De-homosexualization of the Catholic Church

WorldNet Daily ^ | 5/2/2005

[worldclass]

Noting that in his Good Friday homily soon-to-be pope Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger condemned the "filth there is in the church," Wheeler believes the pontiff "will not tolerate [homosexuality's] presence in his church."

[netmilsmom]

Thanks Lady!

[sitetest]

Dear xsmommy,

" i am right and you are wrong."

Hmm... I was just trying to correct a misimpression. Sorry it's down to "i am right and you are wrong," for you.

If you want to have an argument about what is the "DC area," we can always refer to the Census Bureau definition of the Washington metro area. They include pretty much nearly all of the Archdiocese of Washington, and most of the Diocese of Arlington.

Nowadays, folks commute downtown from Frederick, MD as well as Fredericksburg, VA.

By the actual, objective definition of "the DC area," your statement is false. Only a minority of parishes in the Washington metro area have Spanish-language Masses.

But I don't want to argue about the definition of the "DC area," even though that would properly include everything from Frederick to Mannassas. There are also any number of close-in parishes without Spanish-language Masses. Places like Bowie are within 10 miles of DC. Places like College Park and Hyattsville are well within the Beltway.

There are also parishes in Silver Spring, Bethesda, Derwood, and other places that don't have Spanish-language Masses. Each of these communities actually border Washington, DC, proper. Is bordering on the actual city of Washington close enough to the be the DC area?

There are also parishes INSIDE Washington, DC without any Spanish-language Masses. Here are a few:

Annunciation
Epiphany
Holy Redeemer
Holy Rosary
Holy Trinity
Immaculate Conception
Nativity
Our Lady of Victory
St. Aloysius
St. Ann

Is being inside the city of Washington acceptable to your definition of "the DC area"?

"The hispanics live closer to DC, so the parishes in the DC area, in both the Washington and Arlington dioceses, DO have spanish masses. it is just common sense."

Interestingly, this may be common sense, but it doesn't actually fit all the data. There are some number of close-in parishes with Spanish-language Masses, but there are also parishes well beyond the Beltway with Spanish-language Masses, as well.

There are parishes with Spanish-language Masses in Lexington Park (near Waldorf - about an hour from Washington), Germantown, MD (above Rockville), Prince Frederick (county seat of Calvert County - well over an hour from Washington), Clinton, MD (southern Maryland, nearly an hour from Washington), Gaithersburg (above Rockville), and Olney (closer to Howard County than to Washington).

If we're going to break up the Washington metropolitan region into "the DC area," and "not the DC area" based on how close-in a community may be, the above-mentioned communities fall into "not the DC area."

Actually, there are about 38 parishes INSIDE the city of Washington, but I count only 7 of them having Spanish-language Masses. In other words, the percentage of Spanish-language Masses INSIDE the city of Washington is about the same as the surrounding Maryland suburbs - around 20%.

I'll repeat. There are a large number of parishes in the Washington metropolitan area that have Spanish-language Masses. Fully 20% of parishes in the Archdiocese of Washington, and about 40% of the parishes in the Diocese of Arlington have Spanish-language Masses. It may actually seem like every parish has a Spanish-language Mass.

There are parishes with Spanish-language Masses in the city of Washington, the close-in suburbs, and the farther-out suburbs. There are parishes WITHOUT Spanish-language Masses in the city of Washington, the close-in suburbs, and the farther-out suburbs.

Thus, however one may reasonably define "the DC area," far fewer than half of "DC area" parishes have Spanish-language Masses, and your original statement is entirely false:

"...every church in the DC area has at least one spanish mass, usually two."

Not by any stretch.


sitetest

[xsmommy]

it clearly is very important for you to prevail here. there is no misimpression. the DC area closest to the city, which includes parishes in both the Arlington and Washington dioceses, where the majority hispanic population live, has spanish masses. you are entitled to whatever legalistic interpretation of what constitutes the DC metro area, and what percentage of churches there offer spanish masses. the point is, the DC area has a decent sized spanish population and the churches in those areas where they live offer masses in spanish.

[AnAmericanMother]

Even after having been corrected on other threads, you continue to spread misinformation and outright lies about the Catholic Church.

It's obvious that you have no intention of changing your misinformed opinion even when confronted with the truth. It's impossible to have a rational discussion with somebody who says, "My mind is made up - don't confuse me with the facts."

So please go away and bother somebody else.

[Judica me]

Until then, please do not post to me again.

It's a public board. If you don't want people to respond to your posts, then don't post.

By the way, your answer confirms what I was saying...the Church Militant needs more warriors.

[Mershon]

Again, you are counting infant baptisms in the total. You are not comparing apples to apples, and I have already called you on this once.

Of course the numbers of the Church, in total, have grown, because Catholic parents keep baptizing their children.

We are talking specifically about converts here.

[Mershon]

Latin is the language of the Roman Catholic Church. It is fixed and stable, just as is its dogma--just as its liturgy used to be.

[AnAmericanMother]

Just a local observation -- our parish is booming. We have OCIA twice a year, and the Easter Vigil "class" was almost 75 new converts. In addition, there are converts who don't go through OCIA because they are moving in from "high" ECUSA churches that have been stamped on (or out) by the heretical bishop here (that is our situation).

Of course, our parish is highly orthodox, no nonsense and plenty of sound doctrine . . .

[netmilsmom]

>>I don't know about you guys, but I would like to see relationships between "deep" Catholics improve, with more focus on objectives and commonalities and less on differences. "Deep" Catholics is a coin I phrased to describe well catechized Catholics who undertand and love the true faith<<

I would just like to tell you that I borrowed the phrase "Deep Catholic" and posted it on Catholic Answers.

People don't like the words "Conservative" or "orthodox" to describe parishes that have EWTN type Holy Masses. "Deep Catholic" is perfect, IMHO!

[sitetest]

Dear xsmommy,

"it clearly is very important for you to prevail here. there is no misimpression."

I think that this is what is called "projection."

I'm not the one who said, "i am right and you are wrong." * chuckle *

You stated something that was quite untrue. So that folks reading this thread don't come to a misimpression of the Washington region, or the Catholic Church in the Washington region, I offered the information that there are many parishes within the Washington, DC area that do not offer Spanish-language Masses.

But, to continue to defend that xsmommy is right and sitetest is wrong, you chose to defy the actual data, to deny reality. Talk about a need to be right.

Now you call the actual definition of the Washington area "legalistic." LOL. I gave you your choice of definitions of "the DC area," including INSIDE the city of Washington, DC, itself.

The only way that you can continue to assert "i am right and you are wrong," is to create the "xsmommy definition of the DC area," which is, "all the parishes in the Archdiocese of Washington and the Diocese of Arlington that have Spanish-language Masses." That's the ticket! LOL.

"the DC area closest to the city, which includes parishes in both the Arlington and Washington dioceses, where the majority hispanic population live, has spanish masses."

Certainly the DC area has Spanish-language Masses. If you had bothered to read my posts, the numbers are actually cited. A significant minority of parishes in the area, however one might define it, have Spanish-language Masses.

But that isn't what you said, now is it? And that isn't the statement that I corrected, is it? What you said, and what I responded to, was:

"...every church in the DC area has at least one spanish mass, usually two."

That isn't true. Not by half.


sitetest

[sitetest]

Dear Judica me,

Perhaps the fact that you haven't been here long is why you may be unaware of common courtesies observed here. One is that if a poster asks another poster not to post to him, the other poster will refrain from doing so.

I asked you not to post to me. I will appreciate your refraining from posting to me in the future.

Thank you.


sitetest

[BlackElk]

What has to stop (and will) is the adulation directed at dead and excommunicated Marcel by his schismatic sycophants by trashing the pope who rightfully excommunicated him and declared the SSPX in schism. Don't let the door, etc.

If you don't think that John Paul II was John Paul the Great, no one is going to make you recognize reality.

It is a strange thing to continually recognize how little resentment is directed at WW I Pope Benedict XV by those who take Pope St. Pius X's name in vain. It was Benedeict XV (the former Cardinal Della Chiesa) who promptly cancelled the anti-Modernist programs and loyalty oaths of Pope St. Pius X and they have never been restored by any subsequent pope. Whatever you use to opportunistically attack Pope John Paul the Great is the result of eight decades of underground Modernism courtesy of Della Chiesa who also persecuted the saintly Merry Cardinal Del Valle, Pius X's Secretary of State. You guys are Johnny Come Latelys to the task of resisting Modernism and you choose your targets poorly.

Albino Cardinal Luciani who became John Paul I implemented "novelties??????" Name three.

Finally, I trust in the promises of Jesus Christ. He will be with the Church He founded until the end----His Church, the Catholic Church, not some upstart schismatic offshoot. Whatever Christ's plan may be, it just has to be better than yours or mine.

[Mershon]

"Of course, our parish is highly orthodox, no nonsense and plenty of sound doctrine"

And we have a couple similar where I live, however, if it is Novus Ordo, it cannot be "highly orthodox."

The reasons being are three:

+Communion in the hand, the cause of dropping Christ on the ground and being trampeled underfoot. This is sacrilege.

+ Communion under both species, with the fact the precious blood is spilled at times, thus causing sacrilege.

+Extraordinary ministers of Holy Communion (used ordinarily) and altar girls.

[NormalGuy]

Awesome...people still think the scandal in the church is mainly one of pedophilia when the reality is homosexuality was the primary culprit.

I'm still amazed at the selective view of sin. Yes, there is homosexuality and pedophilia. There is also heterosexual activity outside of marriage and religious vows.

My first recollection in the '60's of the issue is an old Italian lady saying if a priest with a political activist

At least he's not doing it with the altar boy like the others

Since the '60's most Catholics have known the facts and lied to themselves and others about the facts. Those who admit the facts are selective in who and what they condemn and how seriously they condemn it.

Any day now, I expect to hear conservative Catholics say of a relationship between Jesus and Mary Magdalene "At least he wasn't doing it with the Apostles, or with the children, or with Lazarus."

[Judica me]

If you don't think that John Paul II was John Paul the Great, no one is going to make you recognize reality.

Why was he great?

[Judica me]

I'm thinking out loud here....Why would someone make statements on a public forum and ask others not to respond to them? Are they afraid of dialogue? Are they afraid of free speech? Are they afraid they can't back up their positions?

[The Iguana]

Any parish here that wants a Tridentine Mass can have one.

Maybe I'm thinking of someone else here, but I thought you lived in Grahmman's diocese.

[AnAmericanMother]

Probably a third of our communicants receive on the tongue. As far as risk of sacrilege, the only problem I've seen was when an altar boy dropped the paten . . . of course the priest took immediate action to rescue the Body . . . and the deacon had a word with the boy afterwards . . . < ouch >

We ex-Episcopalians do not take hold of the Host with our other hand anyhow, but bow our heads to the hand and pick up the Host on the tongue - so the chance of dropping the Body is about zero. There probably is some risk of spillage from the cup, but most of our communicants don't receive in both kinds.

Since our parish has five services on Sunday and a Vigil Mass on Saturday, there's room for altar girls (not to mention a crying need for as many altar servers as we can find) without denying any boy the opportunity to serve. The girls do tend to drop out because the deacon-in-charge runs the altar servers program as a hemi-semi-demi-paramilitary organization (which strikes me as combining the wisdom of the serpent with the harmlessness of the dove). My daughter is from a military family, so it doesn't bother her a bit. And she understands perfectly the nature of the priesthood and her presence as an assistant rather than somebody with a vocation in mind.

Given the sheer number of communicants at any given service, Eucharistic ministers are almost unavoidable (especially for us choir folks way up in the back of the balcony).

[Wonder Warthog]

"Latin is the language of the Roman Catholic Church. It is fixed and stable, just as is its dogma--just as its liturgy used to be."

Still wrong. The only place Latin is the "language of the Roman Catholic Church" is in the church ADMINISTRATION. Last time I looked, the Church incuded ALL those baptized and confirmed into it, and not just the priesthood.

There is nothing magic about Latin. The only reason it is used as it is is simply tradition---nothing more, nothing less. It wasn't even the first language of the church.

Your "Latin uber alles" notions are simply wishful thinking on your part.

[Mershon]

There is no "administration" in the Catholic Church. Latin is the official language of the entire Church.

Only 10 percent or less of all documents in the Vatican archives have been translated from the Latin original.

Latin is a sacred language. Latin breeds unity. The Church was growing exponentially when the sacraments were given in Latin.

There were more than twice the number of conversions in the early 1960s.

Don't know what your hang-up is, but what is the official language of your "non-Catholic" church you attend? How are the conversions going worldwide in your denomination?

Sola fide. Sola Scriptura. LOL!