and evolution has never been falsified in the 150 years that various religious groups have tried to do so.
Evolution theory (how evolution, the "fact", occurs) is quite a bit more well understood than gravity theory (how gravity, the "fact", occurs).
By the way, don't forget that our landmark Iraq election is soon to be followed by a Palestinian election in January. It looks to me as if Bush/Rice are moving that roadmap right along. Since they have no oil there, it must just be to get votes and make the dems mad, don't you think?
Thanks Mike10542!
I am a born again conservative evangelical Christian, and have attended conservative Baptist churches nearly my entire life. The Bible is clear that the Jewish nation are God's chosen people and that the Jewish people are being regathered in the nation of Israel in preparation for the end times. The Bible is also clear that those who persecute the children of Israel fall under the curse of God.
Having said this, I fail to understand how any Jewish person can vote for Democrats, liberals & left-wingers who are openly hostile to the nation of Israel and who openly side with Islamic & Palestinian terrorists. Of course on the other hand I fail to understand how any person of any race or religion can vote for Democrats, unless of course they are simply blinded by sheer hatred for America and the Judeo-Christian set of values and principles.
...as there are, also, many muslim sites multiplying all over the internet. A lot of them affiliate with Indymedia (Soros funded) or share a general statement with same (anti conservative, anti Christian, pro Palestine, anti Israel, pro Liberalism on all issues imaginable).
Not delving into Foxman's biography, I shall simply accept your statements. I am sure they are accurate. So many dame socialistic factions in this country and elsewhere it is hard to know all.
Rudin/Foxman hold their liberal politics above their own, and everyone else's religion.
They can worship false political idols all they want, stupid sh!ts.
Jews thrive in America BECAUSE we are a primarily protestant Christian nation - many of those fundamentalist.
He should worship his religion in his way (because he CAN), and stop trying to screw with the way other people worship their religion.
He's a bigoted, intolerant, uncompassionate maggot - not that I have an opinion.
And, also, Abe Foxman and the Jewish Anti-Defamation League have done more to harass and dishonestly demean many people -- and, thus, harm the Jewish people by public opinion response -- than any "fundamentalist" among Christians and/or conservatives I've ever heard, know about.
The ADL has long since veered off into real terrorism itself and seems to be being used by Foxman for that purpose alone.
Doesn't the Rabbi realize that Christians and Jews worship the game God?
Wouldn't God's law trump the Constitution for him, too?
and one other thing...... I notice this statement:
"He said Jews are a people of faith but are opposed to anyone who would say only they know the truth and want to impose it on everyone else"
Yes, it's nice to know that his true religion, liberalism, is to him the One True Path, and therefore must be imposed on everyone, to save their souls. He needs to have his nose rubbed into this steaming pile of an ideology.
How little faith he places in his own faith.
I don't wish to hijack the thread when here are plenty of Creation/ID/Evolution threads available for discussion. Most Orthodox Jews reject strict evolutionary theory - in particular the very beginning of things (big bang vs. Genesis 1:1-2). As a scientist by profession, I reject a great deal of evolutionist theory - only because far too many pieces are missing. Creation support requires faith and belief in what cannot be scientifically proven by humans, which are lesser beings than God. We know only that which we are permitted to find out. And our adversary clearly has the power to distort us by placing at our disposal false images - which leads to false teachings, skepticism, and falling away from that which is Truth.... the goal of the adversary achieved. Furthermore, as a scientist, I agree with some variants of evolutionary theory but I pass these off as forced adaptations - due to climate changes, environmental changes, what have you as we migrated across the continents. That whole common ancestry thing is bunk in that we have yet to find evidence of the actual being. But, believe what you will. I maintain that the ADL is not using this as any means to say what the article says. It is more of a defensive reaction to Christians defending Christmas, the Narnia movie, and perhaps the Passion movie as well. The ADL often looks at the right wing of the country and ignores the Islamic cultists who openly preach Israel's destruction and the genocide of all Jews.
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